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RoT is HARD. Siege is not EASY, and leave.

Discussion in 'UO Siege Perilous' started by King Edward, Jul 27, 2008.

  1. King Edward

    King Edward Visitor

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    If you want free gains, completed char's in a day or a week, or more blessed items, and not losing your stuff, then PLZ, GET THE HELL OFF SIEGE.

    Siege is for Vets. For People that want more than the insta 7 GM in a day.
    I EARNED all my points and So should every player that comes or Stays. Working a few months for a completed char builds a rounded player that KNOWS whos here and who's hes fighting. Siege is a HARD shard. Hard gains, hard earning gold, hard farming items.... HARD HARD HARD.

    And if your selling your accounts and swear you arent coming back To Siege or UO, then again PLEASE, Stay the hell off the boards. There is no real point in trying to listen to someone that isnt really there. People that wanna say hi or ask how things are, or if anything changed... Sure. But the few people that are saying they're leaving, then BYE. Its like going to a restaurant, screaming that the food blows and the service sucks, but WONT get their ass out the front door. Your just ruining everyone elses meal that ACTUALLY wants to be there.
     
  2. Kat

    Kat Crazed Zealot
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    Shut up. :loser:
     
  3. Sir Daniel

    Sir Daniel Lore Keeper
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    ya stfu!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
     
  4. Black magick

    Black magick Guest

    agreed ^^
     
  5. Masumatek

    Masumatek Guest

    Here are some selections from the ROT post I made last year. I hope you find them enlightening.



    1) They think ROT is hard.

    People who say such things, that ROT is hard/difficult…are not understanding what those words really mean. They think because training on Siege takes a long time to complete, that it is hard. They think this is good because Siege is supposed to be the “hard shard.” They think because people have to sit through and time their skill gains every day for 3-5 months or because a casual player may take 6 months or even more to finish training on Siege, that training must be hard.

    They are wrong. Training on Siege is not anymore hard than making a million bandaids by cutting wool, getting yarn, and turning it into cloth, or sitting through hours upon hours of turning in bolts and gm made bows at a fletcher quester. It is easy. Very easy. It just takes a long time and is boring.

    I can sit in my house and make clothes all day to gain in tailoring. I can go to the graveyard and sit by the fence and shoot the weak bone guys to gain tactics. I can put an LRC suit on and cast on myself all day. To use some real life examples: I can take me two hours to do a stack of dirty dishes. It can take me who knows how long to watch the complete, boring series of Star Trek: DS9. These are just a few examples. Is any of it hard? Absolutely not.

    Do I have to complete some difficult quest, challenge some evil tough monsters, explore some underwater cave filled with water pixies or whatever and find some magical blah item….to train? NO. Might some of that be hard? Possibly, but I don’t have to do any such thing. I just sit down and repeat the same thing over and over and over and over again.

    At 70 skill I have to get a timer and time my gains every 5 minutes day after day after day. Then the time delay increases the higher I gain. Is this hard? Is it a CHALLENGE? NO. Is it a pain in the arse? You betcha.

    Boring. Grind. Tedious. Long. Pain in the arse. Pointless. Etc. These are words to describe training on Siege. Where does hard/difficult/challenging fit in? No where. People are confusing these words with long and boring. They are the not the same. Not at all. Training is not hard. It is long and boring. People need to stop mixing the words up.

    If you care so much about training being hard…if you honestly think people should have to be really challenged before finishing their character, then there are options. You can ask the devs for instance to allow people to more easily train by PvMing ACTUAL monsters, the more challenging ones, and through PvP. But this would require a whole rework of almost every skill…because in order for this to happen, people in training (people with low skill level) must be able to compete with people with fully trained skills.

    You can ask the devs to add in quests and force people to explore for items and fight challenging monsters, etc…to train. Make it more challenging. Make it more interesting. Is this the right way to go? Maybe, maybe not…but it will add some degree of challenge and make training a bit interesting.

    Those are options to make training “harder” if it’s that important to you.

    LONG AND BORING THOUGH……THAT DOES NOT MAKE TRAINING HARD. I hope you finally understand that.



    -----Some even go so far as to claim ROT in its current state is basically “a large part of the heart of Siege.” They make the claim that ROT is what separates us from normal, trammel shards. They say that without ROT, we are just one step closer to becoming a “carebear server” and will continue on that path. This argument is also bogus. The very idea that someone can make the claim that long, boring training is what separates Siege from trammel shards makes me sad for Siege, for the people who say such a thing, despite playing on Siege, really have no idea what Siege is about. Siege was NEVER meant to be about pointless training. Training has nothing to do with what Siege is about. Added risk? Yes. Increased danger from other players? Yes. More required player interaction? Yes. More reliance on crafters (one character per account)? Yes. And MUCH more. But NEVER about training. Training is NOT in ANY way what makes Siege Siege. Changing ROT will NOT in ANY way be in violation of the spirit of Siege.



    -----Really, it sounds to me like many are just making excuses for ROT because they had to go through it and feel others should have to too. Which brings us to our final reason people give for keeping ROT the way it is. Selfishness. Some people are even brave enough to say it out loud. They think that because they had to suffer through 3-6+ months of boredom training their skills, everyone else who comes to Siege should have to suffer as well. This reason is complete garbage. And I have a feeling many people citing other reasons really feel this way too, at least in part…because they had to suffer through it, so the next guy should too. Well they should be ignored, because such selfishness is hurting Siege.



    Purchasing accounts: A further reason for a major ROT change is that skill training can already be completely avoided by those who purchase accounts. This undermines any reason the opposition can give for keeping skill training the way it is, when it can be completely avoided by purchasing the account of someone who has already done it for you.





    Also, no one is suggesting a "insta 7 GM in a day" change. Many suggest around a month. I agree with that and my exact suggestion was 3-4 weeks. 3-4 weeks is in now instance. This range however assumes you're a power game who plays every single day and gets your max gains every single day. So in reality, virtually everyone would take longer than the suggestion time of 3-4 weeks and many would take significantly longer.

    Now wake up to the truth and stop standing in the way of a better Siege.
     
  6. King Edward

    King Edward Visitor

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    and the two ppl that posted above me are a perfect example of who new char's need to meet.
     
  7. Chardonnay

    Chardonnay Visitor

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    As you play with a tamer that has a bonded pet that spits out 80 point breathe weapons and your running animal form...but SP is hard...pls STFU...
     
  8. King Edward

    King Edward Visitor

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    Go to Barneyland Mas
     
  9. King Edward

    King Edward Visitor

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    Hope you caught that last part of my post Char... =P
     
  10. Masumatek

    Masumatek Guest

    I read your post. You're wrong. You refuse to look at anyone else's arguments and prefer to stay in your dreamland. I'd say you're the one who should go to Barneyland:).
     
  11. Chardonnay

    Chardonnay Visitor

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    Ya i sure did it totally avoided what i said congrats...if im leaving or not it has nothing to do with what i told you and you said way to be delusional and continue to be the best tamer on the server NOW...ROFL...tamer mode is 100% easy now your a joke...its almost like kage saying hes a legend when theres like 3 good mages on the server now...laughable...btw the customer is ALWAYS right...
     
  12. King Edward

    King Edward Visitor

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    And Char, the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one. Now leave us to enjoy our meal. *sheesh*
     
  13. Masumatek

    Masumatek Guest

    I don't know how that has to do with this thread? And I love Star Trek, but I disagree with Spock in this instance.
     
  14. kelmo

    kelmo Old and in the way
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    *blinks* Say what?
     
  15. Chardonnay

    Chardonnay Visitor

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    I swear this guy lives in a king edward bubble...:coco:
     
  16. Chardonnay

    Chardonnay Visitor

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    Oh i got it, so what your saying is squeaky people need grease?
     
  17. King Edward

    King Edward Visitor

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    This is for Kelmo and Mas

    I made a post (above) with a restaurant example
    Char came back with a customer in the restaurant responce
    I came backwith a Star Trek Quote explaining that all the other customers deserved her silence buy her leaving so they could enjoy there food in peace.

    Ta Da.
     
  18. Chardonnay

    Chardonnay Visitor

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    And then i said the customers ALWAYS right and your response was what?

    Ta Da?
     
  19. King Edward

    King Edward Visitor

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    Char

    My RESPONCE was the ********* Star Trak quote. READ.....
     
  20. Kat

    Kat Crazed Zealot
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    It's kinda difficult to take seriously, the guy who made fun of the fact that someone's Mother recently passed away. Not to mention the fact that he's doing it all these months later.

    Ed - You do not speak for this community and you never will. Quite frankly, we'd be much better off if you took your own advice. :next:
     
  21. Chardonnay

    Chardonnay Visitor

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    Oh i see c wut u did right thar...well in your response to what you said...monkeys live longer when they get watered properly...
     
  22. Chardonnay

    Chardonnay Visitor

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    QFT...*showers*
     
  23. King Edward

    King Edward Visitor

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    Kat
    You need to get over ONE comment I made to someone whos NOT you.

    And I speak quite well for the community.
     
  24. Revvo

    Revvo Slightly Crazed
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    Start a poll then, who agrees with King Ed.
     
  25. Chardonnay

    Chardonnay Visitor

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    LOL................................................................................ROFL.....................................................................................................................hehe..................................................................................................................haha...................................................................................................................omfg..............................................................................................................what?......................................................................................................................zomg............................................................................................................roflcopter............................................................................................................please go directly to the hospital beause you sir are straight delusional.............................................................................................................................................................................................btw water that monkey too.....
     
  26. Chardonnay

    Chardonnay Visitor

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    I approve of king edward monkeys should be watered for best results to dry.........
     
  27. kelmo

    kelmo Old and in the way
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    Ed. You in no way speak for or represent any game or play style I embrace. Just so you know. *nods*
     
  28. Chardonnay

    Chardonnay Visitor

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    Ed...

    You just got knocked the **** out!!!!!!

    *nods*
     
  29. kelmo

    kelmo Old and in the way
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    *grumbles* 11 days without a cigarette. This thread... I am gonna take a walk and breath some fresh air. *shakes head*
     
  30. AEowynSP

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  31. Lord_Puffy

    Lord_Puffy Crazed Zealot
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    No Problem... Good outlook keep it up youll have the shard to yourself eventually.
     
  32. Lord_Puffy

    Lord_Puffy Crazed Zealot
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    They should take out bonded pets... Siege is hard NOT EASY, if not like LEAVE! o wait thatd ruin his uberly hard template to run...
     
  33. AEowynSP

    AEowynSP Certifiable
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    Looks up at 4 posts. Wow he flunked kindigarten too.
     
  34. Chardonnay

    Chardonnay Visitor

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    *crickets*

    King Ed where ya go?
     
  35. Lord_Puffy

    Lord_Puffy Crazed Zealot
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    This is one of the posts he makes to merely agervate annoy **** people. And then 3 days later will make a post asking why people post on here and do that. :danceb: :bored:
     
  36. Masuo Kenji

    Masuo Kenji Guest

    RoT is not hard, it's tedious. There's a difference. I can just wait for 10-15 minutes and hit a monster to get a weapon skill gain. All it took? Just time.

    There is no difficulty involved with RoT. The difficulty on Siege comes from having one character, and trying to make your way by interacting with the rest of the shard (economically and socially).

    Tedium does not always mean something is hard. Tedium is just not fun. In any game, tedium (including time sinks) just make people bored and stop playing the game.

    While we all agree that RoT should stay, there needs to be some changes to it. It's an archaic system, and it's time that something needs to be done.

    Also, I don't think the words "Siege is for Vets" applies anymore. Siege is for anyone who wants to play the closest (official) thing that UO should be.
     
  37. Chardonnay

    Chardonnay Visitor

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    QFT...
     
  38. DebiHIS

    DebiHIS Guest

    i actually like the RoT system, because i knew i was getting a gain. Not the grinding for an hour, and maybe you'll get one, lol.
     
  39. QueenZen

    QueenZen Always Present
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    Actually I would disagree. There are many EA UO customers that may try Siege. Some will make it some will not. . and some will try it again maybe later on and then do just fine. I do not believe in telling any of them to get the hell off Siege even..no matter how much they may whine or complain at first.

    Think of it as a foreign exchange student in culture shock. When any one tries to become a foreign exchange student they are volunteering to enter a nation and society and culture they wish to get to know better but they will have many stages to go thru to make that 12 month stint to the end of their tour. Some of em won't ever cut it, some will, and some may have to try it all at a later date again.

    Whom are any of us to tell someone anyone to get the hell off Siege or any shard they TRY...we do not even know them YET...some may take more time than others or more tries to make it than others...I feel that we should give them the chance and offer them a hand of friendship IF they want it which may go lots further to keep them here than shouting ...get the hell off Siege a shard with losing population as is ....oft due to the hardness of it all, or the ATTITUDE of some folks that do not see the possible potential in these others whom TRY Siege..

    I say let em try it...yes even if they cry complain or whine at first........sooner or later they will find they cut it or not and they may just cut it better if someone just hears em out once before judging them as less than us or.. unfit to be here ! Never know !

    Just my opinion, it is more like a cultural exchange student give them the time to find out IF they can cut it inspite despite complaining. And if they are complaining or whining or crying at first maybe they are just frustrated atm, hear em out offer some constructive advice instead of shooting em down at the get go at first.. and if they really are not cut out for it all, in due time they will know and so will we no need to shoot em down destructively at first just offer some constructive advice that actually may help em TO make it here ..never know.

    As for former customers whom left coming back complaining, they paid EA UO they got gripes maybe they want to play again and want EA to still hear them so they utilise forums to maybe get heard. . they WANT to come back.. and maybe want customer service or factions or other game improvements or shard improvements. They will still voice their opinions even after they left cuz they musta loved the game once and maybe want to love and play it again. Whom are we to judge ?
     
  40. QueenZen

    QueenZen Always Present
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    Oh and in case anyone wonders, I spent 4 yrs. as a host parent as did our family for foreign exchange students to the USA and seen many a teen crack in being in some land they are unfamiliar with and cry and whine and break down within those first weeks in the states..some never did make it, most DID given the chance to see to know about *culture shock* they overcame it in due time to succeed to spend 12 mos. in a foreign land with other families.

    I DO look at Siege in similar ways...folks coming to try the shard out wanting to learn, to get to know...............the last thing many of us need to be saying is GET THE HELL OFF Siege...when a simple hello MAY have helped keep them here and explaining to them a bit better what they are facing here... may be all that it takes for some to get them thru their *culture shock* when they first get here, & not a bitter better than thou attitude shoved at em and if that is all they get off folks here, only that, they may just leave but not due to the hardness of the ROT or the shard but due to the hardness of the *deafness* of folks here, whom they just wanted to be heard by..just once even, in constructive friendship or training, or informations, to help them TO succeed here ! Some will never cut it, others would could if they just were permitted their initial *meltdowns* and given some constructive advice !
     
  41. HaHa

    HaHa Guest

    Lol, ed got Kel-mowned
     
  42. madox_inc

    madox_inc Guest

    after playing wow since beta I must say... RoT is EASY.
    Siege is the best shard since the old dreadload days.

    Just too bad there are too few playing. So stop telling people to **** off.
     
  43. domii

    domii Journeyman
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    RoT is easy. Just tedious logging in/out every 10 minutes, x11 every day to get my 2.1 gains.. its not skill or a challenege. Just simple math and a chart that shows me when my char will be done in a few months. Blah.
     
  44. Exactly. Logging in and out for gains is not actually playing, either. We need gains to be much more per day (3xs), and at faster intervals (1 min), so new players will actually get out and about and stay in game while playing and waiting for their next gain.

    You would still need to play for an hour and forty minutes a day to get gains this way to have a skilled char in 1 month. That's enough time, not too little, not too much.
     
  45. MatrixCubed

    MatrixCubed Guest

    Exactly! I joined Seige awhile back and found gains to be quite simple...best part...guaranteed! I played production shards...lucky to get .1 every few days on a skill and that's playing hours. What makes Siege and UO suck, is it became Item based...power and stat scrolls...uber pets...uber weps and armor...lame...nothing is very hard for maxxed out characters with all the gear. Just (as all the real vets have clamored for for years) put up a T2A shard...7x only...Fel rule set...then the word 'skill' has some real meaning. I never pvp'd but, I was never out matched by an uber template and could fight or flee and have a chance when the playing field was level. At the end of the day though, I pay , I play, I deal with it.
     
  46. Skylark SP

    Skylark SP Available Storage: 0
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    Challenging things can often be fun. Tedious things are not fun. They are not the same thing. RoT imposes an obstacle sure enough which can only be overcome by tedious behaviors (egg timer log ins) to maximize, but I wouldn't call it challenging. It certainly isn't fun.

    -Skylark
     
  47. Hera - Siege

    Hera - Siege Lore Master
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    RTLFC:

    RoT needs to done away with completely. . . BUT...
    Keep the skill gain limit.

    Adjust the point at which RoT kicks in, or increase the gains, but allow me to get all those gains immediately. [IE: in 30 swings of a weapon, 30 consecutive tames/etc]. No need to penalize people who don't have 4 hours to log in every 15 minutes to max a single skill.
     
  48. UncleSham

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    ed you know i got your back , but i have to disagree with you on this one .

    ROt is tedious and certainly not fun . telling poeple to just leave isnt the answer iether .

    true most of the old timers put in their time "payed their dues" and now have something worth bragging about . which is all fine and well , but we DO need more players .

    surely theres more to surviving on siege besides skills . look at how many poeple buy accounts that used to be good ... and fail because they have NO IDEA how to play them .

    i think we can afford to let the new poeple have a break on skill gain if it means getting more victims . um . i mean friends . yeah thats it.

    ROT is a great system . i actually prefer it to GGS . its just the daily limits need to be removed (if im willing to work for em let me have em) and scale the delays up so they reflect the 120 max (which you pretymuch NEED now days ... everyone else has it)
     
  49. I tend to agree with this part. Which seems to be overlooked, sure its a harsh statment. Isn't that why Siege is the best shard because it's hard?
    This statement was one of the reasons I stuck it out. It feels mighty good when even the best of the best veterans hit you and you get away, or take them out..*which has never happened yet* May happen someday....:danceb:


    :next: