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Slayers Talisman do they work for mages?

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Cazzador, Dec 2, 2009.

  1. Cazzador

    Cazzador Guest

    Well the title say it all. Thank you.
     
  2. Konge

    Konge Lore Master
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    No, not to my knowledge
     
  3. jfkeach

    jfkeach Guest

    if you do summons like evs or elementals yes they do help. just like they help tamers.
     
  4. G.v.P

    G.v.P Stratics Legend
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    ? I'll have to try that ... I always thought tamers who used bird slayer tallies were straight newb, guess if this tally fact is true I iz da noob but seems odd to attach a tally and have followers do extra dam.

    mages used to be able to use tallies but EA changed it cause they said it was not intended :(
     
  5. Nails

    Nails Journeyman
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    No, they are melle and tamer (I think that might be unintended) only.
     
  6. aarons6

    aarons6 Certifiable
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    do talismen really help tamers?????
     
  7. Konge

    Konge Lore Master
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    I doubt it unless someone screwed up the code to affect followers.
     
  8. Bardie

    Bardie Lore Keeper
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    doesn't help my pets...tested it on swoops and nothing changed. Also sometimes they wear that tali to boost there skills *points finger at self* hard running a 800+ skill point char w/o it :)
     
  9. jfkeach

    jfkeach Guest

    Time how long it takes to kill swoop with greater if not wearing bird slayer tally.... kill 5. Then time how long it takes with tally. again kill 5. you might not see the yellow flash but in my experience it does help tamers.

    Here is a helpful link on slayers.

    http://www.uoguide.com/Slayer

    Notice... Talismans do not affect spells...
     
  10. jfkeach

    jfkeach Guest

    I just conducted some tests. Took Greater Dragon to swoops.

    Here are the results....
    Wearing Bird Slayer - averages 2.5 minutes to kill swoop
    Without Slayer - Average 4.5 mins to kill swoop (One took over 5 minutes to kill swoop)
    Without Slayer but with +20 DI on Talisman - 2.75 Minutes to kill swoop

    Conclusions I draw from this test. Slayer Talisman does work for pets. I would assume works for summons as well. In absence of a Slayer talisman, I am going to start wearing Primer Tallisman on tamer, because the DI still helped.

    Feel free to test yourself.
     
  11. Yes, it works for pets and summons. Nonetheless, the situation is still arguably unfair to mages. Mages unfairly receive only the cons (apart from summoning), while dexxers fairly receive both the pros and the cons.

    As pointed out by Galen (ie. Galen's Player) here, as soon as you wear the conjurer's trinket, you will receive double damage (and also suffer from a negative penalty to your DCI) from monsters of the opposite group (ie. Reponds, eg. despise champ spawn monsters, are the opposing group to Undead), even though as a mage your direct damage spells do not do double damage to undeads.
    http://www.uoforums.com/uo-general-...ul-seeker-vorpal-blade-conjurers-trinket.html
     
  12. Mistura

    Mistura Lore Keeper
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    Could this thread contain any more incorrect information?

    DCI penalty for wearing the undead slayer against opposing monsters has to the be the worst of it :twak:
     
  13. TheLetterQ

    TheLetterQ Journeyman
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    To deal with that in-equality for mages they have the conjurers spellbook. That's where mages get their undead slayer bonus. And it's a half way decent book to boot. So it was balanced as intended...just because you don't want to play that way doesn't mean it's not balanced.

    Q
     
  14. Yen Sid

    Yen Sid Guest

    Ok lol. So dexxers can use a tali and a weapon while mages cant get the benefit from the tali and are forced to use just the book (weapon). Makes sense.:twak:
     
  15. Did you forget this is mages online? Mages are by far the most powerful and most versatile out of all of the character types in the game.
     
  16. ACB1961

    ACB1961 Lore Keeper
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    Not at the cavern they arent. Basically here's how all this works. You have to match different chars for different situations. There's lots of times mages are the best. Woohoo! However, nothing compares with a sammy pal or sammy bush at some places. Even the tamers leave the cavern, (since i have ALL the chars you can believe I'd be playing something different if it was better).
     
  17. ACB1961

    ACB1961 Lore Keeper
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    I can't wait to try this. Theres no way in the world it takes my dragon 4.5 mins to kill a swoop, but who knows this might actually work. tyvm for the information
     
  18. That's not the point. We pvpers want the conjurer's trinket for the 10% HCI, HPR 2 and DI 20%, and couldn't care less about the slayer property. But now as long as you equip the talisman, even if you're a mage who doesn't get to use the slayer property, you will still suffer from double damage from repond monsters.

    It isn't balanced in this sense. But as with everything else unbalanced in UO, we all have to accept it and work with it. No prob.
     
  19. mbraud4

    mbraud4 Sage
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    If you are a pvper join factions and wear the faction tally, woA!~!!!~!~!!~!!! problem solved, but there is stat loss, but then again a real pvper doesnt care about stat loss.
     
  20. G.v.P

    G.v.P Stratics Legend
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    Yes, dexxer, but when mages were allowed to use things such as Ice Slayer talismans to kill White Wyrms a bit easier (oh, how fun it was to kill a WW in a EXP FS ;) ), I don't think dexxers were crying about it being unfair, were they? :p.

    It wasn't broke, but EA said it was, and then disallowed mages to use any of the talisman slayers ;(. I'd sign my name to get them back!

    Once my Sampire gets a self repair fencing wep I'll never have to repair anything ever again. Hm. Dexxers are so much better in 1v1 PvM it's not even funny. As ACB1961 said, regarding the Cavern, have to just pick your char for the right situations.
     
  21. Harb

    Harb Guest

    Most of the threads here don't necessarily need a dev to comment, this one seems to me a good thread for one to chime in on. I sincerely don't know the answer, my impression is that talis do not help mages or tamers. I haven't played a "main" for about a decade, opting for the appropriate character to each situation. As such, I probably know a lot about a lot, but everything about nothing. IMO nothing is broken, so nothing along these lines requires a fix, but it would be nice to factually know so we can all make our choices more wisely :)
     
  22. jfkeach

    jfkeach Guest

    I named my dragon BEAST. He is a beast. He does serious damage, and has great resists. His combat skills are 117.4 for the wrestling, 122 for tactics, and he has 111.3 resist and it still going on. 120 Magery. GM on the rest. His HP is 960 i think. Yes, I can easily see the difference between slayer tallisman and not.

    The thing that shocked me was I wore the conjurer's trinket for the di. It worked as well as the talisman for the bird slayer from the library, without the taking more damage from repond.

    I am going to switch to the Primer for my tamer unless I have a specific slayer tally for what I am fighting. It has to help.
     
  23. Harb

    Harb Guest

    Actually jfk a few points difference between a given swoop in its phys and fire resists may fully account for the difference. But the same could have swung the other way, so who knows!!
     
  24. jfkeach

    jfkeach Guest

    I did lore swoops.. i didnt write downt skills or stats but the differences were actually negated by the stronger swoops died quicker because i was wearing the tallies.
     
  25. WarUltima

    WarUltima Babbling Loonie
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    Hahahahahahaa greatest UO joke of the year.
     
  26. T'Challa

    T'Challa Certifiable
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    Good Lord you're not kidding!
     
  27. Mistura

    Mistura Lore Keeper
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    I seriously doubt that wearing a tali in any way effects your pets damage output.
     
  28. WarUltima

    WarUltima Babbling Loonie
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    1. Talisman does NOT do jack for pet nor summons damage. NO NOT EVEN just a little bit... it's zero, not 3% not 2% not 1%. It's NOTHING.

    2. Talisman slayer does NOT work with spells (only work for weapon hits).

    3. Double damage taken from opposing slayer group monsters affects all players, mage AND dexers.

    4. Double damage taken IS STILL IN PLACE even if you are also using a repond slayer weapon. It does NOT cancel out.

    5. This thread has so much false information it's not even funny. We even got people saying mage being the most powerful in UO now. 7 years ago maybe... but how is this has anything to do regarding to mage getting shafted in talisman slayer category?


    :stretcher:
     
  29. Winker

    Winker Babbling Loonie
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    So how come my taming tali (Library Talisman-Birds Of Britannia Random Summoner) Has the stats Taming +5 Animal Lore +5 and is a Bird slayer?

    If these slayer were not meant to be used by Tamers why make one that is for a tamer? I would suggest if one slayer works for the tamer (Bird Slayer) they all would work for the tamer.

    Following this logic on to its conclusion, a mage would get the same benefits from a tali if they are casting EV's, Demons, Elementals etc as they are classed as pet
     
  30. WarUltima

    WarUltima Babbling Loonie
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    NO NO NO...
    If you were right, my mare beetle combo would be hitting swoops for 190 damage a hit. NO NOT EVEN CLOSE.

    Please dude, spend 1 minutes and test it out with ur super dragon on a fern or something that's a bird. If your dragon did 150ish damage to a bird before you wear the tali it should do 300ish with your talisman on ASSUMING what you said WAS correct.

    Jeez. :stretcher:
     
  31. Mistura

    Mistura Lore Keeper
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    Hi Draco

    I seriously doubt even the birds of britannia slayer increases your pets damage output, remember, not all properties on every artifact are designed to work together for every purpose.

    Perhaps the bird slayer property is designed for a tamer archer :p

    I mean, the only person who's actually tested this and thinks that pets do more damage with slayer is jkfeach who also thinks that di on the primer increases pet damage............so I think we can take any tests he does with a pinch of salt :popcorn:
     
  32. Winker

    Winker Babbling Loonie
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    Fair coment :thumbup1:
     
  33. TheLetterQ

    TheLetterQ Journeyman
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    If you're getting hit by repond monsters then your in hand-to-hand range and attempting to wrestle. You SHOULD be taking the damage...it's a melee skill wether you're good at it or not.

    Q
     
  34. Obsidian

    Obsidian UO Forum Moderator
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    I'm ok with mages not getting the benefit of the slayer property from talismans. With the exception of the undead slayer on the Conjurer's Trinket, the only talisman slayer types available are Mondain's Legacy slayers.

    What I would like to see, however, is spellbooks, necromancy books, and mysticism books with the Mondain's Legacy slayer types such as Vermin, Mage, Ice, Flame, etc. These should be craftable by a scribe with the chance to craft somewhere in the middle between a regular slayer book and the chance to craft a super slayer book.

    With the Conjurer's Grimoire being the mage's co-equal to the Conjurer's Trinket, I think this recommendation is balanced. It should be relatively easy to add to the coding with Mondain's Legacy common to all (even those that never paid for the upgrade).

    -OBSIDIAN-
     
  35. TheLetterQ

    TheLetterQ Journeyman
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    It might make more sense for them to be be given out in the ML Quests..just like the talismans do...The slayer property is not that common...so it could be a rare drop.

    If we can't craft talismans.....why be able to craft books?

    Q
     
  36. Obsidian

    Obsidian UO Forum Moderator
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    Fair point. Maybe the devs could add a chance to get a spellbook with special mods (like invasion books had) with a rare chance for a book with a ML slayer. Not sure which heartwood quests would fit this but I would love to see the addition for us mages.

    -OBSIDIAN-