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State of factions!

Discussion in 'UO Spiels N Rants' started by cazador, Jun 24, 2013.

  1. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    Are we getting rid of them?

    Are getting something useful?
     
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  2. SlobberKnocker

    SlobberKnocker Slightly Crazed

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    no but u can buy a really nice lamp from the kings collection.
     
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  3. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    Sign me up!! I hope it costs more than $4.99!!!! My character will look so snazzy in my king deco'd house!!!
     
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  4. PJay

    PJay Seasoned Veteran
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    Something we would all like to know :)

    I suspect its on the list but just above is remove felucca.
     
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  5. SlobberKnocker

    SlobberKnocker Slightly Crazed

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    u could drink some nice minoc porter and place the lamp shade on your head. then you'd be stylin!
     
    #5 SlobberKnocker, Jun 26, 2013
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2013
  6. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    I wish Messana would just throw out a producers letter already..


    We don't care about fel, never really did..

    Stop asking for us to fix factions, we don't care

    If you don't like the PvP the way it's currently setup, I suggest you make a blue tamer and go farm shame..that's fun too :)

    And...invest in SOTA, because that's where I'll be looking for a job after I'm done enhancing tram and destroying fel and erase the fel ruleset altogether..

    Safe Travels in UO my Trammy friends


    Focker OUT!
     
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  7. SlobberKnocker

    SlobberKnocker Slightly Crazed

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    Nice troll. post the picture please.
     
  8. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    ImageUploadedByTapatalk1372284475.205204.jpg


    Happy?


    But in all seriousness..when we getting some love?
     
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  9. Lady Storm

    Lady Storm Crazed Zealot
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    Oi Vey

    Look rather then putting words in anyone mouth or second, third or even beyond guessing any Dev's reasoning Factions was a bust from day 1.

    Chaos and Order was working very well and unless you were born under a rock in outer Mongolia it was pretty strait forward in how it ran.
    They never should have changed it.
    I understand you want everything INSTANT.. coffee.. hot cereal.... even your fighting in a game...
    But lets do a reality check....
    UO lost a lot of players for bad publishes and choices of content as each publish came and went... not everyone likes change or lack of it to their liking.

    Reason UO is low on any factions play...
    many have grown tired of it... Really Tired of it and the cost of keeping up with the jones of uo
    Age has made them grow in mind as well and beating the crap out of some other player looses flavor after 999 thousand kills
    There is more things to do in RL then run after some other guy in a game.. and UO don't run too well on their ipad/iphone..
    Wife and kids have threatened to bust computer and divorce them if they play any longer then a few minutes... ignoring your family is a big no no
    Hubby has had enough of tv dinners or take out when your guild needs you to join them
    Lost job and need to conserve cash for things like food and rent..... you know the necessary things of maintaining life.

    Player numbers are down in factions... its fact

    Given the time and money constraints Mesanna is under and her team is down by a few good people... to expect what once came out of 20 or more Dev to come out of 5 or 6... is asking for me to serve liver for dinner.. it anit gunna happen!

    As a side note:
    Reasons UO and every other game company out there is loosing ground... is that their company went public. Meaning Stockholders.
    This meant stock was sold and its those stock holders and board members who run them do not like not making a buck off their investment.
    Even if EA made 300 million last year and 310 million the year before all the Board and the investors saw was a 10 million dollar loss in their portfolio.
    They don't care you love the game and want more things even if your going to pay the company for it.
    All they care is what dividends their investment brings in each month/quarter/year. And your piddly purchase is not gunna raise the cash to mean much to them.
    EA like all the other company's right now are fated to get lesser influx of players and cash and that's due to the fact we want our games to go with us hence the greater number of smart phones and tablets and notebooks and the sales of home computers is down big time.
    Can you run UO on a ipad? idk I don't own one.... yet
    But its not even the F2P market.. they are taking nose dives too...
     
  10. PJay

    PJay Seasoned Veteran
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    Faction numbers were pretty high for fel a few publishes ago and then they made changes for reasons no one can explain which made everyone drop out of a system which was designed for fel and pvp but they added pvm to it WHY?

    Mesanna and her team have plenty of time to add pixel crack every publish and revamp / modify / mess up armor beyond belief.

    There are also very few fel players because Trammel gets the works why bother going to fel there just isn't any point and some people will throw power scrolls stat scrolls champs in with the reasons. Everyone just goes to a shard that's not their prime time and farms fel while its native population are in bed.

    If you do happen to be on a shard which has players who venture into fel they have the option of having a faction stealth char in an opposing faction get one hit on you and your statted even though most of the damage was by non faction players.

    The problem with the current Dev team is poor management. I know a lot of old players who left because of things which were added to the game and the ones who pvp'd all say the same thing 'The Devs have no idea what pvp is'.

    They build houses with no foundations and we all know how that ends up.....
     
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  11. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    This of course begs the question of if you were in Factions solely for the Faction Artifacts and (before then) the blessed Faction Runics.

    If that was your sole reason for being in Factions, that to me is excellent cause to question if you ever really were a Faction player in any meaningful sense.

    -Galen's player
     
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  12. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    Faction numbers were high because a number of Fel players joined it solely for the Artifacts and then ignored Faction play save the minimal amount required to purchase and otherwise maintain the Artifacts. (The hard-core Factioners, who played Factions for Factions' sake, were slowly-squeezed out.)

    This required Fel players to join Factions for maximum effectiveness -- or so the argument from non-Faction PvPers went -- thereby causing an outcry that resulted in the change, which itself then resulted in another outcry.

    To say the Publish "added" PvM to Factions is ridiculously and ignorantly inaccurate. You could get silver from PvM for years, that Publish just made you do it more often in order to maintain the Artifacts. And if you were in Factions for Factions' sake, you did not need the Artifacts to keep you in.


    Pixel crack is Fel shorthand for "stuff I don't like." Nothing about the recent armor publish messed up armor unless you decided to get into the unnecessary "refinement" system, in which case it was your own decision in the face of the conventional wisdom -- and then it's your own fault.

    Trammel gets stuff because most people play there and a long list of incentives to get people to go to Fel have not worked. Fel is a failed business model. This is an issue that's been addressed in dozens or hundreds of threads over the years and the choice many posters make to ignore reality does not change the underlying reality that's being ignored.

    Skill loss is a disadvantage of being in Factions, yes. I had to deal with it, and yes so do you.

    -Galen's player
     
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  13. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    It's funny; Chaos and Order was an under-used system until it was ended, then it suddenly became something people were nostalgic for. I remember people on LS who would make fun of Chaos/Order for its allegedly being full of inferior PvPers, relative to Factions, and me facing ridicule for pointing out that in Order/Chaos you couldn't hide in Trammel. (I was never in Order/Chaos myself, was merely defending a friend's decision to leave Factions for Order/Chaos.)

    I kind of got lost in the rest of your post and hence addressing it is difficult, but I just had to address the latest installment of "UO Nostalgia."

    -Galen's player
     
  14. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    Yea man, exactly!

    Not sure when I ever said or implied that the reason factions suck are due to items..this is more of my list

    -being statted by a group of 8 blues and one orange stealth archer who gets a 10 point hit in the assure I'm stat..

    -the absolute ridiculous grind the obtain artifacts..ok so level 1 (50k silver) every month..go eff yourself really..not a problem ill just go get kills and increase my level..problem is NOBODY plays faction anymore (refer to first issue)

    -ok well I'll hop on my thief and steal the sigils and get a horse breeder(wait the I can't :/ hmm (sigil is still in corruption, no big deal) .. Go back every day for a week(still bugged) page a GM..he says he will look into it..2 days later mind you (so I wait patiently) a week later I try (still corrupted WTF!!!) forget that idea..

    ..you're completely missing the point of my factions needs to scrapped completely, the devs have borked almost all playability completely..now if you can overlook the one stealther footing you for a 8 man blue gank to stat you..what do you have left?

    -a tedious grind to obtain faction gear (which used to just be a faction crafter+silver) which now for some time is just go kill "x" monster "x" amount if times till you've reached you desired amount.."engage your silver script bot"

    -not worth taking towns(if you can even steal sigils) for there's almost ZERO benefit unless you just want a pretty mutant horse..the Reg/Bottle Vendors aren't even worth the hassle anymore considering you get it just as cheap at the Ter Mur provisioner..

    - or you can partake in the yew gate fighting against another faction team and watch them round up the blue troops to stat you and talk smack in Gen Chat how awesome they are at being lame and not actually wanting a fight..

    ..so you see factions are not only STUPID now..but pointless, hence the reason why 1 of 10 players actually join it..


    ..I still don't get why Pro-Trammel players even comment on factions considering its supposed to be a PvP system, and most of the reason the system was crapped on to begin with..but HEY, you have governors now..play your trammel "faction" system
     
  15. Picus at the office

    Picus at the office Certifiable
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    I loved factions till everyone left.
     
  16. PJay

    PJay Seasoned Veteran
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    @ Galen

    Without the faction arties no one would be in factions because they are broken as for pvm, before the silver costs were upped raiding champs could get you the silver required to get the arties you needed then they lasted for as long as you were in factions... Now every month players are forced to farm silver to be in a pvp system........

    Because people were in factions others joined even if they didn't need arties it is fun to play but to allow it to be abused my trammies shows the lack of knowledge the changes were based on tbh.

    As for pixel crack no i don't want it i don't see any benefit to the game but what i do know is devs have spent hours and hours creating a wooden shelf when the fundamentals of the game are broken. The systems must always be the priority because if they fail or can be abused the disappointment does far more harm than if a wooden shelf is in deed form or not or if a purple flower is fuchsia.

    Changes id like are:
    Reduce silver required at rank one for arties
    To be put into stat an opposing faction must have done over 75% of the damage

    But if they cant / don't know how to fix it just get rid and give us something simple because its quite clear there will be no development in fel.
     
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  17. Winter

    Winter Lore Keeper

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    Be careful of what you ask for. The developers have forgot the KISS principle, and make any system as difficult as possible and call it "fun." Elections... Trade Deals... Refinements...

    I can see the new Shield Wars Of Sosaria, each player will equip a craftable shield of good or evil alignment.

    There will be four different tiers with ten ranks each, and each tier requires a more difficult to craft shield with even more rare resources, resources that don't stack. The four tiers are Foot Soldier, Sargent, Lieutenant, and General. Ranks are gained within a tier through opponent kills.And ranks decay at a rate of one per day. Go on a two week vacation and you start over. Lose a tier, and your shield can't be equipped.

    Crafting the shield requires skills of a blacksmith, tinker, tailor, alchemist, stone mason, and lumberjack. Each craft skill requires a tedious quest to gather innumerable resources that don't stack... and can only be found in Felucca. Your knowledge of making the war shields fade with time, so you have to redo each quest once a month.

    And the shields are cursed... and brittle.

    And tamers aren't allowed to target anyone.
     
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  18. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    ^lol^ thank you for that!
     
  19. Picus at the office

    Picus at the office Certifiable
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    Pub 83 as player clearly asked for it.
     
  20. Mervyn

    Mervyn Certifiable
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    OK here's the deal.

    It may sound like people are constantly complaining about PvP. But I for one would like to remind everyone that the game mechanics at the moment in terms of balancing issues between dexxers and mages etc are quite good, there are lots of different templates out there that work well.

    The problem now is that they've fixed PvP but taken away the reasons to PvP.

    The ONLY item available in fel now that you can't get in trammel is stat scrolls, and with free cross shard trading you can do harrowers on dead shard at dead time with no competition and get the scrolls that is why a 25 stat scroll is not worth the 1000 million it should be worth.

    I still think a fel only shard (where you can't cross shard) with ilsh and ter mur etc in a fel ruleset would attract a lot of players.
     
  21. Winker

    Winker Babbling Loonie
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    So play seige then, sounds just like the shard of your dreams
     
  22. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    No it wouldn't..we have siege, and siege sucks..what makes you think the exact same ruleset would work?
     
  23. Mervyn

    Mervyn Certifiable
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    I'll play Siege if they add item insurance.
     
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  24. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    I'm not sure their diehards would like that much..I would actually say the opposite..i said siege sucks..I'm going to retract that statement, because it doesn't..the lack of players on siege sucks..or else it'd be more fun


    With that said I'd rather talk about factions, then siege I've had those conversations a lot..

    The PvP isn't the problem merv, PvP is fun for a few hours a week..there isn't nothing that makes you log on to fight anymore..ie: server wars, faction raids/protects..big Harry (once a blue moon)

    My icq isn't booming with PvP anymore, now a days it's.."anyone on wanna go pick a fight" that's boring IMO..we should have something to fight over again
     
  25. PJay

    PJay Seasoned Veteran
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    Wow Winter that sounds amazing just what i was looking for hehe :)
     
  26. hen

    hen Certifiable
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    Most of the diehard left with AOS. Siege rules and an item based game just doesn't work.
     
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  27. TheDrAJ

    TheDrAJ Slightly Crazed
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    I think we need a faction only shard - and get rid of them everywhere else.

    oh

    and get rid of trammel also!
     
  28. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    It's obvious...but again so has most of the population
     
  29. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    I'm for a good vs evil (chaos/order) and allowing reds into trammel to make fights happen in different venues..again it's not an RP system don't join if you don't want the PvP..as for reds coming to tram..I don't see an issue if they can't attack blues there's no problem..not saying the blues can't attack you tho
     
  30. Mervyn

    Mervyn Certifiable
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    agreed, no items to fight for anymore. Even if they made ALL artifacts only available in fel, you've now got the issue of free shard transfers with vet reward shard shields.
     
  31. Mervyn

    Mervyn Certifiable
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    This game is now so dull and boring, I'm on the forums, can't be asked to log in.
     
  32. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    Even if its not something to fight to get, something to fight over..and not pixelated stones or horses..what about we use the same ideas that the tram side has in effect with elections and make it better..

    3 Factions

    Blue-good
    White-neutral
    Red-evil

    And each "faction" has its own unique buffs
     
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  33. PJay

    PJay Seasoned Veteran
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    Whatever the changes / additions the only way they can revive pvp / factions is to attract people into being red or being a pvper. imo the faction arties went someway to achieve this as when they were added an immediate influx of pvp occurred.
    But it also meant blues could join a faction use the arties in trammel Ive expressed my opinion that if Blue players are in trammel and in opposing factions pvp should be able to take place they are after all at war with each other.
     
  34. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    I have to assume there should have been a sentence break here.

    There, however, were people in Factions before the Faction Artifacts.

    I was a big proponent of them when they first came out because it seemed beneficial to have a reward for participation in Factions that was external to Factions.

    I was dead, dead wrong. The increased participation by hard-core PvPers hurt Factions by displacing the hard-core Factioners.

    The assertion was made that the changes forced PvM.

    That assertion was incorrect. PvM was always required.


    I cannot follow this sentence.

    Perhaps you mean "allow it [meaning Factions] to be abused BY trammies" as opposed to "my trammies?"

    In which case I say the abuse was never by Trammel players, that was a myth. The abuse was by Fel players who only participated in Factions in a rudimentary and minimalistic way.

    Someone having a Faction Artifact in Trammel did not hurt you no matter who you were. However if you were a PvPer with no interest in Factions and tried to fight someone with Faction Artifacts, that did potentially hurt you.

    Also Faction Artifacts never were in wide use in Trammel to the extent that folks complained. It was a myth.

    Again: "pixel crack" really means content that you do not like. It is an issue of preference passed off as objectivity.

    I'm not saying there's nothing objective; I'm not saying something that for example an issue that made, say, Atlantic unplayable shouldn't have precedence over some deco item. But look at it this way: I'm betting the stuff added in the King's Collection will impact more people than basically any PvP changes will, because PvP is very much a niche market. It likes to be a niche market. It shows off what a niche market it is by actively discouraging further participation.

    Save when it suddenly seem advantageous to be more mainstream.

    -Galen's player
     
  35. The Zog historian

    The Zog historian Babbling Loonie
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    I gather you do not understand the point of Siege's lack of item insurance. Your profile picture notwithstanding,

    [​IMG]
     
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  36. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    Does anyone actually read his posts in entirety, or like me read half way and just say, what absolute nonsense he spews..
     
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  37. CovenantX

    CovenantX Babbling Loonie
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    I agree with you for the most part, it's fairly balanced...
    IMO only a very select few changes need to be made to make pvp perfectly balanced...
    1. Poisoning immunity <Remove it>
    2. Casting focus <Change what it does to be less.... reliable>
    3. just do 1 & 2 for crying out loud... it'll fix dueling.... which has been completely dead since the introduction of 1 & 2.

    Edit: oh yea, Stone-form + protection will still be what runs spawns after they're revamped. you don't see it so much now, but when there is... a "Reason" to pvp, you bet it will be there 100% of the time.

    This.... is.... 100%... truth.
     
    #37 CovenantX, Jun 27, 2013
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2013
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  38. kelmo

    kelmo Old and in the way
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    Siege does not suck... *stares*
     
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  39. Lady Storm

    Lady Storm Crazed Zealot
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    *tosses kelmo a big chocolate chip cookie* Down baby doll... he didn't mean to ruffle your feathers..
     
  40. Orgional Farimir

    Orgional Farimir Lore Keeper
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    See my post from almost a year ago about replacing factions with town wars/revamped guild wars.
     
  41. Goodmann

    Goodmann Babbling Loonie
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    EASY FIX.. You must be order/chaos to enter felluca (spawns ect) Then your pvp enabled in tram and you cant really just be a trammy and take advantage of "faction artifacts" unless you want to be attacked in tram. If you want to live in felluca then you have to be order or chaos. If you want to spawn you have to be order or chaos. Could even consider it being account based so if your not willing to go order/chaos you can not enter felluca... this would spice things up a bit
     
  42. hen

    hen Certifiable
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    Ugh. I live in Felucca and I deplore this idea. I'm all for Order and Chaos but keep Felucca the facet of CHOICE as it was intended to be.
     
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  43. Gospel

    Gospel Seasoned Veteran
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    Isn't it funny when people try SOOOOO hard to sound smart, their message becomes lost in a pile of unnecessary words and over inflated statements?

    If you can use 10 words to make your point, using 100 just makes you look like you love the sound of your own voice. Not to mention it bores the **** out of anyone attempting to read your ********.
     
  44. Flutter

    Flutter Always Present
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    It sucks when I log on and you're not there :heart:
     
  45. PJay

    PJay Seasoned Veteran
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    This would be a really really good idea but they would never go for it. It would exclude Trammies from doing what they want to do and close off the section of the game to those who wont pvp. Remember any change must be for the good of Blue players.

    I would actually like them to add a fel town system which could replace factions and the towns become the faction allowing reds to participate. One thing i would stress is the extra FC1 must be removed from the rewards from tram and fel. I don't think the devs know what it will do. All of a sudden blue players gain new templates, dexxers get an extra fc for their chiv, spellweavers get an extra fc for their spells that will create an imbalance in the pvp because this is something reds cannot achieve. Especially a system which can be abused so easy and is already being abused (amount of messages ive had saying vote for xxx he will choose FC1).

    And when i say factions is broken its because it was a system made for the masses and if there aren't the numbers the proper function of factions doesn't work on this basis alone it should be removed.
     
  46. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    A system that would alienate the majority of the players by definition is not a good system, if one means "good for the health of the game."

    You may of course means "I prefer this system, hence I refer to it as good irregardless of its potential impact on the health of the game." And that's all well and good until the game gets canceled and you blame everything except the obvious.


    The mere fact that Factions was a Fel system only, from the start, by definition means it was never made for the masses, because the masses voted with their feet a long time ago -- went to Trammel and never went back.

    Global Chat and Stratics exaggerate PvPers' numbers.

    -Galen's player
     
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  47. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    It is not factually correct that the only items you can't get in Trammel are stat scrolls.

    Any rewards exclusive to the Abyssal Infernal, Harrower, and Primeval Lich spawns exclusively are found in Fel.

    Faction Artifacts -- much more powerful than their equivalent items -- also can only be obtained from Fel. These items which are only obtainable in Fel are so powerful that their being limited is blamed on a mass exodus from Factions by hard core PvPers who supposedly had become dependent upon them despite months of arguing that they weren't all that big a deal.

    If we broaden the view to include things that are more commonly found in Fel than in Tram then we have any champ spawn artifact, because to hear the Fel players say it those are much more common in Fel than in Tram.

    No reasons to PvP that previously existed have been taken away. So that's also an incorrect statement, factually.

    The bottom line is that there is no longer an appreciable amount of interest in Fel. The remaining Fel players are simply over-represented on the boards and on Global Chat, and are loud.

    -Galen's player
     
    #47 GalenKnighthawke, Jun 28, 2013
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2013
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  48. PJay

    PJay Seasoned Veteran
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    When factions was added many many people played factions the battles were huge unfortunately there are not enough players in the game to recreate those events which means its just not possible to use factions to its maximum potential. I couldn't participate in factions at the time but saw some of the battles and longed to be able to join in my poor 56k just couldn't cope.

    I'm pretty sure if you weighed up the trammel arties and fel arties you would find the majority in Trammel and not obtainable by Red players.

    Blues bang on about being forced to pvp against their will well how about reds forced against there will to have Blue players? Its impossible to play this game to its full extent as a red.
     
  49. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    Why fight for a 120 magery scroll that's worth 20m when you can sit safely in tram and solo medusa non stop for a slither that sells for 5-6 times that amount..make sense?

    Fel spawns were much more active when it sold for more..now that you can get almost any 120 scroll for under 5m there is almost no reason to farm them..unless of course your hoping for the epic drop of a 1.0 taming pink or 120 mage
     
  50. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    There was more participation in Factions when there were more players in the game. Yes. But you didn't say that, you referred to it being for "the masses," which, as Fel system, it plainly was not.

    And I'm pretty sure that if you weighted up the players with an interest in Fel versus the rest of us, you would find that there's a way higher proportion of Fel items versus Fel players.

    Your claim wasn't about a preponderance of stuff. You made a specific, verifiable, and factually incorrect claim.

    Once upon a time a red could not even enter town, and was subject to stat loss upon death, and after Publish 16 when you died in a Fel dungeon you lost your stuff whereas Blues kept their stuff.

    What you say is not new and is really rather appropriate. Reds, furthermore, repeatedly state their disdain for all things Trammel, and yet seem near-obsessed with finding ways to get there.

    -Galen's player
     
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