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Sell me on the Enhanced Client...

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Blitzkrieg, May 27, 2013.

  1. Blitzkrieg

    Blitzkrieg Journeyman
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    As someone who has been a "casually active" player for 12+ years, I am having a hard time making the switch. I cant help but admire some of the effects I have seen, such as rain, but have a hard time with the way players look on horses, like they just floating across the ground. And faction horses--I just wont go there.

    I am kinda reminded of 3rd Dawn when ilsh was empty and new.

    I missed out on the launch of the EC and would like to hear pros and cons from players who actually use the EC and from those who trid it and simply had to go back to CC. Any feedback would be welcomed.
     
  2. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    Well let me know what you want to know about the EC..... I have actually taught classes in Ventrilo on the use and set up of the EC with Pinco's UI.... and would be more than happy to help anyone who was actually willing to give the EC a true go. So PM me and maybe we can talk.
     
    Tazar likes this.
  3. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    I play the CC.

    But here's my sales pitch for the EC: It works. One day, the CC will no longer work. And, if you're like me, you will wish to continue playing.

    So, at least learn it. I need to learn it better. A lot better.

    -Galen's player
     
  4. Lord Lew

    Lord Lew Lore Keeper
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    I played both and now only play the EC.. I started fishing exclusively with the EC so I could see the clutter in my hold. Also, fishing up MIBs is a no brainier, EC wins due to the integrated map feature.

    I hated the graphics at first, but am getting used to them. I installed pincos UI and learned how to fight with it, with the ease of macro creation, there really is no comparison with assist. Now I only play with the EC, there is no going back. Once you let yourself adjust, you will understand why.

    Not sure how to sell it to you, once you learn how to tweak it, and allow your mind to accept the imagery, you will ask yourself why it took so long.
     
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  5. Lady Storm

    Lady Storm Crazed Zealot
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    Sugar many like the EC. Pinco has made many like it even better with his additions.
    If you are game, download it and try.. give it a few weeks to grow on you.
    We can say a lot for and against it.. but the true test is your opinion not ours.
     
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  6. Victim of Siege

    Victim of Siege Crazed Zealot
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    About the only way it will grow on you, is to pretend the CC has been mothballed. By that I mean, uninstall the CC from your computer completely and use the EC until it is what you are used to. If you leave the CC on your computer you will be too tempted to go back to it. Personally, I did that for a while and found that there were just certain things I preferred on the CC such as treasure maps (yes I know the EC makes it easier, i just prefer to do it in the CC).

    One of the best things about the EC though is the awesome macros you can make. such as fishing and spell training macros. I always get my magery to ROT with the EC. The macros are just superior in the EC, although i have been told that the CC with UOA is superior, but I personally have never used UOA except to use it to make the cartographer map work on CC.
     
    #6 Victim of Siege, May 27, 2013
    Last edited: May 27, 2013
  7. BeaIank

    BeaIank Babbling Loonie
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    For me, it is the targeting system (target current, stored, cursor, me, by resource, etc), the gridded containers, the ease to make macros.
    Everything feels easier to do on the EC. And no cluttering your screen with letters as you activate your macros. Pinco UI also adds so much to it.
    Graphics are ugly, yes, but so are the CC ones.

    I made the move about an year ago and simply can't look back because it simply plays much better than the CC for me.
     
  8. Nexus

    Nexus Site Support
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    There are a lot of reasons to give the EC a serious try..
    Let me start with stock features, while Pinco's is a good addon, the fact that it is not modular, as it doesn't allow you to only install the parts you want is a down side, and makes it feel...well bloated to me. I recommend that people try the EC stock first to get the hang of it's built in systems then decide if they want to add Pinco's or not.
    • More Robust Macro System
    • Any Stackable item can be dragged onto a Hotbar and you have an instant counter.
    • Grid View Containers - Playing a Thief this is awesome btw, no way to "hide" items under mounds of stuff.
    • Got an Ethy? Drag it on the hot bar no need to open your pack to remount.
    • The ability to create new hotbars, that will 'snap' together means you can keep your screen very tidy.
    • The Skill Tracker! This is a good feature when training a character especially those skills that require you to interact with multiple difficulty items, such as poisoning, lockpicking, etc.
    • Map Integration, it's wonderful stock but could be better, if they'd only allow us to set up Map Servers using the Client, even if we're not logged in it would be perfect.
    • Did I mention the Hotbars? I use them for a lot of things, I drag Runebooks onto them for quick access, Spellbooks as well just in case I need a rarely used spell.
    Now as to features that are added by Pinco that I really enjoy....
    I don't enjoy all the features, honestly probably 75% are useless for my play style or don't suit me a all like the redesigned paperdolls... It's reasons like this that I recommend trying Stock first.
    • Auto-opening Life Bars. Something comes on screen it can pull up a life bar for you. Very useful if you get raided at a spawn or trying to grab a hotbar to access a paperdoll for snooping.
    • Warnings - Get low on life, poisoned, etc. Pinco makes sure you notice.
    • Unravel Calculations. Pinco has what you'll get from unraveling items listed on their description.. makes sorting loot handy.
     
  9. THP

    THP Stratics Legend
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    the EC sucks..i play UO as it was intended...
     
    #9 THP, May 27, 2013
    Last edited: May 27, 2013
  10. Flutter

    Flutter Always Present
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    I would play it exclusively if the avatars looked like the ones in the CC.
    I agree that I don't like the movement of the horses, people walking etc. I have trouble identifying characters by sight in the EC.
    If I didn't have this issue I would uninstall the CC completely.

    The EC is absolutely a MUST for PvM, especially things like T-hunting. As someone who only loots the special items from chests the backpack sorting is a life saver.
    For things like making potions, as someone who's never scripted, you can sit there all day with very few key strokes and only have to actually do anything when you're overweight or need more supplies in your backpack. (I believe if they allowed us to work out of chests in our homes it would put an end to a lot of illegal 3rd party scripting)
     
  11. weins201

    weins201 Certifiable
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    LMAO great argument there
     
  12. Adol

    Adol Certifiable
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    Not mentioned so far; The EC, if you keep your computer defragged and happy is much, much quicker than classic client, even when it's zoomed out to show much more of the map. You can scale off spell effects too to make it run even quicker; It's rare I won't come near the top in any sort of marathon or running event due to this alone. Combine that with automatic path finding around obstacles and I'm told there's a slight bonus is completing spell casting too, and it's simply a more efficient client.

    Want to stock vendors in Classic bags, or make backpack artwork (I had a bag with jewels in the shape of a teddy bear once, wish I could find the screen shot of it)...? EC allows you to swap to CC layout and do so.

    Macros have been mentioned, but it should be pointed out that it's also legal macroing, way beyond what the naughty programs can get up too. Loot by right click is standard, but with Pinco you can auto sort the entire corpse into bags of choice...

    It's not all good news though; be aware it memory leaks like a bugger, and certain spells will grind you to a halt. They aren't common, it's the Wave Explosion of Corgul and the Crimson Dragon's spells that blow up the client, and they're hardly ever seen. Just be aware though that EMs like long fights with them, and I often crash when they set off the grand finale after ages fighting a Guardian Slasher of Veils and here come the screen filling explosions...

    Also making a custom house is easier in the Classic, as the roof seems to be able to be placed better, and the EC again, when I last did it 2 or more years ago, often crashed when saving and loading designs. A minor thing, but it's there. Player written books are borked in the EC too.
     
    #12 Adol, May 27, 2013
    Last edited: May 29, 2013
  13. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    The EC with Pinco's for a Tamer wins me over every day Hands DOWN.... I can Lore a pet and INSTANTLY know what it's "pet rating is".... 2.1 or 4.1.... I can see if it's got good resists because I can see all the max and such at a glance it's all on one page and amazing....


    The EC with Pinco's wins in PvM especially at a crowded EM event..... no need to "pull" a bar because the monster will be red and therefore will have it's bar instantly appear under my "Enemies" tab.... I can target it just as fast as my reflexes allow... Same with seeing where the EM is.... under the yellow tab.... there they are... and a HUGE orange Arrow will bob over their head when I put my cursor over their bar.... It's AWESOME ..... want to know where a friend is???? Just put your cursor over their bar and down comes the big orange arrow.....

    Low on HP well You'll soon find out because you can hear your heart start to beat .... faster the beat closer to death you are.... nice warning over your screen "Low Life!"..... Run get a heal...

    Have 15 tamers and want them all set up the same..... easy go into your files copy the file of the template you want..... paste it into another shards folder rename the file and they are now identical..... that quick..... download Pinco's template editor for even easier template building.... Pinco should be given an award for all the work put into his/her UI. If I had money I'd give it over....

    Want to do MIB's??? Well with Pinco's just open the MiB and it'll plot the waypoint for you..... now just go to the dots and pick them up.....

    The only thing that brings me crawling to the 2d client is making broken stairs in house deco.... since you can't do it in the EC. Which I"m hoping and hoping they fix. And the occasional trade with untrusting folk who insist on using 2d.... and can't seem to see what I've put in the trade window.... I go to legacy mode on the containers but still sometimes they can't see it....

    I know I"m sure to tick folk off but I don't want to go into 2d to stock my vendor... deal with my chaos... because for me everything is neatly arranged in nice little boxes in the EC and I can see everything..... love the list view as well sometimes when shopping..... and it's no more annoying than those people that put things in unlabeled bags on their vendors and then still don't have anything IN them..... I hate trying to shop and finding empty vendors..... with empty bags on them.... Or having them say they are selling something and they aren't..... or having the bags labeled but not having what it says is in it in it..... having other garbage in there...
     
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  14. DJAd

    DJAd Stratics Legend
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    A few things that won me over to the EC. Not standard EC, but Pinco UI is a must.

    1. Auto slayers - I hit click a target, press my hotkey and char automatically equips correct slayer.
    2. Auto loot on anything
    3. The extra properties shown on items and what it unravels into
    4. The map with all the extra way points and markers and the tatical map.
    5. MIB waypoints
    6. Mobiles list showing all nearby targets of friend or foe.
    7. The extra info it shows when I click on people. It shows me resists, LMC, SDI, DI, HCI etc for the person I click on.
    8. New crafting interface. I didn't like it first but now it's grown on me.
    9. I can zoom out and see more on the screen or zoom in to see stuff up closer.
    10. The fact I'm not limited to a tiny gameplay window like in the CC.
    11. New paper doll gives easy access to all items on one page.

    Now, for all the people still using the CC please tell me why it's so much better?

    PLEASE don't say "its how UO is supposed to be" just won't wash as an excuse with me.

    I will accept "to make books" as a valid reason as this is broken in EC.

    Please don't forget the both clients are free but however great you say the CC is you still have to BUY and use UOAssist to make it any good. All the features are built into the EC as standard (macros etc) and then Pinco just adds more awesomeness. Again, for free.
     
    #14 DJAd, May 28, 2013
    Last edited: May 28, 2013
  15. Goldberg-Chessy

    Goldberg-Chessy Crazed Zealot
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    After reading the entire thread I have concluded that the EC completely sux arse without Pinco's UI

    Yay
     
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  16. Giggles

    Giggles Forum Administrator
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    I love using the EC, I have tried Pinco's UI and I am not a fan of it. I mainly PvP and it seems in PvP situation Pinco's UI tends to lock up and have graphical glitches where you see people that are no longer on your screen etc. Just plain ol EC is amazing for PvP.

    The Disadvantage? Being constantly accused of speed hacking.... As well as using other programs that enable you to cast much faster than normal.
     
  17. DJAd

    DJAd Stratics Legend
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    But does the CC not suck without UO assist?
     
  18. Uvtha

    Uvtha Grand Poobah
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    It's easier and MUCH faster when turning, and it automatically runs around obstacles. That alone should be enough. :p

    I don't use it (I just really dislike the aesthetics) but it clearly has more features, and works much better than the CC. Really the only reason I see not to use it is you don't like how it looks/feels.
     
    #18 Uvtha, May 28, 2013
    Last edited: May 28, 2013
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  19. Goldberg-Chessy

    Goldberg-Chessy Crazed Zealot
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    No. It doesnt.
    It looks like the same old awesome UO I have been playing for 14 years. UO Assist is now simply a pvp tool
     
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  20. Blitzkrieg

    Blitzkrieg Journeyman
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    So thats why people are always crying about you in chat? LOL.

    Ok so I am at least willing to try it. I will download it tomorrow after I get home.

    Thank you everyone for all the feedback I am impressed with all the in-depth information.
     
    DJAd likes this.
  21. Giggles

    Giggles Forum Administrator
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    Yes that is exactly why they are always crying =) On a side note the macro setup is so much easier once you get the hang of it. You can also make some pretty killer in-depth macros as well. I was not a fan of how it looked and felt at first, but after forcing myself to learn it and play on it....... the only time I use the CC now is when I have to stock my vendors. Vendors stocked by EC users make the CC users very angry lol. Almost everything piles at the top of the bag.
     
  22. xCatax

    xCatax Sage

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    Learn of Runescape , there are :

    - Classic client
    - Client 2007
    - Rs3 beta
    - Runescape

    You can choose where to play and everybody is happy , wish Ea could implement some Rs good ideas uo misses .
     
  23. DJAd

    DJAd Stratics Legend
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    You know you can switch to legacy container view for this?
     
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  24. swroberts

    swroberts Journeyman
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    Just make sure you install Pinco's. EC without Pinco's is just a sluggish CC.

    Then make your redress and pack organizer Macro's. Once you die and then redress instantaniously(Assist doesn't even come close)... Hit the organize pack button(takse a few seconds)...and you will never go back.

    The small things I love are...
    -Blood Oath screen splash
    -Gorgon Lenses Screen splash
    -Heartbeat
    -Redress and slayer weapon buttons. You can switch weapons..While healing youself...ueing special moves...watchen ur guildies health...and drinking a crown and coke..
     
  25. Petra Fyde

    Petra Fyde Peerless Chatterbox
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  26. cdavbar

    cdavbar Lore Master
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    Oh man oh man where to start. Oh yeah, EC + PincosUI is the way to go.

    • Anything UOAssist can do, EC+Pincos UI can do better.
    • Much improved macro system.
    • Addition of "actions" that can be used stand alone in a hot bar, hot key, or macro that will allow you to do many many things such as auto grab resources needed to fill bods, auto fill bod with items youve crafted, semi-auto mine/LJ ability with target resource action to name a few, but there are soooooo many good ones.
    • Auto Mobiles Bar
    • Auto Pets/Summons bar
    • Auto Durability Bar
    • Warnings for low life, low pet life, low durability
    • Quick loot entire container (only good stuff or what you set-up)
    • Right click quick loot.
    • Better overall UI
    • Two tile screen advantage over CC in PvP (They claim that the viewable area in which creatures and players show up is the same, no it isn't, I have tested and tested. EC has a clear advantage. Sometimes those two tiles can be a big game changer).
    • Zoomable
    • Everything is size adjustable.
    • Treasure maps can be re-sized and made bigger
    • World map can be re-sized and zoomed in on.
    • World map can be tilted (without file edits) to match treasure maps
    • SoS scrolls, when opened you can have it auto mark the spot on your world map, no more sextants, just open click and sail away.
    • Instant dress/undress/weapon switch action macros.
    I could go on and on and on.
    Only downside. Cannot turn desolation off in Fel. however if you like your trees naked, with the EC/Pinco's UI you can turn them off in Tram ruleset areas.
     
    mspossi, DJAd and Storm like this.
  27. THP

    THP Stratics Legend
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    sell u the EC... I CANT ..its a poor attempt at a 3d effect
     
    #27 THP, May 28, 2013
    Last edited: May 28, 2013
  28. MissEcho

    MissEcho Slightly Crazed
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    No idea why you and a lot of other people keep trying to claim the EC is somehow supposed to be a 3d client. This has never ONCE been stated by any dev or game designer, in fact it is quite the opposite, they have stated it is a 2d client since it's conception. No idea why people don't get their facts right before posting. Although this particular post is just a troll, the misconception that the EC is supposed to be some kind of 3d client is pure fallacy.
     
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  29. Frarc

    Frarc Stratics Legend
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    Just try it.

    Like many things , some people like certain things and some don't. Beauty is in the eyes of the beholder. :)
     
  30. THP

    THP Stratics Legend
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    hey ya takes a pick..i like the classic..i tried the 3d that was sooo very bad ....and ive tried the enhanced client and would not recommend it......ill stick with the classic 2d thankyou...like about 70% of the playerbase.....like i say each to there own....[figures from last poll on the subject]
     
    #30 THP, May 29, 2013
    Last edited: May 29, 2013
  31. THP

    THP Stratics Legend
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    oh wait we cant use ''poll percentages'' on these boards.... apparantly...unlike the rest of the real world maths and statics the polls on here dont reflect the population of UO in anyway...me bad..[whatever]
     
  32. Petra Fyde

    Petra Fyde Peerless Chatterbox
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    If you want to quote polls, the last ec/cc poll on here was pretty much even, with only slightly more voting for cc. The last poll on Stratics was a farce that most of us didn't bother to vote on at all. I certainly didn't.
    Polls on here show only a percentage of the people who bothered to vote on them.
    It reminds me of a certain RL ballot not long ago.. 55% of the people who voted were in favour of the poll's proposal. So that's what happened. Only trouble was, only 25% of the people eligible to vote actually did. 55% of 25% is hardly a majority in anyone's figures.
    The other problem is, most polls are severely biased, so people who might vote, don't. There is no option that they agree with.
    In short, they are not conclusive and don't mean a darn thing.
     
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  33. atinycow

    atinycow Adventurer

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    whats this 'patcher only' thing in pincos download section? do i want that or the other thing, the full thing?
     
  34. swroberts

    swroberts Journeyman
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    There is a Pinco's Stratics Board....where Pinco himself is pretty good about answering questions.
     
  35. Storm

    Storm UO Forum Moderator
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  36. The Zog historian

    The Zog historian Babbling Loonie
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    Completely correct. In real life, if someone doesn't participate in a poll, the pollster keeps going until he gets his 1000 responses, and there's often a valid choice "Not sure." That and a poll would actually ask something of worth, not "How many do you THINK?"

    I wouldn't even base CC versus EC usage on the screenshots posted. It's just can't be deemed representative of the population.
     
  37. atinycow

    atinycow Adventurer

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    protip: every single forum poll you make, include an extra option that just says "i like pie" or something. it'll suck up all the people who have no strong opinion but just wanna click on something. if it ends up that "i like pie" is the winning selection, then clearly the thing you made a poll about isn't really as important as you hoped.
     
  38. The Zog historian

    The Zog historian Babbling Loonie
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    I haven't seen anyone make something like this yet:

    Clipboard01.jpg

    I will say, though, that I needed the Enhanced Client today. There was a certain chest in a Fel town that spawned a lime, and of all the places, right under one of three shields. After a few days, it doesn't appear on top of the shields, only beneath. There's an NPC that doesn't move and can't be commanded to, and the NPC is so close that it's impossible to steal the shields without being guard-whacked.

    It took a while to install the EC, and ordinarily I hate the grid view, but it was useful here.
     
  39. Lady Storm

    Lady Storm Crazed Zealot
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    I wont try to diswade you from the EC... I play strictly the classic for a handful of very good reasons some not against the EC but because of it.
    The only way one can tell for their own peace of mind is to go use it for a few months. IF you find you don't like it so be it or if you find you like it a lot so be it too..
    It will not change facts of many here. Let your own trial be your guide not someone else's opinion of it.
     
    Lord Frodo likes this.
  40. Dermott of LS

    Dermott of LS UOEC Modder
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    ...

    I think enough people have covered the basics and features, so I will simply put it this way...

    Take AT LEAST a week, probably two depending on your amount of playtime given, and play NOTHING but the EC. Start from scratch. Don't try and copy over all of your CC settings, treat each character as brand new and rebuild. For each macro, skill, or spell you put in the hotbar, take the time to familiarize yourself with the targeting options, hotkeying options and so forth. Start with simply dragging each onto the hotbar before attempting to tackle the macro system (which can build some VERY complex macro scripts).

    As you get comfortable with the new UI, consider things such as hotbar, backpack, and Minimap placements, UI scale and gameplay window size. Next, you may be ready for a custom UI, so choose based on the ones available (the main one currently is Pinco's UI, but others are floating around) that suits your needs. Even within Pinco's are several UI Themes that change the look of the UI entirely such as Copper and Third Dawn that can be added accordingly.

    Read through the EC board here and don't be afraid to ask questions as the posters there are very knowledgeable about the client and we do what we can to keep the board civil and informative. There are many posts already existing from solving technical issues to building more complex macros.

    Once you've given yourself this timeframe, consider how the client is working for you versus the CC and make your decision.
     
  41. Storm

    Storm UO Forum Moderator
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    Excellent advice Dermott.
     
  42. Hannes Erich

    Hannes Erich Seasoned Veteran
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    Petra Fyde, I actually admire and respect you quite a bit, so don't take this the wrong way; but how the HECK do you allow a direct comparison thread like this to run on and on, but shut down a thread about a suggestion to improve the EC? Was I inappropriate during any stage of that suggestion? Did I encourage a hostile thread? Or did you just hop in there, read a sentence, call it a "client war" thread, and close it? Were you in a bad mood that day? Were you letting your bias hang out? With all due respect, seeing you merrily chatting away in this thread miffs me a bit, especially because you left my thread locked. I took a lot of time to think about and compose those suggestions. Do you think it's a justifiable irritation that you arbitrarily snuffed it out?

    To the OP, the evolution of features in the EC really take the cake. But if you were to stalk through my post history, you'd see me singing the praises of both clients, depending on what I was using at the time. So to be honest, I can't take sides because I'm on both sides!

    I always go back to the CC. The enhanced client is super advanced, efficient, full of conveniences and quality of life improvements, but its art direction will not age well. The classic client is still loved by many because the art was crafted soulfully and it shows. When you look at newer 2D isometric games on the market today, those done in the style of retro or pixel art (Yes it's still a genre in demand! Go look through Steam's RPG catalog!), classic UO still looks better than many of them. It's a clean, simple art style that has and will endure in computer RPGs.

    A long time ago, a well-known player on these forums came up with an idea to take the original art files (for every character, object and environmental tile in the CC), increase the resolution and then sharpen and clarify the image. It would have been a huge undertaking on her own, but several other artsy forum members jumped in to help. The result was a large set of BEAUTIFUL images (does anyone here have the link to that thread?), offered up to the devs as a highly persuasive suggestion.

    A suggestion which went ignored in favor of the then-flashier EC's graphics; although I like to imagine that Mesanna's team may have taken some inspiration from it for the higher resolution art in the pipeline for the EC.

    Honestly, my biggest (impossible) wish for UO is that they would create a client with just the EC's user interface and macro features, and ALL of the CC's beautiful, simple art--in higher resolution or not, either way it'd still be great--environment, characters, monsters, items, everything.

    And you know what, every time I suggest that, I get a PM or two basically saying, "Oh heck yeah, that'd be awesome!"
     
    #42 Hannes Erich, May 31, 2013
    Last edited: May 31, 2013
  43. Petra Fyde

    Petra Fyde Peerless Chatterbox
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    So far this conversation has been civil and discussed existing features and how to use them.
    It hasn't advocated closing either client. It hasn't derided either client. It hasn't implied that the game is on the brink of closing. Users have not (yet) resorted to attacking each other's choices with the usual 'if you don't see things my way you're an idiot' attitude which I absolutely hate to see and do far too often.

    It also isn't following closely on the heels of several highly charged threads that were advocating the closure of one or other client which had fostered a volatile and poisonous atmosphere.

    I accept that you had put a lot of thought into your ideas - but UHall wasn't the place to air them. Submit them to Mythic in an organised proposal possibly, but here you'll only get trolled.
     
    Storm likes this.
  44. Dermott of LS

    Dermott of LS UOEC Modder
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    ...

    That's the biggest problem I see in regards to the topic at hand. Granted it's gotten better over time, however during the KR days, I built up quite an ignore list based on anti-client trolling (not to mention reported a LOT from BOTH sides). Used to be simply posting a screenshot from EC or KR would turn the thread into a client war (usually started by a snarky anti-KR/EC comment) regardless of the actual topic at hand which was and is a shame, really.
     
  45. Hannes Erich

    Hannes Erich Seasoned Veteran
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    If any MMORPG community has the experience, wisdom and knowledge to discuss workable, profitable ideas for either this franchise or as-yet unborn franchises inspired by Ultima, well this could be where those sparks initially take flight. And you never know WHO is here, listening, reading, and posting.

    I don't generally post just to talk about minor bugs, or the weather. And I don't come here to take an adversarial stance with anyone reading this, that's never my intention. But I want to keep people talking and thinking about this game and franchise. As long as the game's still breathing, I'll probably keep making wild, crazy suggestions for it. If you're jaded to a point that you'll silence a topic because "no one listens anyway," that's unfortunate. It may be your belief, but it's not an irrefutable fact, and for the record, you are the one actively snuffing out community conversations based around ideas; and as much as I respect you in other aspects, I can't condone that. No name-calling, no mud-dragging, just a polite protest. I sympathize with the sixteen years of baggage, believe me, but please, don't take it out on me.

    I appreciate your response, if nothing else, it helped to clue me in on how I might craft a message in order to get it through the human filter here--which is a silly game, but one I'm willing to play if it means keeping my discussions open.

    Apologies for interrupting the flow of discussion--I hope people noticed the big part of my previous post that is on topic.
     
    #45 Hannes Erich, Jun 1, 2013
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2013
  46. Spiritless

    Spiritless Seasoned Veteran
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    lol, it's not like it is some kind of monumental life decision or something. Try both, stick with the one you prefer playing. Really is that simple.

    For what it's worth I was a staunch supporter of the CC up until I returned a few months ago and decided to give the EC a proper try. At first I thought the graphics and whatnot sucked, animations were terrible, etc. etc. but after making a solid attempt to play it for 1 month without switching back I can honestly say there are just too many minor conveniences and utilities available within it (with Pinco's) that I'd be hard pressed to return to the CC again. Even just the ease of which I can bind keys to certain skills, adapt their tagetting behavior just by right clicking on a menu and changing it, not having to avoid using letter keys on the keyboard for binds due to it actually typing letters into the chat box, etc. are minor things that make a big difference in my eyes. I even prefer the grid containers now.

    I find it weird switching back to the CC now and I think I'm at the point where I actually prefer the EC graphics/animations. The CC looks and feels quite limited to me now having used the EC for awhle. I honestly think it's just down to adapting. It's natural for the EC to feel weird at first and alien, but as you learn it you learn to appreciate all the small things.

    I personally feel you miss out on quite a lot of convenience if you're a CC user, but I'm not gonna pontificate about my client of choice. Honestly don't care what interface other people use to play the game. Pick one you're comfortable with and it's all good. Never really understood the tribal nature of the two "camps", but I guess it's like an IE/Firefox, Mac/PC kinda debate which will remain forever ongoing and will continue to be forever pointless. People can use what they like; they could be playing UO on a toaster with a pure ASCII client as far as I care, as long as they're playing UO that should be a good thing, right?
     
  47. Hannes Erich

    Hannes Erich Seasoned Veteran
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    Right, but the debate hasn't always been "forever pointless". It's easy to forget this in the present era, but the competitive tribal nature of the two camps stemmed from a very real dilemma for the community: the first 3D client had languished for years in favor of the community's favorite client, the original 2D CC; when all of the sudden, this new 3D client was planned and announced, and I think this put the writing on the wall for the CC users. At best, they would see development resources (money, staff, development time) pulled away from the CC, possibly forever (which is what happened); at worst, they would see the CC shuttered in favor of the publisher's whims.

    Don't forget that when the community got wind of EA/Mythic's plan to phase out the CC, the community erupted in a fireball so large that it forced EA/Mythic to backpeddle. Mind you, I'm a huge fanboy for the team at EA/Mythic and many teams before them, but hey, you can't get through 16 years without putting some colorful history behind you, eh? If you want to thank anyone for the CC's continued support, don't thank the dev team without also thanking yourselves--those of you who made all that noise, anyway. You got together in your camp and saved your game as you knew it, because that's what it took. Pointless? Not in the least.

    Today's client wars hail back to a time when it mattered, so if you want to know why those arguments seem infinitely more relaxed than in times past, I don't think it's only because the community has thinned out more. I think it's because, in the back of our minds, most of us probably realize the war is over; and with no clear winner, I guess that means it turned out alright, considering that it could have turned out so much worse.

    Long live UO. :arr:
     
    #47 Hannes Erich, Jun 7, 2013
    Last edited: Jun 7, 2013