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Rendered Graphics UO???

Discussion in 'UO Siege Perilous' started by ApollyonSP, Jan 20, 2015.

  1. ApollyonSP

    ApollyonSP Seasoned Veteran

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    [​IMG]

    Sometimes I see these images online of UO except with rendered, superior graphics.

    Does anybody know about this??? I bet that if UO actually had this then many more new players would join. It looks absolutely awesome!
     
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  2. DJAd

    DJAd Stratics Legend
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  3. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    Problem was it had more bugs than game content


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  4. ApollyonSP

    ApollyonSP Seasoned Veteran

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    It looks beautiful and it's shameful that UO developers don't focus on a project like this, improving graphics and lighting effects.

    The game could easily get tons more subscribers. I mean, what the hell do the monthly subscriptions and Origin purchase profits go into???

    It seems like $0 goes back into ultima online.....?
     
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  5. ApollyonSP

    ApollyonSP Seasoned Veteran

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    LOOK AT THIS!!!

    3d Version of UO

    [​IMG]
     
  6. kelmo

    kelmo Old and in the way
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    It is the players you are fighting. Just saying.
     
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  7. ApollyonSP

    ApollyonSP Seasoned Veteran

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    No, by making these types of changes, ultima online would easily double, triple, or quadruple the player base.

    You and many others are regressive and against progress. You people need to embrace change rather than hold onto dead, unchanging things. I'm convinced that many people, especially veteran players, would rather sink the ship rather than hand it over to new captains and leaders who actually know what they're doing, and are many more times skilled.
     
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  8. WhiteWitch

    WhiteWitch Journeyman

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    I once saw a video of that true 3d UO client and remember wishing that EA would just hire that team.
     
  9. ApollyonSP

    ApollyonSP Seasoned Veteran

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    I'm convinced that UO dev team is lead by severely ********, lazy, and or old people.

    Or there simply is not a dev team, and absolutely $0 is going into the game.

    Basically it's an empty vessel. Only the players actually care about this game.


    Whoever owns rights to UO should hire me as lead developer. I want a 75k year salary starter though. I don't work for free.
     
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  10. WhiteWitch

    WhiteWitch Journeyman

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    They got themselves into a mess with clients really, they released Third dawn with Ilsh locked out for 2d players, the idea being that this will make all the 2d players change to the third dawn client and allow them to retire the 2d one, I read somewhere that they had a plan that when the percentage of 2d users dropped to a certain level they would then discontinue that client, of course this didn't happen and they ended up opening Ilsh to 2d and saddling themselves with having to update 2 clients ever since.

    I started playing UO at Third Dawn so never used 2d, but I found myself envying the 2d users a bit because EA felt completely free to constantly butcher and mess up the client I used, changing it to LBR,then KR, then EC, all of which came with a world of bugs and changes I hated, I still hate the character models in EC, they are way worse than the very well motion capture animated ones in third dawn.
     
  11. Lady Michelle

    Lady Michelle Sprite Full SP
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    Question that really needs to be asked is why time is being wasted on the enhanced client with 2d graphics trying to bring the 2d player base over? 2d ain't coming to the enhanced client. So they really need to stop making the enhanced client for 2d players, and start making it to bring in new players.
    It's not the 2d players holding things up, it's the ones trying to get 2d players to the enhanced client.
     
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  12. Lord Gandalf

    Lord Gandalf Babbling Loonie
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    This game is a complete robbery, shouting for a revamp! If u can do it hire someone who can do it and put our money where its supposed to be!
     
  13. WhiteWitch

    WhiteWitch Journeyman

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    Actually there are limitations imposed because it would make the game unfair for 2d players, an example is the view distance in the EC, with zoom out the EC is capable of seeing mobs or other players further away than the 2d client, but this was intentionally then limited to stop this being an advantage to EC players, so now although you can see more scenery with the EC, you can only see mobs/players there once you get as close as you would need to in 2d.

    I don't have a lot of time right now but I bet if I go searching I can find a lot of threads of 2d players moaning about things in the EC that are unfair on them being 2d players, so in a way they are contributing to holding back a very advanced client for UO, I saw one yesterday moaning about an option which will prevent target loss.
     
  14. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    Let us alter art files in EC and a lot of people would jump ship.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
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  15. TheScoundrelRico

    TheScoundrelRico Stratics Legend
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    Love that client. I saw that a few weeks ago on a non Origin sanctioned site. Can you imagine if they re-released the game with those graphics and free to play on Steam?

    Talk about a resurgence of a 17 year old game. Just imagine the former players who would return and how many new players would join? UO has never had an issue with content...it's only downfall has been it's graphics...la
     
  16. Lady Michelle

    Lady Michelle Sprite Full SP
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    I see those threads myself, and I have to think to myself how do they know this unless they use the enhanced client. These players want the old client, but want it souped up like the enhanced client.Never gonna happen, if it was gonna happen would of been done long ago. Players need to realize life is never fair, if they want the new things they need to move to the enhanced client.
     
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  17. ApollyonSP

    ApollyonSP Seasoned Veteran

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    When I'm lead DEV for UO then I'll force everybody over to a 2d client for slower, older computers, and a 3d client for newer, faster computers.

    Let's have the best of both worlds. People love choices.
     
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  18. Lord Gandalf

    Lord Gandalf Babbling Loonie
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    DEV team will only feel involved when UO players start moving ships over "shroud of the avatar" or "shards online" at official releases
     
  19. DJAd

    DJAd Stratics Legend
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    Shards does look pretty dam sweet so far.
     
  20. Kattasrophe

    Nothing But Trouble

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    I kinda like the way we have it now... I mean if it was to change that much it wouldn't be the same kinda like the unicorns in game.. my mom told me they used to be really beautiful but then they changed. What about Haven? I have always wanted to see what that was like but then something happened (A war maybe?) and then it was gone.. sometimes things just need to be left be ;p and just like a saying says you will never know what you have until it's gone.
     
  21. Spiffykeen

    Spiffykeen Seasoned Veteran
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    Actually, prodo blew up Haven. If you wanna see what it looked like, go to Ocllo! It was pretty much a carbon copy, except they changed who was where, and added a fancier mage shop I think... It's been awhile... but, like I said... oh.... no smiley that blows up... that's kinda lame...
     
  22. Dermott of LS

    Dermott of LS UOEC Modder
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    ...

    This is one of the original teaser/concept images for what would be the Kingdom Reborn client. This was when the original concept was to remove the tile-based aspect from the game and have SA content be KR-required. The end result was quite different.

    Not sure about what project the 3d one is, but I remember Iris and while still shots looked good, the animation/movement was HORRID. Also looks like the 3d version is using the 3d client models from the look of the character on the horse and the timber wolf.
     
  23. Tyrath

    Tyrath Babbling Loonie
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    I actually liked old Haven and the quest, always spent time there on prodo hanging around the haven moongate training up on corpsers and lizard men and getting the guards out of the moongate guard zone and whacking them for their green armor......
     
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  24. Captn Norrington

    Captn Norrington Trade Forum Administrator
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    Personally I enjoyed exploring the forest area that was through a dark brown wooden guard tower on the southwest side. I would imagine I was a paladin on a quest to invade the orc forts that were inside it, then would become friends with the two local forest ostards that lived there (one green and one blue). After my quest was complete I would confidently exit and fight my way through the hordes of lizardmen to return to the paladin castle and inform the lead paladin that my quest was complete.

    I also frequently raised an army of patchwork skeletons from the corpses of slain lizardmen with my necromancer and had them invade the town. On the way to the town I would assassinate any nobles or seekers of adventure who crossed my path, then steal their clothes and gold to disguise myself as one of the citizens while secretly plotting my invasion of patchwork skeletons.

    After a day full of adventuring, I would return to the courtyard between Paladin Castle and the bank to chat with friends, assist new players, and enjoy being in the greatest game ever created.

    As you can see, I spent way too much time in Old Haven back then lol. I truly miss it....new haven just isn't the same. I have no screenshots at all from old haven, but spent so much time there the entire city is pretty much burned into my memory.

    *walks off into the distance, mourning the loss of a wonderful city, and cherishing the happy memories it brought me*.
     
  25. Uvtha

    Uvtha Grand Poobah
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    It did. No one cared.
     
  26. ApollyonSP

    ApollyonSP Seasoned Veteran

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    Lots of people care
     
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  27. Uvtha

    Uvtha Grand Poobah
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    CarED. We already had these graphics, they didn't last long.

    Clearly you weren't around when KR (those graphics) came out. The reaction among players was generally negative, and the reaction of non players was "lol uo still exists?" And that was nearly 10 years ago now.
     
  28. ApollyonSP

    ApollyonSP Seasoned Veteran

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    Times have changed, and the "dev diary" development video mentioned that ultima online is going to go to Steam eventually. When that happens, the game needs a revamp to appeal to more players. Rendered graphics would be one positive step among many

    Democracy has already failed ultima online multiple times. If democracy worked, then tons of people would still be playing the game. That's not the case, proving that the majority of players sometimes don't know what's best, at all. Some things should not be voted on.

    If the developers were smart then they would release rendered graphics as a game client, able to be purchased at a price, with an updated user interface as well. Options and choices are best.
     
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  29. Kael

    Kael Certifiable
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    I recall old Haven on Atlantic before AOS. It was a bloody busy spot. Back then homes on Atlantic were expensive as hell and most new players did not possess one. Hell, my whole guild lived out of Haven bank and a small tower lol Some of my fav times in the game was chilling at that bank watching the drama unfold.
     
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  30. Uvtha

    Uvtha Grand Poobah
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    Well like I said, they actually DID do that, with the very graphics you bet would draw in a bunch of new players. They didn't draw in anyone, and most who were already playing didn't like them either, thus they were gotten rid of. To be fair the item art was pretty horrendous, and the world art wasn't so great either. Even the most successful area of the new art (mobiles) was pretty hit and miss.

    What are you on about? Were things EVER voted on? I must have missed the day they formally asked for our input.

    You seem to not have a grasp of the time and resources that would be required to do yet another graphical overhaul. You can't just poop one out in a week, and toss it on the store...
    Honestly, new, actually good graphics would be delightful, but I really doubt it would accomplish that much. UO is a nearly 20 year old game. That's just a fact. It's not good or bad, it just is. It's a niche game and no matter the amount of frills you apply to it, it's never going to be anything else. It's NOT a modern game in any sense of the word, and that is simply what most people are looking for. There's not some magic formula to turn UO into wow. It just isn't a possibility, and that's fine.

    Bottom line they already implemented two graphics overhauls (one of which was the one you posted a pic of), both of which took a lot of time and money, and both of which flopped, and were discarded. If they can't get the funds to hire enough artists to do an HD revamp of classic graphics, then there is about 0 chance they will have enough money to pay a team to conceptualize and create a whole game full of NEW art assets...again. Just not going to happen.
     
  31. ApollyonSP

    ApollyonSP Seasoned Veteran

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    They did draw in people, your claim that they didn't draw in a single person, is just false and misleading. Plus you are already proved wrong by people who are interested in these graphics today. If people are interested in new, improved graphics, then you're wrong, and you are.


    You said "most who were already playing didn't like them". Most is democratic. Did you take a poll about this? No, so your argument is weak. Even if a majority disliked the graphics, then it doesn't mean it's a bad idea. The improved graphics will help the overall game in the longrun. I'll repeat the argument, democracy doesn't always work in video games. Sometimes the players say 'no' to good ideas, and should be overridden. The developers should have, and should still, improve and render the graphics. You're wrong


    It will happen. Are you the owner of ultima online franchise? No, your word is not final. Why should the developers listen to your opinions as if you know what's best for the game? You didn't refuse the point, earlier. New graphics would bring in new players. They could render the graphics and release a new interface, as they did with "enhanced client". People like options. Redo the art, release a new client, charge players for the new version of the game. I bet that a lot of players would be interested and willing to pay for a graphics overhaul.
     
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  32. Uvtha

    Uvtha Grand Poobah
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    Yes, because It wasn't clear that I was employing artistic hyperbole. I literally meant not one single person. :rolleyes:
    On the other hand I don't think you were exaggerating when you said you bet they (the graphics you posted images of) would bring in many new players, and they didn't. You clearly didn't play then since you didn't even seem to know what the KR graphics were from.
    How was I proven wrong? Wrong about what? I was only stating my view of the issue, and the fact KR did NOT bring in many people, despite getting UO what was at the time its first press in years. Everyone wants any game they play to look as nice a possible, but that doesn't mean that the only thing keeping people from playing certain games are graphics. Heck, I even said I would like newer graphics, did you miss that?

    Opinion is not democracy. Democracy implies that opinion had some actual tangible control over game design. It didn't. Opinion in UO like in all games drives the development but doesn't control it, but when it was made clear that most people playing were not using the new client (which does feature a rendering engine btw) because of the new graphics, and that the new graphics did not substantially impact sub rates, they replaced them with the franken-art the "enhanced client" has today in an attempt to get more people to use the new client, which they did to some noticeable extent.
    And if you have played this game very long you should know they ignore what players want all of the time, just not in this case because they were very invested in getting people to switch over to the new client as they were trying to do away with the old one.

    I would also reiterate it wasn't just the existing players that weren't overly fond of the new graphics, they also didn't draw in players. When your base doesn't like it, and its not building a new base... it's not a successful addition.

    Though, like I said, the real reason I think KR flopped was because the graphics were not that good. Screenshots look fine, but if you actually played it (as you clearly did not) the experience was not very good at all. Though I honestly think the mishmash the new client has now is hardly an upgrade. At least all KR would have been aesthetically cohesive.

    Heh, I love how you dismiss my opinion, even though it is reasoned and explained, then offer "It will happen" as if you actually WERE the owner of the ultima franchise.

    As for why should the developers listen to my opinions? Did I ever suggest they would? Was I ever even lobbying that they should? I wasn't, I was just stating my opinion. I didn't "refuse" the point either. New GOOD graphics would probably bring some new players in, I just it doubt it would bring in as many as you expect, simply because UO is not an experience that everyone wants, which is perfectly fine.

    You on the other hand DID ignore my point that graphics upgrades are very expensive, and consume a lot of time. You also ignored the fact that they just canceled a long planned graphics overhaul like a month ago, the scope of which would be smaller than developing a whole new set of graphics. One person can program a UI (though that takes a lot of time too) but for one artist to redo all of the like... 40k art assets (or whatever the number is) it could literally take 5 years.

    If they can't afford to hire enough artists to do an HD revamp of the art, something EVERYONE wants and would probably pay for, how on earth could they afford to employ a whole art team to design and create a whole new set of art assets? It's just not realistic. Especially after the last big one failed.

    And I want to be clear... the last graphics overhaul took a year of combined effort of 5 international art teams. It's not as simple as "render the graphics and release a new interface" it's a BIG project.

    Would everyone love it, assuming the graphics are actually good? Of course. Is it likely to happen? No, it's not. There are like four dev members right now and what, one artist? Two? Giving us new art for holiday gifts seems to be the extent of the current art team. Be realistic.

    One last note... do you use the enhanced client? As I mentioned it actually has a rendering engine, so you might prefer it.
     
    #32 Uvtha, Mar 8, 2015
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2015
  33. Ultimaholic

    Ultimaholic Adventurer

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    I wish Broadsword/EA and whoever else, was as determined to have a great game as their players are. Seems like players have made bigger strides for UO than UO officials ever have. This is just another example.
     
  34. Uvtha

    Uvtha Grand Poobah
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    While these graphics don't appeal to me in the slightest, it is a nicely done job.
     
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  35. Klapauc

    Klapauc Sage
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    These screenshots as well as the video do not look good by todays standard. It would probably take 1 to 2 years and 20 million dollar upwards to hire a decent team of artists and programmers to build a state of the art uo client. A client that would look outdated 5 years later. 3D graphics does look aged very fast and needs constant improvement over time. Pixel art doesnt have that problem, there are quite a few indie games these days that are very sucessfull while having old school pixel art.
    Also one should not forget that uo has a codebase that is more then 15 years old , a hundred or more programmers did work on it, and more content, items and in-game systems than nearly every other game on the planet. You only need to look at other mmorpg's, basically everyone except Blizzard is having financial difficulties.
    Personally i believe EC could be improved a lot by adding some atmosphere like better lighting, weather, and spell effects. Should not be a real problem since it is based on a relativly modern game engine.
    CC on the other side is probably a 20 years old horrible code hack fest, programmers seem to be very afraid to even touch it, but UO veterans seem to like that graphics style a lot .
    The problem is , both clients are liked very well by different parts of the community, a ton of people would quit if CC would go away. Same goes for EC, quite a few people did quit or take a longer break when ec did get that extremly buggy update somewhere last year. So yeah, lets add another game client to that chaos.
    In short, i rather have more content and less bugs than better graphics. UO playerbase is not big enough to support both high end graphics and tons of game content.

    Agra-Lem
     
  36. Uvtha

    Uvtha Grand Poobah
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    Theres also the issue that the world was designed for a 2d iso view, so making it 3d (no matter how nice) is going to give you a weird flat world. To make it worthwhile to have true 3d not fixed perspective like diablo or something, they would need to remake the world from scratch. I would be all for such a project, but at that point... why not just make a new game altogether?