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[Discussion] Should spawning "rares" be sold in the rares forum

Discussion in 'UO Rares Collector' started by Smoot, Jun 19, 2015.

?

What should be sold in the rares forum?

  1. Non-spawning rares only (traditional definition of a rare)

    58.8%
  2. Anything. Armor, deco, clothing, weapons, com deeds, peerless drops, as well as non-spawning

    29.4%
  3. Anything spawning, or not spawning, but keep it to deco, vet rewards, etc.

    11.8%
  1. Smoot

    Smoot Grand Poobah
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    The rares forum has always been a place to buy and sell rares. "rare" being interpreted by the vast majority of rares collectors being simply something which does not spawn. This had been stickied for many years at the top of the rares forum.

    Recently many many items that are not rare are being sold here.

    I have been told by @Captn Norrington to please report any threads selling spawning items personally.


    So the question is, should the rares forum be a place to sell anything? technically a one of kind legendary armor piece is more "rare" than any true, non-spawning rare like EM item or server birth one could argue.

    Please express your choice in the poll, and any reasoning behind it may be discussed but please stay on topic.

    Thankyou ---
    Smoot.
     
    #1 Smoot, Jun 19, 2015
    Last edited: Jun 19, 2015
  2. DJAd

    DJAd Stratics Legend
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    I think the whole "Trade forums" could do with tweaking. I would have something like this:

    Trader's Hall - Pets, houses, vet rewards, etc.

    Rares Collector - Anything "high value" or non spawning. Server births, rubble?, etc

    Loot Items - Armour, weapons, jewels etc.

    EM Drops - Anything dropped at EM event.

    Holiday Trading - As it is now.

    I would ditch the "non rares trade" section.
     
  3. Captn Norrington

    Captn Norrington Trade Forum Administrator
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    To clarify what each forum is currently designed to be used for, I will list their intended purposes below.

    Rares Collector

    Non-spawning items, including old holiday gifts, EM event items, and generally anything old that doesn't spawn anymore. However, this is a general guideline and does not mean we will move/delete a thread that if it has 99 items that no longer spawn and 1 that does spawn. This is because if we moved it to another forum, then the other 99 items would not fit. We try to categorize threads based on where the "majority" of the items fit in.

    Edit: please read this new sticky thread. http://stratics.com/community/threads/regarding-the-selling-of-items-that-still-spawn.343422/

    Traders Hall

    This forum is designed for still spawning items, including elite gear and craftables. People can post pretty much any items they want in this forum, although most people use it to sell gear and craftables. This forum is also the place to post price-checks on all non-rare items. meaning you can post a price check for a house teleport tile or something like that, but if you have a non-spawning rare it would be a better idea to post it in the rares collector forum for a price check. You are still allowed to ask for a price check on a non-spawning item in this forum, it is just not the best option usually.

    Non-Rares Trade

    This forum is designed for any item that still spawns in the game, however price checks should not be posted here, they should be posted in traders hall. This forum is pretty much the same as Traders Hall, except no price checks can be posted here. The goal in creating this forum was to get everyone to start posting all currently spawning items and gear for sale here, instead of in Traders Hall, and then leave Traders Hall as a forum only for price checks with no items being sold. That did not work out so now we have two almost identical forums unless people agree to start posting things here instead of Traders Hall.

    Holiday Trading

    This forum is for the Buying/Selling/Trading of current holiday items only. Once the items stop spawning people should buy/sell/trade them in rares collector or one of the other forums. This forum should only be used while the holiday gifts are still obtainable.
     
    #3 Captn Norrington, Jun 19, 2015
    Last edited: Jun 19, 2015
  4. BrianFreud

    BrianFreud Lead Wiki Mod & Doer of Crazy Things
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    The definition of a "rare" has always been fluid. There was a time when we had huge debates in here about whether EM drops would be allowed or considered "rares". What never has been questioned, however, were "server birth rares", "monthly rares", "weekly rares", "daily rares", "return home rares", "spawning rares" (glacial staffs, daemon bone armor, etc) - though there was often debate about which items were which type, or whether some (return home rares, for example) even existed.

    Over the course of many auctions, I've had more than a few items where folks attacked me in PM and ICQ, reported my auctions, posted off-topic debates in the auction, etc, because in all honestly they're looking for anything to complain about with my auctions. Why, I don't know. But I do know that it's happened repeatedly, from the same few people, and the claims often don't even make sense. A few examples:

    * event books with undyable hues being claimed to be common and completely reproducable
    * sigil metal and leather items being not rare because we have purple natural dyes
    * costumes being claimed to all still be spawning as common drops in the Abyss
    * Christmas and Halloween items from years ago not being rare because they drop every Christmas/Halloween (making the assumption that the same items drop/are gifted every year)

    I'm tired of it. Stratics has decided that "spawning" rares shouldn't be in this forum anymore. Ok, it doesn't make a lot of sense to me, but ok. ...But that also means no sales here of, for example, the current round of global crystals. They were being widely sold here by many after only 2 shards had had the event; they're "still spawning" until every last shard has had the event. As for things that actually aren't spawning, with regards to my auctions at least, if you have a question about something spawning or not, how about try a PM or ICQ, and we can figure it out, rather than the incorrect reports and off-topic posts in the auction.

    In the most recent series of auctions, I kept anything spawning, rare or not, out of all auctions in the rares forum except for the last auction. That auction, 14i, was the "cleanup" auction. After every auction I run, invariably there's posts from folks looking to buy the unsold items. Plus, I had a few bags of items I'd missed listing. So I ran 14i to give all those items a quick place to auction off, rather than have all the auction threads keep getting bumped. After 14h (the commodities and spawning rares auction) ended last night, I moved any unsolds over to 14i, like with all of the other auctions. I'd specifically already stated "Please forgive me for any spawning rares here; I didn't want to run 2 cleanup auctions". That auction ends at 9 tonight. Those items will have been listed for auction here, in this forum, for less than 23 hours. Yet, within the first 12 hours of those items being listed here, less than 5 people had already filed over 20 reports about that auction, trying to force it into being removed (and on the last day of bidding for the entire auction, no less). Really folks?

    I keep hearing complaints from people saying they aren't able to sell their EM drops and other rares. All I know is, so far, there's 48 different people who've happily bought items in this auction series, and the same was true last time around. But I'm sick and tired of getting attacked for running the auctions. I even get reported or "over bumping threads" when I reply to answer questions asked in the auctions. The question being asked here, and the poll is meaningless; Stratics will set its own policy regardless what the result is. But perhaps, rather than worry about me, my auctions, Stratics policy, or the rest, simply stop trying to bite other folks in the back , and instead worry about finding that rare you want, or a price that people are willing to pay for that rare you have for sale.
     
    Christina Kardos and Lexfixr like this.
  5. Lexfixr

    Lexfixr Seasoned Veteran
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    I think Brian runs a very clean and thoroughly detailed auction this whole definition of "rares" is a nebulous term. Rares are in the eyes of the beholder --- but seriously can we not all play nice in this sandbox without nitpicking
     
    Christina Kardos likes this.
  6. Captn Norrington

    Captn Norrington Trade Forum Administrator
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  7. Smoot

    Smoot Grand Poobah
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    I agree. Brian is an invaluable resource and not many would take on what he does. especially because as far as i know the items in his auctions arent even his. He does this purely to help others sell their stuff.

    As for the definition of a rare, its widely accepted as non-spawning because that was what the forum moderators (who were well known rares collectors) defined for the purpose of this forum for many past years, and was one of the first threads a person saw when visiting the forum.

    I agree times change, i also think they should be defined when they change. Or you have people not understanding why they were told not to post items in the past, but are seeing those same items for sale now.

    All in all its not a huge issue, this poll was made to see the general consensus of what this forums users would prefer.
     
    Christina Kardos likes this.
  8. Nails Warstein

    Nails Warstein Rares Festival Silent Auctioneer
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    I would prefer one forum and just tagging the item highlighted as to whether its an event item

    server birth
    pre-patched
    veteran reward
    seer item
    undocumented rare
    holiday item
    champion spawn drop
    pets
    houses
    doggy dupe
     
  9. Alexander of ATL.

    Alexander of ATL. Rares Fest Host | Atl June 2013
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  10. Captn Norrington

    Captn Norrington Trade Forum Administrator
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    Ya, sorry about that, working on removing the poll now, I didn't realize the poll breaks when the thread gets locked. might have to re-post the whole thread, the poll is being difficult to remove heh. Feel free to post feedback here if you have any.

    Edit: ok, poll is deleted, once again, sorry about that I did not realize it would break.
     
  11. Restless

    Restless Certifiable
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    if i ran the forums, which i don't, i would classify a rare as something that either no longer spawns or spawns so rarely that it commands a very high price. blaze cu's still spawn, but so rarely that they sell for over a bil. named obsidian statues still have a chance to happen as far as i know, but there's only a few of them that exist. things like weps and armor that command a high price due to properties should not be classified as rares, and clearly the best place to sell those would be in the traders hall anyways because that's where the majority of the prospective buyers of those items would be.
     
    Alexander of ATL. likes this.
  12. Jason-

    Jason- Slightly Crazed

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    I haven't been in this area but for maybe 5-6 months and in that time I feel like things in the Rares forum run very smoothly. As we say in the south...." If it Aint Broke Dont fix it" haha. With that being said, I do agree that some things are rares and some aren't and it can't be left up to the eye of the beholder because who is to determine where the line is drawn if that is the case. If it is a spawning rare, but still fetches a fair amount of gold(maybe over 1m) then I think it should be allowed in here. Don't the 1337 Shovels still spawn? I would call them rare for sure and they sell for 20m+ if I am not mistaken. I don't think you can try to regulate a auction that has sooo many different items in it tho. But maybe there should be a Auction thread for all the auctions...although like I said at the beginning of my post...my view of the rares forum is that it runs very well and should stay exactly like it is.
     
  13. Captn Norrington

    Captn Norrington Trade Forum Administrator
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    The problem with this, is that prices change. what if one day someone finds 50 blaze cu's in their stable and sells them all totally killing blaze cu prices, and now blaze cu's are only worth 100m. are they still allowed for sale in the rares forum? There is no way to base things on price because prices can change so frequently it creates a gigantic gray area in the rules that just confuses people.
     
  14. Flutter

    Flutter Always Present
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    I don't want to have to weed through even more posts. Please. Rares only.
     
  15. Restless

    Restless Certifiable
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    perhaps the price thing would create a gray area and cause some issues if a flood of the item in question comes up. i guess i would just let people post things in the forum that is normally frequented by the best possible buyers. such as my named obsidian statue example from earlier, i can't think of a more proper group of people to try and sell one of those to than the rare community, it would certainly stand out and hold a lot of esteem in any museum, but since it can technically still be created it doesnt qualify under the current set of rules to be posted here. maybe a rule should be set that says only non-spawning rares and then state a couple possible exceptions, such as the obsidian, and then change and update the exceptions as the time/situation dictates
     
  16. BrianFreud

    BrianFreud Lead Wiki Mod & Doer of Crazy Things
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    :p We get maybe half a page of new posts a day anymore, on a good drop day... I miss the days of coming to Stratics a decade ago, and finding 10 pages of new threads to check out in each of the forums I follow.
     
  17. slippjeem

    slippjeem Certifiable
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    The shovel still spawns go to cove and do the quest you have to kill thousands of headless to get it....
     
  18. slippjeem

    slippjeem Certifiable
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    See that is the problem I only know 1 person that knows every quest and has all the items that were gotten without buying any, and she isn't on Atlantic either, but has 3 18x18's with more quest items then you will ever see.
     
  19. BrianFreud

    BrianFreud Lead Wiki Mod & Doer of Crazy Things
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    That would be interesting to see; can you give directions? :)
     
  20. slippjeem

    slippjeem Certifiable
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    I have a rune on GL or just yell for Ang in gen chat.