1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. Greetings Guest!!

    In order to combat SPAM on the forums, all users are required to have a minimum of 2 posts before they can submit links in any post or thread.

    Dismiss Notice

R/P Question -How can there be 2 Kings?. One must step aside.

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Bobar, Sep 27, 2014.

  1. Bobar

    Bobar Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    May 20, 2004
    Messages:
    2,043
    Likes Received:
    577
    What interests me is how can you have 2 Kings?. As this land does not have a Constitution we must therefore be an Absolute Monarchy. With an Absolute Monarchy the King holds all power and his word is law. By this very description you can NOT HAVE 2 Kings. It is all very well resurrecting Lord British but in doing so, as he did not abdicate, HE IS STILL KING.

    King Blackthorn ascended the throne with everyone believing that Lord British was dead. As it seems he is not Blackthorn's crowning is null and void?.

    To be realistic in a role playing situation having 2 Kings is an impossible position and in a worst case scenario it could lead to civil war. The devs need to get one or the other to abdicate or arrange the quick demise of one. There has been no attempt so far to explain the constitutional question of 2 Kings but some resolution is required.
     
  2. Kaneda Ibashi

    Kaneda Ibashi Adventurer
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    May 12, 2008
    Messages:
    87
    Likes Received:
    29
    I'd like a civil war.
    let the towns side with one or the other.
    The possibilities are endless.
    However I doubt the Dev team has such grandiose schemes.
     
    Vor likes this.
  3. Vor

    Vor Grand Inquisitor
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2003
    Messages:
    4,180
    Likes Received:
    875
    Yeah, a civil war story could be pretty epic, if they do it correctly.
     
  4. Capt. Lucky

    Capt. Lucky Babbling Loonie

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2014
    Messages:
    2,975
    Likes Received:
    2,454
    Blackthorn is king as Lord British departed and stepped aside. At the recent meeting he didn't appear upset that he was no longer king nor did he seem inclined to regain the title. He said something about king being only a title or something. It didn't seem to bother him and he was referred to as Lord British by everyone.
     
  5. Captn Norrington

    Captn Norrington Trade Forum Administrator
    Moderator Professional Campaign Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2012
    Messages:
    10,683
    Likes Received:
    8,766
    He said "King is just a meaningless title, my people are still here and loyal" or something like that I think.
     
    Aurelius and Flagg like this.
  6. Nephilim

    Nephilim Adventurer

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2014
    Messages:
    59
    Likes Received:
    21
    I think it is allowing for a great story line in regards to the new VvV. Civil war would be an awesome thing. Getting towns involved to pledge their allegiance would not only increase turnout on voting to make sure their Governor was pledge to the side they want, there could also be great city battles.
     
  7. Aurelius

    Aurelius Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2004
    Messages:
    2,756
    Likes Received:
    689
    I suspect the 'war' will only be British/Blackthorn as Virtue against Minax/Anon as 'Vice' but I know which King I follow and it isn't the new one .... ;)
     
  8. G.v.P

    G.v.P Stratics Legend
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2004
    Messages:
    9,644
    Likes Received:
    831
    All this King talk, what about Queen Zhah? Or more importantly, in my opinion, Queen Minax? :heart: (dat KDA)
     
  9. old gypsy

    old gypsy Grand Poobah
    Professional Stratics Veteran Campaign Patron PITMUCK

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2010
    Messages:
    5,834
    Likes Received:
    5,272
    I'd like to see this develop further -- not only British vs. Blackthorn, but a third sector demanding the end of monarchy (and implementing full independence for all city-states).
     
  10. Petra Fyde

    Petra Fyde Peerless Chatterbox
    Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2001
    Messages:
    30,882
    Likes Received:
    5,165
    Kings may come and Lords may go, but I think I'll continue to follow the Dark OverLady
     
  11. Viquire

    Viquire Crazed Zealot
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2008
    Messages:
    3,456
    Likes Received:
    507
    And so, reading this thread, factions was reborn, in a way, because the Dev team killed it. I love sandbox games. :)
     
  12. Promathia

    Promathia EM Bennu Fanclub
    Premium Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2009
    Messages:
    3,425
    Likes Received:
    2,114
    Taken from UOGuide:
    "Lord British vanished from the realm, for reasons that were never disclosed. In his place, the Council ruled"

    This was the first time, as he had left OSI.

    His character was later brought back shortly for this storyline:

    "Lord British's return was designed to be, and was, temporary. Lord British eventually left, again, to take a powerful artifact (said to be shards of the Gem of Immortality that powered Mondain) into the Ethereal Void, which would secure it beyond permanently Minax's grasp.

    Some weeks before his departure, Lord British held a memorial service for Blackthorn, wherein British stated, among other things, that he was abandoning his goal of unifying the Shards under the Virtues. "

    Remember, merging of the Shards would have destroyed every new world created, and all new life that had diverged from Sosaria Prime.

    So British hasn't been "King" in quite some time. Our ruling body has gone like this King British -> Council ->Council's Murder/King Casca -> Queen Dawn/Dawns Murder-> No leaders -> King Blackthorn


    The only fiction we should be going off of with British's return, is what is posted on uo.com. The stuff on TC1 wasn't very correct in lore, and I doubt he had been keeping up with UO fiction over the years (There were some noticeable occasions of this: His claim of Minax being back from the dead - Minax died in Ultima II, but UO diverges at Ultima I. In our timeline, Minax has never died. He also claimed to not know who Anon was, when technically lorewise, he probably should have.)
     
  13. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
    Reporter Professional Governor Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend Campaign Supporter Royal Knight

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2000
    Messages:
    18,957
    Likes Received:
    5,447
    Willa of the Yew-wood would put her loyalty in Lord British... Since he is a very virtuous man... he is the King she remembers watching leave the Kingdom. She recalls watching him and gathering to help him on many occasions. As for Blackthorn he's filled some rather big shoes but British is and always will be the "True" King to many.

    Now Malag is more torn.... he was a man of Chaos... part of him still is in a way... and he has served Blackthorn loyally. He hasn't seen any reason to doubt the mans integrity... or loyalty to the people... And British did "abandon" his people. Whatever his excuse was and left the people in "chaos" without a solid leadership. Leaving the Kingdom to be twisted by Casca and then suffer with the loss of Queen Dawn... He'd be hard pressed to choose between the two men. But he would go with whomever the High Council saw fit to stand behind as they are the voice of the realm and he does serve the Council. As the Minister of Virtue he'd find it difficult not to side with British though. But he has no desire to see the "Kingdom" restored either literally killing thousands of peoples. He and his brother would be immune as they were alive before the shattering.... it would be very difficult though to lose so many friends. One would hope the King would give up the idea of reuniting the shards. Especially given that the Gem of Immortality was so very corrupted by Mondain. That course just doesn't make logical sense.

    As for most of the rest of my characters many wouldn't have much of an opinion except perhaps Rylna who would revel in the Chaos of having 2 Kings and splitting the Kingdom... she would follow Minax to whatever end and support her completely but then try to "rule" over her... as evil does... Rylna being rather devilish would enjoy a battle between the kings and would infact.... probably attempt to lay seeds of war in peoples minds to attempt to get them to fight over it.... the more death and mayhem she could produce the happier it would make her. So planting seeds of doubt and uncertainty and trying to pit one King against the other in the minds of the Citizens of Britannia would be something she would certainly attempt to do.
     
  14. Promathia

    Promathia EM Bennu Fanclub
    Premium Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2009
    Messages:
    3,425
    Likes Received:
    2,114
    Thats not quite true. The leadership was left in the hands of a Royal Council. The only reason Casca came to power was due to their murder at the hands of servants of the Shadowlords.
     
  15. Lord Taliesin

    Lord Taliesin Seasoned Veteran

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2014
    Messages:
    373
    Likes Received:
    275
    If I recall correctly Lord British left Britannia with the Shards of the Gem of Immortality to keep them out of the hands of the Shadowlords. I doubt he's back for good, it seems that he just popped in to say hello. I'm very pleased that there's storyline being provided for VvV!

    Speaking of the Shadowlords, it's been bothering me that there just happens to be a Shadowlord, one of the cosmic embodiments of evil, chillin' in a boat at the bottom of a lake like that's not a really big problem.
     
  16. Promathia

    Promathia EM Bennu Fanclub
    Premium Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2009
    Messages:
    3,425
    Likes Received:
    2,114

    Thats why you should go down there and kill it! :p
     
  17. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
    Reporter Professional Governor Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend Campaign Supporter Royal Knight

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2000
    Messages:
    18,957
    Likes Received:
    5,447
    No not quite true but... that is how many folk saw it. Depends on your point of view.
     
  18. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
    Reporter Professional Governor Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend Campaign Supporter Royal Knight

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2000
    Messages:
    18,957
    Likes Received:
    5,447
    If only it would stay dead...
     
  19. Bobar

    Bobar Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    May 20, 2004
    Messages:
    2,043
    Likes Received:
    577
    Well I seem to have started a thread which is diversifying as it lengthens. However, in my opinion the premise I have stated holds true. If you are crowned King, unless you formally abdicate, you are King until you die. A King cannot just say 'I do not want to be King any longer' it HAS to be official. It has been said in this thread that Lord British left for various reasons and if this were so the same applies, if he were alive, he WAS and IS still KING. Showing no interest in being King, as has been said, also makes no difference he IS the lawful and anointed King until such time as he were to formally abdicate, even then there would be some doubt over the legality of Blackthorn's kingship.

    Further to this, if Blackthorn was crowned King and it was not known for certain that Lord British was dead, surely that makes that crowning illegal? It all comes back to the same thing in an Absolute Monarchy it is NOT possible to have 2 Kings.

    I await with interest the next story-line, I wonder if this will be addressed.
     
  20. whiterabbit

    whiterabbit Stratics Legend
    Professional Premium Stratics Veteran Supporter Stratics Legend Campaign Supporter PITMUCK

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2003
    Messages:
    7,748
    Likes Received:
    3,125
    goblins nos needs effer king
    wee bees free
     
    old gypsy likes this.
  21. Promathia

    Promathia EM Bennu Fanclub
    Premium Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2009
    Messages:
    3,425
    Likes Received:
    2,114
    British abdicated, the Royal Council made it official - He left, the Council ruled in place of a King until they were murdered.

    UO isnt real life. The rules aren't the same, nor is the political structure.


    Remember, British isnt royalty. He came from Earth to Sosaria, "earned" the title Of King of Akalabeth. He wasn't born into it, he earned it from his fights against Mondain ect.

    One can assume there were leaders/kings before him. How the political structure worked is anyone's guess. I see no reason to think he cant abdicate his title + crown, or for behind the scenes the Royal Council being able to make it official.
     
    #21 Promathia, Sep 27, 2014
    Last edited: Sep 27, 2014
  22. whiterabbit

    whiterabbit Stratics Legend
    Professional Premium Stratics Veteran Supporter Stratics Legend Campaign Supporter PITMUCK

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2003
    Messages:
    7,748
    Likes Received:
    3,125
    OZOG BEEES KING !!!
     
    old gypsy likes this.
  23. Capt. Lucky

    Capt. Lucky Babbling Loonie

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2014
    Messages:
    2,975
    Likes Received:
    2,454
    There's no Lord British towel, all I'm sayin'
     
    Flagg likes this.
  24. BrianFreud

    BrianFreud Lead Wiki Mod & Doer of Crazy Things
    Professional Wiki Editor Wiki Moderator Campaign Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2013
    Messages:
    7,069
    Likes Received:
    2,899
    It's possible that Lord British learned of the events of Ultima II (possibly II through VIII) while in the ethereal void, especially as time passes differently on that plane. I'm pretty sure the ethereal void was outside of the shards, as well, existing only in one instance. Lore-wise, we could then assume that Lord British (in recent UO events) did know of Minax's death (from Ultima II) , though we (within only what is known to us who've stayed on the shards) do not. That could allow the lore of UO to move forward to incorporate events from Ultima II+, even if only known to us via Lord British's word.

    "In generations past, the features of the ethereal void were known to its travelers as the shapes inside one's house. In the bosom of ether could be found a spiritual weightlessness that cleansed the mind of its many and tiny woes. The assumptions of our world sag outward in the void to link the past with the distant, to connect OldSosaria with the worlds of tomorrow. In the void, one travels as if by thought, yet sees neither friend nor foe. For the uninitiated, a journey through the void can change one's view of life itself."​
     
    EM_Bennu, Bobar and whiterabbit like this.
  25. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    May 12, 2008
    Messages:
    6,641
    Likes Received:
    1,163
    Nothing I've seen thus far tells me that we have two rulers. Rather it seems clear from what I've seen that we still have King Blackthorn, that Lord British is an abdicated king who's visiting, and that the "2 kings" thing doesn't mean two ruling kings but, rather, that there's 2 folks who've had that title (one past, one present), hanging out together.

    The TC1 appearance made it plain that British has, in effect, endorsed King Blackthorn. having said that, they could always suddenly retcon things. But a retcon is all it'd be. Based on what we've seen we have only one ruling King at the moment, and that's Blackthorn.

    -Galen's player
     
    EM_Bennu likes this.
  26. Jirel of Joiry

    Jirel of Joiry Certifiable
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2004
    Messages:
    1,570
    Likes Received:
    504
    Perhaps Lord British is like King Arthur. Lemme see if I remember how it goes; its been a while since I read "The Once and Future King". King Arthur did not die but was spirited away to the Isle of Avalon to be healed of his wounds. When his people need him the most then shall Arthur return to rule as King and Camelot be restored. Did I remember it right? Perhaps its like that. We do not need Lord British enough yet for his return. I don't know, I rather like thinking of him like King Arthur. I'll shut up my babbling now. :tongue:
     
    EM_Bennu and old gypsy like this.
  27. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    May 12, 2008
    Messages:
    6,641
    Likes Received:
    1,163
    It depends upon the version you read, like most legends do.

    Some have it as a resurrection of sorts, with the analogy to Jesus probably deliberate.

    Some have it as reincarnation.

    Some that he didn't really die but was taken away at the moment of death to await the time of his return.

    I forget which one was in Malory, and Malory usually is taken as the definitive version of the story....And the one that most likely is the source for the upcoming six movie series by Guy Ritchie.

    As to Lord British: They were clear that the 2nd time he left he left to guard an artifact in the Ethereal Void from Minax. This is a dumb rationale. And now the new fiction seems to suggest he just retired at some point and is doing things analogous to those that his player/creator have done.

    Which is fine to me. Just leave him there.

    -Galen's player
     
  28. Alex"Drake Iron Heart"CS

    Governor

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2014
    Messages:
    722
    Likes Received:
    254
    Well my take on the story was or what I thought it meant, is that Mondain the Evil sorcerer, created the Gem of Inmortality, and King British came and killed him and entered one of the shattered bits of the Gem, which in the beginning title movie to the game says its our world Sosaria/Britannia........
    If not, who is the brave warrior who killed Mondain??? If its wasn't Lord British, why you all giving him soo much attention, credit and titles if he didn't do nothing, and just went and picked up the pieces..... ( So he auto proclaimed himself King, he wasn't chosen? That sounds more of a dictatorship that anything...) Obviously you cannot make this rational or straightforward as RL rules don't come into place in this game....

    By what I have read, British never abdicated, he just escaped with the pieces to keep them safe from someone, that being Mondain, or his missus Minax??? But didn't he just leave just before the Shadowlords arrived??? I find that quite good timing on his side don't you think???


    King British in theory should be a god more than a King if he created the world...... Blackthorn attacked British at Blackthorns Revenge, and we say he was under the mechanical powers of the Exodus and know he is our king as he was released from the powers. Never in my life have a heart of someone being named king after attacking a realm??? and was he elected or did he auto proclaimed himself too?
    The storyline has to be re-written and put into order for it all to make sense and there's parts that will deviate from the global story arc also, as a story cannot be told for 17 years without a change her or there.

    I cannot comment on Casca or Dawn, as I was not present at their rulings or know about their stories in enough depth to be able to comment into a storyline fact, But seems, that there's been more King and Queens than the number of hot showers that Drake has had......
     
    Bobar likes this.
  29. Capt. Lucky

    Capt. Lucky Babbling Loonie

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2014
    Messages:
    2,975
    Likes Received:
    2,454
    And the shard he entered into was Test Center? That's a bit of tough luck ;)
     
    Kolka likes this.
  30. Kolka

    Kolka Babbling Loonie
    Professional Campaign Patron

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2013
    Messages:
    2,403
    Likes Received:
    3,095
    He may have gone to Balhae first, only no one noticed.
     
  31. old gypsy

    old gypsy Grand Poobah
    Professional Stratics Veteran Campaign Patron PITMUCK

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2010
    Messages:
    5,834
    Likes Received:
    5,272
    One of my favorite books.

    However, Lord British is evidently aware that he is no King Arthur. It was a lovely dream, though. *sigh*
     
    Capt. Lucky likes this.
  32. Captn Norrington

    Captn Norrington Trade Forum Administrator
    Moderator Professional Campaign Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2012
    Messages:
    10,683
    Likes Received:
    8,766
    We should settle this fairly, kick them both out and make Lord Dupre king! if he isn't qualified who is? he watched Lord British rule for 20+ years in the original ultima series, and has watched Blackthorn rule for about 3 years in UO. Dupre for King!! *begins putting up campaign advertisements*
     
    Capt. Lucky and Bobar like this.
  33. Dot_Warner

    Dot_Warner Babbling Loonie
    Governor Stratics Veteran Britain [BRIT]

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2010
    Messages:
    2,390
    Likes Received:
    3,198
    The Stranger, who came to Sosaria from Earth, is who killed Mondain. After slaying Minax and Exodus, he then went on to become the embodiment of Lord British's Virtues, the Avatar. (The last part never happened in UO.)

    Lord British, in the original Ultima history, only supported the Stranger's quest but didn't participate directly. He did unite the majority of what was left of the area around a single Sosarian continent into Britannia, but this is where the UO timeline is rather wonky. (There used to be four continents, five if you count Ambrosia, that made up Sosaria. The missing continents are the other facets, except Ter Mur...but that could be its own thread...)

    UO's Lord British was a bit more hands on, but still rather standoffish.
     
  34. Nexus

    Nexus Site Support
    Administrator Professional Wiki Moderator Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend Campaign Patron

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2006
    Messages:
    5,570
    Likes Received:
    1,835
    Someone has been reading Hobbes again. Do you really want someone who has represented and supported the ideology of Chaos as your Leviathan?

    Chaos would put every citizen of Britannia in a state of constant war with every other citizen as the life of civilized man is based on Ordered principles. So with that in mind I'll leave this with a quote by Thomas Hobbes...

     
    Captn Norrington likes this.
  35. Promathia

    Promathia EM Bennu Fanclub
    Premium Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2009
    Messages:
    3,425
    Likes Received:
    2,114
    (Just to clarify for others)

    Nothing after the gem shattering happened in UO the same way. UO's timeline deviates from Ultima right after the Gem is shattered and the alternate versions of Sosaria are created.

    Similar events have happened, but they are different than the Sosaria Prime timeline.

    For example: UO should have dwarves and bobbits still, as the cataclysm in Ultima III never happens in the UO timeline. Minax hasn't been killed, Exodus was killed much later/different, same with the Shadowlords, ect ect
     
    #35 Promathia, Sep 29, 2014
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2014
  36. Promathia

    Promathia EM Bennu Fanclub
    Premium Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2009
    Messages:
    3,425
    Likes Received:
    2,114
    There is quite a bit factually wrong with what you have posted.

    There were Kings before British.
    British came from Earth, helped fight Mondain's forces, and is the reason they were beat back from the kingdom of Akalabeth. British rose to power due to his heroic deeds. Mondain was defeated + slain by The Stranger aka the Avatar (Who also came from Earth).

    British did not create the world.

    The events in LBR were not the real Blackthorn, nor was he "under control". Blackthorn went to fight Exodus himself, was captured, and Exodus created a Mechanical "Clone" of Blackthorn to serve as his general. This fake Blackthorn's goal was to make Britannia an easier target for Exodus to take over (Of course, this was all a retcon). The original Blackthorn wasn't a bad guy, thus there has never been a reason to think our King Blackthorn is "evil" in any way.
     
  37. Captn Norrington

    Captn Norrington Trade Forum Administrator
    Moderator Professional Campaign Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2012
    Messages:
    10,683
    Likes Received:
    8,766
    In Ultima 9 Blackthorn helped the Guardian take over all the cities, enslave all the companions and destroy Skara Brae completely. He was then killed by Lord British in the abyss.

    Since he was evil in that timeline, he could become evil in all other timelines to.
     
  38. Promathia

    Promathia EM Bennu Fanclub
    Premium Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2009
    Messages:
    3,425
    Likes Received:
    2,114
    He was also Evil in Ultima V. He was corrupted by the Shadowlords, and later exiled. One can say the specific events leading up to Ultima V, caused him to be corrupted easier, and that corruption + exile is what lead him to easily be swayed by the Guardian.
     
    Captn Norrington likes this.
  39. Promathia

    Promathia EM Bennu Fanclub
    Premium Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2009
    Messages:
    3,425
    Likes Received:
    2,114
    ....lol I dont know if this will help anyone...But I made this to illustrate some things:

    [​IMG]
     
    EM_Bennu and Captn Norrington like this.
  40. Aurelius

    Aurelius Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2004
    Messages:
    2,756
    Likes Received:
    689
    But within UO, rather than fall back to the standalone Ultimas, I'm sticking to the idea that we only accepted councils, and a new king, because we thought British was not coming back. Now, if he's back, the justification for the others fails - the original and rightful one takes precedence.
     
  41. Dot_Warner

    Dot_Warner Babbling Loonie
    Governor Stratics Veteran Britain [BRIT]

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2010
    Messages:
    2,390
    Likes Received:
    3,198
    The Avatar killed Blackthorn in Ultima IX, not Lord British. LB moved the moons to make the Shrine of Spirituality accessible...that's about it :p
     
  42. TandaBSK

    TandaBSK Seasoned Veteran
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    May 16, 2008
    Messages:
    320
    Likes Received:
    121
    Wow! what a great thread, reminds me of the good old days everyone in spirited debate over which path is correct. Having never played any of the pre online ultima games I have only what I read as background. It seems to me at least as far as Great Lakes is concerned King Blackthorn has shown himself to be a welcomed leader by many, helped to heal the wounds of Casca, the Royal Council, the tragic loss of Queen Dawn. I personally have always tried to find the "balance" between the two. Order vs Chaos is not Good vs Evil, Nor are the Virtues the only path for in their purity and in the hands of a zealot they are destructive as well. Having King Blackthorn's friend, Lord British back to me seem a quite logical balance in the defense of the realm against any who would seek to destroy or enslave it. All leaders need that sounding board that helps them maintain sanity.
     
  43. Dot_Warner

    Dot_Warner Babbling Loonie
    Governor Stratics Veteran Britain [BRIT]

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2010
    Messages:
    2,390
    Likes Received:
    3,198
    Lord British is NOT back. He stopped by for a visit, that's all. Per the last story, LB has a wife and a child "out there," somewhere...presumably a sly reference to New Britannia. Think of him like a visiting relative who decided to "help" when he saw something wrong.
     
  44. Captn Norrington

    Captn Norrington Trade Forum Administrator
    Moderator Professional Campaign Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2012
    Messages:
    10,683
    Likes Received:
    8,766
    Link to a youtube video of someone playing that part of Ultima 9 :) It starts at 1:15



    The Avatar finds Lord British and Blackthorn argueing at the bottom of the Stygian Abyss, British says he has neglected his kingdom too long and wants to fight Blackthorn alone. He then creates a barrier locking the Avatar out of the area to prevent him from helping. British and Blackthorn fight with magic for a few minutes, then Blackthorn dies and British unlocks the barrier.
     
    Zuckuss likes this.
  45. Dodger

    Dodger Certifiable
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2008
    Messages:
    1,513
    Likes Received:
    569
    Two kings, it's like a game of chess, Garriot is white as he made the first move. Most of us a sacraficial pawns given up to bring the game to a quicker end.
     
  46. Captn Norrington

    Captn Norrington Trade Forum Administrator
    Moderator Professional Campaign Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2012
    Messages:
    10,683
    Likes Received:
    8,766
    I wish there were storylines and events about the rulers of other facets to, instead of just trammel, for example Ter'Mur Gargish Council events, or Tokuno Empress events.
     
  47. Dodger

    Dodger Certifiable
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2008
    Messages:
    1,513
    Likes Received:
    569
    I want to be able to assassinate a king. I won't say which one but how cool would it be to have an ultra rare weapon drop that damaged the king.
     
  48. Lore Denin (GL)

    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2008
    Messages:
    535
    Likes Received:
    303
    The Timelord, Lord British and the Order Guard's ultimate goal was to re-unite the worlds of the multiverse with the Prime World. Lord Blackthorn opposed this as it would end all life in the multiverse that did not have a corresponding "image" in the Prime World. Thus the Order/Chaos War began.....

    Lord British since that time has "changed" his mind and is not actively seeking to destroy the multiverse and thus it seems Blackthorn and he have come to terms.... Lord British is always clear to point out that he has the shards safely protected seeming to suggest that he is capable of merging the worlds when he decides its time..... Hopefully giving Blackthorn time to find a way to save the lives within the multiverse before Lord British acts... (which The Order believes MUST eventually happen to save the Prime Universe).

    The Balance Accord between the two philosphy buys us time to do it in a way that will save all worlds rather then picking one over the other(s).

    -Lore's Player
     
  49. Bobar

    Bobar Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    May 20, 2004
    Messages:
    2,043
    Likes Received:
    577
    Well this info is a new one on me but it does introduce another controversial theme. Two things are worthy of comment here -
    1. Lord British may not be back in our game, but he IS alive, therefore he is still King. For him not to be King he had to, or has to, abdicate and now to further complicate the issue it seems that -

    2. Lord British (the King) has a child, boy or girl it matters not. Even if he now abdicates that child is the legitimate heir, certainly it has precedence over Blackthorn. What is more Lord British cannot negate that claim. He cannot abdicate for it. I suppose if it is still young Blackthorn could act as Regent but he would not be King. At majority a new King or Queen would be entitled to ascend the throne.

    It is all very well building a story as you go along but this game has lore and some effort should be directed into at least making any new lines feasible within it. By having Lord British reappear they have made nonsense of one section of Sosarian lore.
     
  50. Dot_Warner

    Dot_Warner Babbling Loonie
    Governor Stratics Veteran Britain [BRIT]

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2010
    Messages:
    2,390
    Likes Received:
    3,198
    Weird, I have a memory of killing him myself... but then that could be a memory of a play through with the cheats turned on so I could see the unfinished areas :p That game was such a hot mess.
     
    drcossack and Captn Norrington like this.