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Returning items

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Capt.E, Feb 27, 2010.

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  1. Capt.E

    Capt.E Guest

    I'd like to hear from stratics users here.

    Here is the backstory:
    Some people in my guild were spawning sanctum, they were raided by another group. They all died. They came back and killed the raiders. On one of the corpses was a Lt. Sash. Now the leaders of another guild we are allied to are trying to pressure my guildie into returning the sash.

    What should my guildie do?

    1. Keep the sash.
    2. Return it.
    3. Sell it back at half price.
    4. Something else?

    I'd like to hear from people. He has not gotten a sash from normal gameplay yet, and we have done quite a few spawns that drop it.
     
  2. Tina Small

    Tina Small Stratics Legend
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    I would return it, if for no other reason than the gesture might be remembered if someone in your guild drops an item and it is found by someone in the other guild.
     
  3. Berethrain

    Berethrain Slightly Crazed
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    Depends on the history of the opposing guild for me. If they haven't returned an item previously then I'd probably keep it.


    But if there's never been a problem, I'd simply return the sash. As Tina said, you never know when you may need the favor returned.
     
  4. Yen Sid

    Yen Sid Guest

    F*** that, keep it. If they wanted to raid you then they should have insured their stuff. And even if it was a bug or something, oh well, they were the raiders, they shouldn't have died. If you can't win, you shouldn't raid.:gun::gun:

    And why is your ally trying to get you to give it back to a guild that goes around raiding you anyway? rolleyes:
     
  5. jbfortune

    jbfortune Slightly Crazed
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    Replica or real?

    Replica, give back. Real, keep!
     
  6. Wilde1

    Wilde1 Guest

    Interesting problem to think about.

    I'd say that if you play a lot with your allied guilds (ie, you actually function as an alliance), then you give it back just to keep the peace.

    If someone put out a distress call on alliance chat or or voice, and the player ended up with the sash because of a request for help, you also give it back, because retrieving lost items falls under that request for help. If that is what happened, I can see why the guild who lost the sash is pissed..."hey, we asked for help and you came, killed the raiders, and kept our stuff!"

    If on the other hand the guy who ended up with the sash randomly stumbled into the fight and coincidentally is in an alliance guild (ie, no distress call over chat or voice), then keep it, its a spoil of war.


    Edit: Oh, and I hope JBfortune is not in my guild, lol.
     
  7. Kellgory

    Kellgory Certifiable
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    Normally I would say give the item back, but that would also depend on what the other guild does with items that other people drop.
     
  8. Stewpid

    Stewpid Guest

    A guild raids your spawn, kills you all, someone loots a sash off one of the people who raided you, and asks for it back? And you're contemplating it? Is this person requesting it back in your alliance guild (I sure hope not)? This is a no brainer, keep it! The sash could help you out next time they try to raid you if nothing else. :) Or sell it back at a slight discount to cover all your insurance losses. But I can't fathom actually just returning it, that's plain ridiculous.
     
  9. Shelleybean

    Shelleybean Certifiable
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    I think Nastia Cross says it best below.
     
  10. Nastia Cross

    Nastia Cross Guest

    If this sash was part of his suit and was accidentally dropped, it should be returned. If it was a reward as a result of the spawn that was lost, sorry but that should not be returned.
     
  11. deraiky

    deraiky Guest

    Always return looted stuff is kind of a PvP policy

    If it was a reward from the champ (check if the sash is blessed, is it still 150/150 dura, is it still red) then you can keep it
     
  12. Schuyler Bain

    Schuyler Bain Lore Master
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    This seems "fair" to me as well.
     
  13. Aran

    Aran INFRACTION INFRACTION INFRACTION!
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    Drop it in the nearest bin. Screw them.
     
  14. Picus of Napa

    Picus of Napa Slightly Crazed
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    I lost a suit on my peacer once, AOF, Crystal Ring, Bracers and lots of other good items but most annoying was a pair of rubble earings. I offered to buy it back as it was my fault to no avail. Stangly a week later the same guild that kept my stuff dropped a pair of legs and cried for a week about getting them back.

    I've given back lots of items over the years but sadly that will never happen again.
     
  15. Capt.E

    Capt.E Guest

    well all of your points are well taken, but at 40-50 mil I would have to lose my suit twice to equal one sash. The one that I currently own is blessed. I find it shocking that people are running around with these things only insured.
     
  16. Mairut

    Mairut Guest

    Hold it for ransom, for when one of your guys looses something to them.

    Bound to happen.... Any day now....

    (I've seen it happen a few times between pvp guilds in the year i've been back. somebody looses something, someone loots it. someone's guildy looses something to somebody's guildy and then they swap items )
     
  17. Malimus

    Malimus Guest

    Id see it as spoils of war... Keep it. Ive lost many items and none of the good ones were ever returned. I Had to pay 6m to get my own trinket back a few months ago but that was my bad for forgetting to insure it. If the guys entire suit dropped it would be a diff story. I would return that possibly minus a piece or two depending on how much trash talk happened. lol
     
  18. BeefSupreme

    BeefSupreme Guest

    Absolutely give it back! but first use a pair of scissors on it.
     
  19. This is exactly what I was going to say.:gee:
     
  20. Tukaram

    Tukaram Guest

    They raided? They lost? Y'all looted? I fail to see a problem.

    They had options... don't bring it, don't raid, or insure it (if it is not insurable go back to the don't bring it option).
     
  21. N49ATV

    N49ATV Slightly Crazed
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    The people saying give it back, are far too soft. This is PvP. Maybe cause Im from siege where we have no insurance. But IMO, if you engage in PvP, and die, you shouldnt complain if a item is kept. You can sell back should you like, but I myself would keep it and put it in your suit (should it fit your template)
     
  22. Tjalle

    Tjalle Grand Inquisitor
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    What my fellow Sieger said.

    A PVPer lost an item. So what? Risk vs reward. IsnĀ“t that the Felucca motto?
    Keep it!

    However. Should both parties agree that a bug was involved (if it was insured or blessed) then I would give it back.
     
  23. I would say give back, unless there's some policy within your guild about returning items to certain guilds or players.
    Unless it was a reward from the spawn as someone said above, then its free game for whomever looted it.
     
  24. John Connelly

    John Connelly Journeyman
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    What's the point in raiding a spawn if you are going to give the stuff back?
     
  25. Laina

    Laina Sage
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    This is all just a bit confusing to me. I always see Fel as a risk vs. reward place. That being said, if the item was lost due to a bug then I do think you should give it back. If however, a rival guild came and raided your spawn and got killed by you then it doesn't make much sense to me to give it back. Looting your opponent's corpse is part of the "spoils of war" in pvp as someone previously mentioned.
     
  26. shalanria

    shalanria Seasoned Veteran
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    They raid you with no insurance on items? Keep it, that is what they would have done.
     
  27. Terrorknight

    Terrorknight Guest

    Keep it, they attacked your guild first. All is fair in PVP. (except speed hacking and 3rd party programs lol)
     
  28. Lyconis

    Lyconis Sage
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    I agree if its part of the suit to give it back, if its something they got as a result of raiding your spawn and didn't notice it keep it!

    However I would be sure to require the player that dropped it to come to my house naked and get drunk in front of all my guild mates while he grovelled and begged for forgiveness due to his own stupidity. This will make it entertaining and be sure to have a screen capture utility available. Humiliation isn't that one of the virtues?
     
  29. Risso

    Risso Babbling Loonie
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    If you're not keeping it then at least sell it back for worth. This will probably anger them and make them want to raid you at every opportunity, but hey, more free stuff right?
     
  30. Sonoma

    Sonoma Guest

    I guess it depends on what kind of rep you guys want. If you want to be known as an honorable guild... then give it back. If you're not too worried about it, keep it.

    I have been on both ends of situations like this. It SUCKS loosing something like that. Its fun looting it off someones corpse. When it happened to me, they didnt give the items back. When I was the one who looted the stuff (Well over 100mil worth of items) I gave it back. I felt sick when I lost my stuff, but I got over it. I felt like a freakin hero when I gave all that stuff back to the poor guy I looted. (Although to be honest, I did make him sweat for a little while before I gave it all back). Looking back on it, keeping all those items would have been pretty nice... but when it comes down to it, I have more then I need in game, and I still get a warm fuzzy feeling knowing that I rose to the occasion, and resisted temptation when I was put to the test. I feel I made the right choice.

    That being said... seeing as how they raided you first, I don't see any moral reason why you should have to give it back. They tried to take something from you. You ended up taking something from them. I have no pity for them whatsoever should you decide to keep it. When it comes down to it, a year from now it wount make any difference at all to anybody but you. So, do you want to look back and say "They had it coming", or do you want to look back and say "Im such a good guy". LoL.
     
  31. Siabra

    Siabra Seasoned Veteran
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    "....we have done quite a few spawns that drop it."

    It shouldn't matter HOW many spawns that your guild has done and NOT gotten the sash .. the item should be returned .. as I am SURE the guild thats ALLIED to yours would do...

    Siabra

    my 2 cents
     
  32. Tinsil

    Tinsil Guest

    Well, of course it's up to him. Most people would not return the sash. I would/would not depending on the player and the guild that dropped it.

    It's obviously his decision. It wasn't an insurance bug, so just part of the game really. Then again, it's a less than normal way to acquire the item.

    Your friend is fine by keeping it, and your friend is fine by returning it.
     
  33. Zosimus

    Zosimus Grand Inquisitor
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    If this is the sash on Baja you're talking about then it's my guildie that lost it. The reason she lost it was it was insured by another char and she put it on another char. This was after the publish with the new insurance menu. A lot of people was finding out afterwards when items were being dropped that the issue was how it was insured with another char that was causing them to drop. This has been posted on stratics and shard forums and you are using this to you're advatage. Now since you are filled in with why it was dropped and it was just a human mistake trusing the new patch.

    The leading guild of the alliance your in has returned some items and so have we. Now you're using stratics as a reasoning to return this? Now play nice and return it please.......
     
  34. Endrik

    Endrik Sage
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    LoL. Get real. You were literally in the act of trying to take what they had worked for from them. They worked a spawn, you tried to kill them and take it from them. If you were successful and got a 120 magery scroll, would you have returned it to them? Nope. You went there with the intent to steal what they had worked for. Plain and simple. Then you blew it, and died, and lost something you had worked for. And you want it returned to you? Wow.

    THEY HAVE NO MORAL OBLIGATION TO RETURN ANYTHING TO YOU!!!

    People blow my mind sometimes. This is the exact same thing as a burgler breaking into someones house, then breaking their ankle carrying a stolen TV down the stairs, and suing the homeowner they were trying to steal from.
     
  35. I think it comes down to honor, some guilds have it, some dont.
    If you lose something valuable after this, odds are, you wont get it back if you dont return the item.
    On one side its Fel, risk vs reward.. other side is honor.
    If this guild has done something bad to yours in the past and not returned items, then keep the sash. If they have been honorable in returning dropped items, give it back.

    *shrugs* its a personal choice of your friend.
     
  36. Zosimus

    Zosimus Grand Inquisitor
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    Uh sorry was only one of my guildies showed up. It wasnt mine and Im not crying over it. Its a matter of honor but hey to each his own. It wasnt my one guildy that raided. It was another guild that raided that kills both us or their alliance. He fails to mention the 3rd guild that actually did the raiding. The alliance attacked my one guild member first anyway. Yes they have no moral obligation to return anything but if thats how they feel thats is fine. We will repay the same favor as they do us in a return policy. When one of their alliance drops anything then we wont return it then if he doesnt return the sash. He fails to mention that when we was friendly before with each other their alliance took some items and never returned it and we were FRIENDLY at that time towards each other. So LAWL @ you and ya sorry attempt to justify. Ask them how many times they raided us and took our champs. Its been fair both ways at spawns so its just not us as the raiders. They raid also.
     
  37. Assia Penryn

    Assia Penryn The Sleeping Dragon
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    I agree with this. If it was part of a suit and something glitched out and it dropped, I'd return it. Sometimes bad stuff happens in the game that is beyond a player's control. I agree Fel is risk vs reward, however, it isn't part of the game mechanics in Fel to have stuff randomly drop that is blessed or properly insured. Find out the details and act appropriately. Your reward should be knowledge that you did the 'right thing' in your mind, regardless of what any of us suggest.

    I had a RL neighbor once who was a total and absolute crank. I saw her wallet in the driveway one day and picked it up. Apparently she had put it on top of her car and drove off, forgetting it was there. It had $200 in cash inside. I left her a note on her front door and returned it including all the cash. Two wrongs don't make a right and while I can't be change the way people act, I can make sure my karma stays intact.

    Raiding in Felucca is a use of game mechanics. Loosing an item due to a bug with the game mechanics is not. I don't pvp in Felucca for the 'loot', I do it because I enjoy it.
     
  38. Well... I guess if you would like to known as a guild that doesn't return stuff well then so be it. I would say it could be assumed if someone in your guild drops something that you member will be treated with the same courtesy...
     
  39. Zosimus

    Zosimus Grand Inquisitor
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    I asked if its part of the suit for mods and yes it is used for that purpose. I didnt have knowledge of that when I posted. It's up to you far as Im concerned.
     
  40. G.v.P

    G.v.P Stratics Legend
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    word.
     
  41. All is fair in love and war. One of the first things I learned in this game is to never head out for a fight with something that you are not prepared to lose.

    I say keep it, unless they offer some ridiculous amount of gold for it.
     
  42. aarons6

    aarons6 Certifiable
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    ok let me get this straight, your guildmates were minding their own buisness down in a champ and a team of reds come down and raid your guys and probably looted everything they owned that was of use..(im sure they didnt res them and let them get their stuff?) then your guys gather up some good pvpers and go back down there and kill them all and in the loot was something valuable?

    now another guild that wasnt that red guild is requesting you to give it back?

    so the question you need to ask is, how well you know this guild.. for one thing they could be the same people.

    id keep it.. tell them that next time if your guildmates are doing a spawn they should leave them alone.
    im betting if this sash wasnt insured it was a drop..
     
  43. RawHeadRex

    RawHeadRex Slightly Crazed
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    big UO teeth i tell ya ! i've seen red/s actually in that position and I marvel at how they failed to insure an 'item' or 'items.' I think there should be some sort of mega reward in order here if the losing party can afford it, good gestures go both ways. returning the item not only grants future reprieve, it warrants an award as well it's that big of a deal. would a raider give such an item back if rolls were reversed ?
     
  44. Capt.E

    Capt.E Guest

    Zosimus, since you want to make this personal, I lost a tunic to the players that are now GSE; and they cut it up right in front of me. I didn't include this info before and haven't told my guildie about it. It's still his decision, what has happened in the past should stay there.

    I admit there is an insurance bug out there, but it isn't how you describe it. In the insurance bug your whole suit drops. I have had it happen.

    I still have yet to talk to my guildie, as I haven't been at home to log in.
     
  45. Stewpid

    Stewpid Guest

    lol... You mean play nice like raiding their spawn? Like I said up above, keep the sash, call it a reward for retaking your spawn!

    I will say if the raiding guild returned all the scrolls and loot they got from you, then maybe, return the sash, but I highly doubt they did.
     
  46. RD Gumbie

    RD Gumbie Guest

    I was leaning torwards returning it untill I see someone like this post and a the crap he has posted in the recent past, plus the fact that both allies of thiers have kept stuff in the past and even have locked items on thier steps to show it off in the past.

    Keep the damn thing. Maybe they will smarten up and think before they mess with you again. Not to mention ally and befriend a bunch of hacks.
     
  47. lil debi

    lil debi Journeyman
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    Regarding the original post.

    Obtain FACTS before you comment or post you were not there you have no clue how things went down. Your Guildie knows the facts which he isn't relaying correctly.

    It is clear lack of integrity and greed have fogged his demeanor. There are many opinions concerning this situation again it falls back to integrity .
     
  48. Ezekiel Zane

    Ezekiel Zane Grand Inquisitor
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    KEEP IT!

    Risk vs. Reward right?

    Everyone should know by now that if you move insured items from one character to another, that you need to un-insure then re-insure them to make sure you don't lose them upon death.

    Chalk it up to a lesson learned and move on. It's not like you're the first player to lose a valuable item in Felucca. As has been stated, if you can't afford to lose it don't use it. Even with insurance, any experienced PvPr knows there can still be glitches.

    To the OP, if you want to return it and feel better about yourself, then return it but don't let any of these idiots, trying to make you feel like you HAVE to return it get to you. Crybabies shouldn't be in Fel in the first place.
     
  49. Capt.E

    Capt.E Guest

    @ lil debi

    All I know is that I was on SI vent for about an hour and people started asking if I knew anything about the sash. I had heard it was on a corpse at sanctum. The guild leaders of SI stated they needed to get the sash back. So even if I don't have all the FACTS, I'm involved nonetheless. Personally I'm torn on whether or not he should return it. I see the point of good sportsmanship, but on the other hand, it's not like we went into the guys/girls house and stole it. So I'm still torn, and I just wanted to clarify some things by posting this thread. Yeah, if I had lost the sash I wouldve been crushed. Which is why I blessed mine. If you want to compare apples to apples, you can't because no single item that can be used in a Mage suit is worth the value of the Lt. Sash. It is hands down the most powerful piece you can get IMHO. Returning a tunic for example with mr2 20 lrc and high fire and poison resists 9 months ago was obviously too much to ask from a GSE member. Because he cut it up in front of me.
     
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