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Remove Faction Artifacts

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Promathia, Oct 27, 2011.

  1. Promathia

    Promathia EM Bennu Fanclub
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    I know I'm going to be flamed but here goes my reasoning. I have played Factions for a long long time, and have realized that Faction Artifacts are hurting this game.

    Pros to Faction Artifacts:
    + A reward for faction participation
    + Makes it easier to get a suit to pvm/pvp in
    + Allows people to have characters on multiple shards for less money

    Cons to Faction Artifacts
    - Removes a large population from the market for real artifacts, hence lowering need/want to go do Doom/Peerless
    - Removed a large market from the Library/Museum Contributors.
    - Points are too easy to get/inbalanced (Hence making the artifacts FAR too easy to obtain. Having 2 billion points is just silly)
    - Too cheap (gathering silver is not hard/doesnt provide any kind of timesink/goldsink)
    - A cheap reward for factions/ doesnt promote need to capture towns or actually participate in anything "factions".
    - Takes away things to do in the game. Like it or not, having to get your artifacts, or earning gold to buy them gave people things to do in game. It promoted guilds to go to Doom or peerless runs, or integrated pvpers more into the pvm community

    Thank god Stygian Abyss artifacts werent integrated as new faction artifacts, or things would be even worse.

    I know not alot of people will agree with me. I mainly pvp, I enjoy factions, and if the system could be fixed I think it would continue to make pvp interesting. Draconi's faction system was a failure. Yes it increased faction activity, but it was for all the wrong reasons.

    Anyways, thats it for me. Just my thoughts on things
     
  2. Lynk

    Lynk Grand Poobah
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    There is a huge market for non-faction arties, since CREW and DC* refuse to play in factions, and even MM on Atlantic isn't in factions anymore.

    I disagree with your comment that you play factions, because it seems pretty clear to me that you don't.

    I'll wait for you to reply with some screenshot of an alt guy wearing a faction tag.

    thxbro
     
  3. KingHen

    KingHen Seasoned Veteran
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    I actually would be fine with this, even though I certainly take advantage of the artifacts. It has saved my two toons a fortune in suit building. That being said they are there for one purpose only, factions. So I am fine with how it is as well. Not those who join factions, never go to Fel, and use the level 1 gear to aid in there spawns so be it. They are missing out on a fun part of the game.

    I don't know the fix for this, but I can say I am fine either way. Figured I would let you off easy on the first reply. I hold no responsibility to the hell that is coming after my post though.

    :yell:
     
  4. Promathia

    Promathia EM Bennu Fanclub
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    I have been nonfactions for what? A week at most? The faction system is completely unbalanced/broken. Points are out of hand, theres no reason to cap towns, ect ect ect
     
  5. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Grand Poobah
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    Now this is funny. How many times do you see BLUE players in Luna Bank AFK wearing thier Faction Gear. EVERYDAY. LOL

    Totaly agree that it is out of control.
     
  6. Mirt

    Mirt Certifiable
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    Well due to the weak nature of pvp on any one shard at anyone time maybe it would be a good idea to keep them but just increase the price and lower them to the same level as the regular artifacts.
     
  7. red sky

    red sky Sage
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    That's the real issue, not the artifacts. Simply just place a hard cap of 200 points for any single player. Then bring in a tiered list of ways to obtain them. The double and triple points for cities is gone which is what caused this issue to begin with. Then make it to where you lose a set amount each week. Here ya go:

    Hard cap: 200 points

    *20 bonus points for capturing a city

    *15 bonus points for capturing someone who has stolen a sigil or has been passed a sigil (pking them while they have the sigil)

    *10 bonus points for pking an enemy faction in a base or town (this adds to the usual points that you'd gain and the faction enemy must have a minimal rank of 3 and can only be gained off of once a week to prevent farming of points)

    *5 bonus points for stealing a sigil and keeping it from returning to the enemy base for more than 30 minutes (gives a reason to steal sigils even if a large force is guarding towns and bases, sigil returns back to the base after those 30 minutes)

    Faction trap gets the 10 bonus rule because they should be used as a tactical advantage and not an easy way to rack bonus points.

    Players would be subject to losing 20 points a week as part of being in a faction. To equip the level 10 artifacts, you need 180 points and the point system updates immediately. No more waiting a day or until server down to wear your ornament or inquis.

    Also, maybe tweak some of the perks to owning a city. Maybe make faction mounts insta-bond upon feeding and only last for a week. Also, maybe bring back faction craftable gear that gets that factions color and is temporary blessed (2 weeks?) without any rank restriction. This gear can only be crafted in a a faction owned town. And if you really want to fire stuff up, maybe allow a bonus mod for each town. So if you craft the item in Jhelom as a faction item, it gets +10 fire resist as a mod for those 2 weeks, ect.

    That way there is a LEGIT reason to owning a town on a regular basis and keeping it under faction rule.

    Feedback?
     
  8. Cogniac

    Cogniac Grand Inquisitor
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    Random Idea:

    Step 1: Replace the artifacts in the Doom Gauntlet with these new randomly-generated, artifact-level items currently on Test Center (See: here).

    Step 2: Replace the current Faction Artifacts with the regular old Doom Gauntlet artifacts (sans property bonuses).

    Step 3: All the stuff that's already been said about the crazy Faction Points situation.
     
  9. Orgional Farimir

    Orgional Farimir Lore Keeper
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    I am ok with faction arties if the did 3 things.

    1) Let everyone in factions be attacked in EVERY facet. Factions is consentual PvP if you don't what a char to PvP don't put him in factions.

    2) Make capturing towns worth something. Having ore, reg, and bottle vendors mean nothing. No one cares about the "bragging rights" of controlling a city.

    3) Remove guard zones from faction cities. Leave the GZ in places like Cove, Delucia, Paupa, NuJelom, and so on. But if you are a red in factions you are screwed.
     
  10. red sky

    red sky Sage
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    Why do this? Doom is Doom for a reason. It's the birthplace of artifacts in this game. The artifacts from the new implementation are not the same thing. They have a different tag and are completely of a different nature.

    What's wrong with the current faction artifacts? They are meant to be more powerful for a reason.

    My post? Of which you left no feedback?
     
  11. red sky

    red sky Sage
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    I believe this thread was more geared towards repairing factions and not altering it into a whole new realm. I like your idea but let's take baby steps and fix the main problems before we do stuff like this.

    Reference-my post.

    Okay, they did this before but to be honest, it really doesn't have much of an effect on factions. It simply allows murderers to invade the cities. And yes, I've had many experiences with this when the guard zones didn't exist and yes I was in factions. Let's get back to what needs to be done to factions to create a fix and make factions a limitless PVP facet and not something you join to get some nice gear.
     
  12. aarons6

    aarons6 Certifiable
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    i dont believe this...

    i took my sampire and my tamer OUT of factions for the very opposite of these ideas..


    yes the suits were great.. but the fact that you cant be healed or resurected, the fact that you were FIRST to be attacked when doing a spawn, and the fact that NONE of the attackers were in factions made it so it was not worth being in factions.
     
  13. kelmo

    kelmo Old and in the way
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    Factions is totally broken.
     
  14. red sky

    red sky Sage
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    How goeth thee, enthusiastic factioneer?
     
  15. G.v.P

    G.v.P Stratics Legend
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    How would you do it though? Make it so no factions player can equip any faction item again, even LVL 1s? Then what...like a turn in or something? Faction Arty turn in?

    I agree something needs to be done to make factions better, but really, the only way to make factions better, imo, is to make factions central to this game. I thought the whole Bane situation would have been perfect. I know most PvPers don't like PvM and vice versa, but due to the limited amount of players in the game (versus other games), I really think there needs to be integration. And not lame **** like faction towns in trammel being invaded by npcs ;D. Sigh. It would be nice to have in-game politics and situations based on factions. I'll never forget the first time stormtrooper npcs in SWG walked up to me to check if I were a rebel. I'm a huge SW nerd, but still, I want to feel that way about UO factions one day.

    Basically, they need to bring back Minax. She was hot.
     
  16. Zosimus

    Zosimus Grand Inquisitor
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    Ah the days of Order and Chaos are sorely missed.

    Love those days and they were really simple. Pick a side and go fight :)

    Not sure why they could'nt bring that back or make a newer system.

    The devs in the VHOC had said there was a dark cloud over factions.
     
  17. Daelomin

    Daelomin Journeyman
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    Faction artifacts should go yes.

    The faction artifacts are too good, there normal version was powerful enough.

    They are being used by non factioneers, which makes it a flawed system.

    Faction rewards should not be item related in my opinion. Add more control to towns, town vendors etc. Bring in something worth fighting for... instead of powerful items as an incentive to join factions.
     
  18. aarons6

    aarons6 Certifiable
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    faction arties are not that great, if anything they are what the real arties should have been..

    most of the arties that are made better with factions are the ones they beefed up the resists..
     
  19. Readydood

    Readydood Guest

    Can we PLEASE just remove factions from the game and bring back Order/Chaos system with Doom and the Gauntlet there-in being a safe zone?

    After all, this is the reason Order/Chaos was removed anyways...
     
  20. Lynk

    Lynk Grand Poobah
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    Seriously, most people don't even use a lot of faction arties. You can do better with imbuing.

    The only exceptions are the orny, folded steel, and crimson.

    If you really want to cry and moan and get a change made, fine, convert faction arties to normal arty status and remove the bonuses.

    I don't want them removed though, or requirements to wear them to be jacked up. I play way to many characters on too many servers to deal with increased rank requirements and/or buying 12+ ornys/crimmy/folded steel to cover all the servers.

    I've already invested gold in transfer tokens and building suits around those pieces, it wouldn't be fair to the many other players who have done the same.
     
  21. Gorbs

    Gorbs Sage
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    I'm not necessarily against this, but how does it help factions? I don't think it would magically cause more people to participate. It would reduce the enrollment (which is not necessarily indicative of participation).
     
  22. Viquire

    Viquire Crazed Zealot
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    Looks to me like these items may become obsolete anyway. Let em stay until someone is courageous enough to tackle the system and give it meaning again and/or we are open minded enough to guide them through making a change tht is beneficial.

    I don't want to mess up my day by opening old wounds further. So, that's all.
     
  23. Readydood

    Readydood Guest

    Lynk is right. Most of the arties people don't even use, and only use them when gearing up an awkward template, or when their broke. If you can't afford or find a glad collar, and can make faction stormies work... more power to you. The resists are atrocious, but get the HCI job done.

    Besides all the cons to the faction artifacts that were previous mentioned by the OP, there is also the 20 minute timer after getting drilled by a competing faction, and the general issue of being a much more open target to people when in felucca. The second one really only applies to people like myself who are not gun-ho-non-stop-PVPers and rolling around in a good sized pvp/pk guild.

    So considering all the cons, I think they've earned their easier access to artifacts. But as far as trammel players just being faction for the goodies without the fel-ness of it all. There really should be something that keeps that in check.
     
  24. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Grand Poobah
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    It doesn't help Factions one bit, but it would take away the abuse by a lot of players that joined Factions just to get the gear.

    Abuse #1 Faction points were way too easy to get without any penalty.
    Abuse #2 Faction gear being worn outside of Fel rule set.
    Abuse #3 Faction gear being used to do spawns in Tram rule set.
    Abuse #4 Faction gear being used against non-Faction players in a Fel rule set.

    Faction gear should have been made to use in Factions only and the wearing of this gear should have been restricted to Fel only.
     
  25. Sadoul

    Sadoul Guest

    The moment we had to PVM for hours and hours to get items in order to PVP it was a step in the wrong direction. I miss running around in "newbied" armor with a force spear (unless you really made me mad and I broke out the Ghoul's Touch). I won't :bdh: since that era is over and done.

    The easy answer to faction artifact abuse is to make factions apply to all facets, like Order and Chaos or guild warfare. You won't see any blue faction banksitters that way. It is also a safe way to expose non-pvpers to pvp. A lot of people are warned to stay out of Fel the moment they arrive in Haven and never step foot in it. Hopefully a few people see a good faction fight at Luna bank and decide to try it out.

    You shouldn't limit faction rewards because it decreases the number of people in Doom. If you want to do dungeon runs, join a guild. That's just my opinion.
     
  26. Readydood

    Readydood Guest

    You know that you can't just say "remember the good old days... but let's not talk about it" and then have no one talk about. You've condemned this thread to pre-pub 16 and pre-aos rants now!