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Testing Factions Changes

Discussion in 'UHall' started by imported_Tina Small, Apr 11, 2008.

  1. This is a question for Draconi: Are you planning to waive the 30-day rule to join factions when you put this next publish on Test Center, or should we all start making characters now?
     
  2. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    This is a question for Draconi: Are you planning to waive the 30-day rule to join factions when you put this next publish on Test Center, or should we all start making characters now?

    [/ QUOTE ]Waving the rule on Test Centers
     
  3. Guest

    Guest Guest

    ok waiving it on test that doesn't answer if it will be on production shards or not.
     
  4. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    ok waiving it on test that doesn't answer if it will be on production shards or not.

    [/ QUOTE ]Ah, gotcha. TBD.
     
  5. Just a thought ... but as long as your going "unlimited" for faction size ...
    Some form of command "control" for membership ... should be allowed ... for kicking spies and non-com types

    a global wipe of the stones couldn't hurt ... new charter and alla that ...

    just a thought ...
    BEFORE it hits "all shards"
     
  6. Guest

    Guest Guest

    The rule was put in to prevent people from adding characters on new accounts and voting for the commander. If a check was added requiring you to be 30 days old to vote, the 30 day rule to join would no longer be needed.
     
  7. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    The rule was put in to prevent people from adding characters on new accounts and voting for the commander. If a check was added requiring you to be 30 days old to vote, the 30 day rule to join would no longer be needed.

    [/ QUOTE ]Right now, since we're planning to allow multiple characters from the same account to join a single faction, the idea is to make commander voting bound to account as well: so one vote per account.
     
  8. Guest

    Guest Guest

    That is a good idea.
     
  9. Guest

    Guest Guest

    My main concern that I haven't seen mentioned thus far, is the guardzone around Britain. It's now the only faction base to be enclosed in a bubble.
     
  10. Nixon[I-C]

    Nixon[I-C] Certifiable
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    Yeah the guardzone really need's to go, or the base need's to be moved.
     
  11. <blockquote><hr>

    Just a thought ... but as long as your going "unlimited" for faction size ...
    Some form of command "control" for membership ... should be allowed ... for kicking spies and non-com types


    [/ QUOTE ]

    No................ We need time to see the impact of these couple of changes first before more changes are made.
     
  12. Winder UO

    Winder UO Guest

    Factions will get ****LOADS of people now. Every trammie will join a faction to get the "reward" for beeing in factions while participating in the so called WAR. But the factions themselves wont see any increase in fights, sigil stealing or anything like that.
     
  13. Not really "a change" ... cleaning the stones at least ... why keep all the old dead not used in years data there ?
    active players could rejoin ... re-vote ... *shrugs* suit yourself

    IF I were a leader ... I certainly would want a way to "control" whom was within my command ...
    speaking of which ... 1 account one vote ... sounds fair ... 1 account 4 spies ... you will never ferret them all out ...
    just as well do all your stratigic planning in luna ... never mind multiple accounts ...
    the new prince ... errr ... leader ... heh ...

    well
    as noted

    time to see the impact of these couple of changes first

    g'luck with that
    sincerely
     
  14. Let me clarify, Fayled:

    I am leery of getting rid of the balancing rule. Would prefer that the stones be wiped instead of characters that have not been logged in for more than 180 days or something like that.

    What I objected to was your comment about giving CL's the ability to boot people out of a faction. If large guilds end up dominating factions because of eliminating the balancing rule, adding another change where CL's can boot anyone they please out of factions could spell the end of small guilds even attempting to participate in factions.

    Also, I believe that spies are a fact of life in factions and, at least for me, add to the intrigue and perhaps impart some realism into the situation. You live with the spies amongst you and sometimes use them to your advantage. [​IMG]
     
  15. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Or just kill them everytime they ever try to participate in anything.
    Simple pleasures!
     
  16. <blockquote><hr>

    Or just kill them everytime they ever try to participate in anything.
    Simple pleasures!

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Aye, that works too and gives red characters an additional reason to participate in factions.
     
  17. Poo

    Poo The Grandest of the PooBah’s
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    1 vote per account - good, infact excellent.

    TB base is unfair cause non of the other towns dont have a GZ.
    true. But TB are the 'good' side.
    SL and MX are the evil.
    mag WAS good, but no one defended the town so they lost thier town and GZ.

    TB should remain as the haven for blues who wish to play factions.
    BUT, there is a simple fix to the TB base.
    blow up the bridge and make it not usable (some storyline - someone gernaded it or something)
    then ya pop a 'debrie' bridge and punch a hole through the BACK wall of TB base.
    no more GZ.

    plus it will look cool!



    ok, so now lets get to brass tacks.
    im a faction player.
    i play it every day.
    how is this gonna effect me?
    HUGE!
    no more am i going to be pretected by the shell of only having one person per account.
    now if i really tick off a off shoot faction guild of a HUGE guild i run the risk of them coming in with 500 people and totally zerging control.
    that makes me sad.
    gone are the days where you actually had to think about what character you were gonna put into factions, cause ya only had one you could put in.
    now im gonna have 21 toons that i can chuck in.
    in my small guild of 5 people, between just us we can field 245 toons.
    thats not counting inactive accounts that we can turn on should we need more manpower.
    holy hell!
    245!!!!

    so what, who cares.
    well, i do!
    gone are the days of the mom and pop guilds in factions.
    its gonna come down to "whos got more friends"

    in a way im sad.
    in a way im happy.
    im happy that factions are getting SOME attention.

    and im concerned about the "people who partisipate in the war will get rewards"
    ok, so let me make a WILD guess...... same as the old days when our faction merchants worked.... the more kills you get the more armour and stuff you will be able to wear (faction armour)
    so, what.... EA is turning back on the faction merchants.... and only the uber elite who have 40 kills will be able to use any of it again?

    READ THE FORUMS !!!!!!!

    give the thiefs some love for ^*(^&amp;&amp; sake.
    they do 90% of the work in factions and cant get kill points, so they can never ride thier horses or wear the armour ect ect ect.
    the people who do all the work and arnt afraid to die to help their guilds win never carry any kill points, hence they NEVER get any of the perks.

    so if the new 'perks' are decided like the old and current ones are (by killpoints) .... well that the heck is the point of doing it then?

    your gonna have to make it something else.
    time logged in on your toon.
    time in active battle.
    time in fel in active battle.
    time in faction base.
    SOMETHING.

    example.
    many times ive been the only person on the small shard i play on with a kill point.
    infact, theres been many times where ive been into the double digits when no one has any.
    so id be the only person able to use the cool purple armour and ride my horse ect ect ect.
    and all i was ever doing was getting the kill shot and getting the kill point.

    needs to be a better way.

    and on a side note.
    these changes, while good for big shards with big population, is going to kill small shards. on a small shard all its gonna take is one of the monster guilds to pull into factions and it will be all done up.

    large shards can allwasy get more people in to fight.
    small shards cant.

    and gone will be the days of going to a new shard with 3 people and joining factions there and having fun.
    what will 3 people be able to do against monster factions with hundreds of toons.

    just..... dosnt look good for the small operations.
    i feel like a nice little mom and pop store with the big old Wal-Mart coming to town.
     
  18. [​IMG] Leery is a good state ... and we're basically in agreement re: one time wipe of stones.
    clean slate ... fresh start ... proper roster and alla that ... two reasoned voices ... *shrugs*

    As for "Leadership" they derive from votes earned ... not assigned, as differing from guilds .. aye?
    "holding power" should be just a bit more then ... and ... as noted ... where in factions MORE than guilds ... it all goes MORE machiavellian ...
    just saying ...
    guilds can over throw leaders ... as can factions ... where does the power of the vote come from?
    factions ...IF greater than guilds ... should allow a similar "ejection" option ...

    all polotic is local .... I forget who first said it ...
    but
    'tis relevant
     
  19. <blockquote><hr>

    [​IMG] Leery is a good state ... and we're basically in agreement re: one time wipe of stones.
    clean slate ... fresh start ... proper roster and alla that ... two reasoned voices ... *shrugs*

    As for "Leadership" they derive from votes earned ... not assigned, as differing from guilds .. aye?
    "holding power" should be just a bit more then ... and ... as noted ... where in factions MORE than guilds ... it all goes MORE machiavellian ...
    just saying ...
    guilds can over throw leaders ... as can factions ... where does the power of the vote come from?
    factions ...IF greater than guilds ... should allow a similar "ejection" option ...

    all polotic is local .... I forget who first said it ...
    but
    'tis relevant

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Fayled, if it was as simple as getting out of factions and coming right back immediately, maybe it would be okay. But it doesn't work that way! Also, think of the consequences if a CL decides to boot the guild leader of a guild, large or small.....bye bye to that whole guild. What a freaking mess. That's why I'm saying give us a chance to live with the planned changes first and see what happens.

    And as far as the CL "earning" the votes, it could come down to who has control of the most accounts. Heck, I could take all of my accounts and put a stealther on every one of them and park them next to the guild stone and have them all vote without having to worry about fighting them into the base now that we will be able to have multiple characters in factions on the same account. No more would I have to worry about whether my poor little tinker's going to get to vote because there's no way she's gonna survive the run into the base. I'll just make a stealther on that account and park it next to the stone and vote at some obscene hour. Rinse and repeat with all my other accounts and talk my friends into doing the same thing.

    CL's have almost enough control as it is. If they'd ever get the the ability to pick up their own faction's misplaced traps then we might not have that many spies and infiltrators and as a result CL's wouldn't need god-like powers to boot whomever they please out of factions.
     
  20. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I agree with Poo been playing in factions almost since day one.
    I am really disturbed by the concept of giving CLs the power to drop players from factions. One vote one account, fine. But, no one should be able to control who joins, or else jus drop the whole game aspect.
    Its like saying that one person can control what music I listen to, its messed up dictator crap is what it is, and its freakin scary to think people think this way. Its sick IMO.
    What I see here in factions is LOTS of FREAKIN abuse and more power to CL's will increase that abuse. In Fel players are all slime for the most part (me included). The worst part of human behavior. So end of story, leave the damn CL powers in check. geezus x!!
     
  21. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I don't know why anyone is advocating Commanding Lords get the power to kick players out of their faction. Especially with stat loss removed, you can just murder any spies.
     
  22. <blockquote><hr>

    I don't know why anyone is advocating Commanding Lords get the power to kick players out of their faction. Especially with stat loss removed, you can just murder any spies.

    [/ QUOTE ]
    yeah ... that'll keep 'em outta the base ... Luna right? thats where you want it?

    [​IMG]
     
  23. <blockquote><hr>

    guilds can over throw leaders ... as can factions ... where does the power of the vote come from?
    factions ...IF greater than guilds ... should allow a similar "ejection" option ...

    all polotic is local .... I forget who first said it ...
    but
    'tis relevant

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Fayled, with regard to this statement, keep in mind that each faction has regularly scheduled election periods. Faction leadership is not a "greater" version of guild leadership. Faction CL's currently have the power to determine how much silver faction members earn from kills, removing traps, etc.. They also appoint and fire town finance ministers and sheriffs.

    Faction CL's don't need to be given the ability to determine who is and isn't able to stay in a faction. If we ever reach the point that they do have that power, you can kiss factions goodbye.
     
  24. <blockquote><hr>

    I don't know why anyone is advocating Commanding Lords get the power to kick players out of their faction. Especially with stat loss removed, you can just murder any spies.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Stat loss needs to stay.
     
  25. Poo

    Poo The Grandest of the PooBah’s
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    <blockquote><hr>

    I agree with Poo been playing in factions almost since day one.
    I am really disturbed by the concept of giving CLs the power to drop players from factions. One vote one account, fine. But, no one should be able to control who joins, or else jus drop the whole game aspect.
    Its like saying that one person can control what music I listen to, its messed up dictator crap is what it is, and its freakin scary to think people think this way. Its sick IMO.
    What I see here in factions is LOTS of FREAKIN abuse and more power to CL's will increase that abuse. In Fel players are all slime for the most part (me included). The worst part of human behavior. So end of story, leave the damn CL powers in check. geezus x!!



    [/ QUOTE ]

    woa..... woa..... WOA!!!!!

    11 posts in 10.5 years..... settle down there bro....

    now you know theres a problem when the lurkers come out to post!!!
     
  26. Guest

    Guest Guest

    HA HAHAHA

    message boards are a waste of life and sometimes free advice for corporate interest. But, I can't sit there sometimes when the lip flappin gets outta hand.
     
  27. Poo

    Poo The Grandest of the PooBah’s
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    <blockquote><hr>

    I don't know why anyone is advocating Commanding Lords get the power to kick players out of their faction. Especially with stat loss removed, you can just murder any spies.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    the day they take out stat loss is the day that factions are truelly dead.
    risk vs reward.

    where is the risk if they remove stat loss?

    not everything can be rainbows and lollypop land.
     
  28. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I agree there's always Mickey's Castle...no pain, no spine, no living...
    Feel the burn!
     
  29. GarthGrey

    GarthGrey Crazed Zealot
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    <blockquote><hr>

    Factions will get ****LOADS of people now. Every trammie will join a faction to get the "reward" for beeing in factions while participating in the so called WAR. But the factions themselves wont see any increase in fights, sigil stealing or anything like that.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Hey could you pick me some winning Lotto numbers? You know, since you're Psychic and all...
     
  30. Poo

    Poo The Grandest of the PooBah’s
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    its a fair assessment.
    traditionally trammies swarm over anything new and shiney.

    i personally dont think they will on this though.

    i think it will again revolve around the kills.
    and the poor trammies will just get rolled under like cannon fodder.
     
  31. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    <blockquote><hr>

    I don't know why anyone is advocating Commanding Lords get the power to kick players out of their faction. Especially with stat loss removed, you can just murder any spies.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    the day they take out stat loss is the day that factions are truelly dead.
    risk vs reward.

    where is the risk if they remove stat loss?

    not everything can be rainbows and lollypop land.

    [/ QUOTE ]
    I am talking about when they took out stat loss for murderers resurrecting with 5 or more short term murder counts.
     
  32. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>


    give the thiefs some love for ^*(^&amp;&amp; sake.
    they do 90% of the work in factions and cant get kill points, so they can never ride thier horses or wear the armour ect ect ect.
    the people who do all the work and arnt afraid to die to help their guilds win never carry any kill points, hence they NEVER get any of the perks.

    so if the new 'perks' are decided like the old and current ones are (by killpoints) .... well that the heck is the point of doing it then?

    [/ QUOTE ]<center>Love for Thieves?</center>

    Yes. Love for thieves. Oh, and healers. Why not?
     
  33. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    TB should remain as the haven for blues who wish to play factions.
    BUT, there is a simple fix to the TB base.
    blow up the bridge and make it not usable (some storyline - someone gernaded it or something)
    then ya pop a 'debrie' bridge and punch a hole through the BACK wall of TB base.
    no more GZ.

    plus it will look cool!


    [/ QUOTE ]

    Nice story idea and would be a cool change. Sounds easy to do as well.

    Everything that helps factions really helps us on Siege Perilous. So Yahoo!
     
  34. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Now that wasn't the Faction Change i was expecting. You just completely unbalanced it pretty much. Now we'll see 98% TB in Factions. TB has an inherent unfair advantage over all other factions because...
    1. They have a Guardzone which makes people who heal Reds get Guardwhacked.
    2. They can turret their' NPC Guards for insane firepower (Ever been hit with 30+ Exp+E-Bolts at same time?)
    3. They can stuff up the entrance with Vendors to slow down opposition so the NPC Guards can just blow the [censored] out of anyone that get's near.

    Been a LONG time since SL was active on Napa, but if i remember right we have a problem where someone can mark a rune under the bridge in our base, and gate people into the base from there. My Stealth Assassin has been a Stealther since before Tram, and has been in SL since Factions started. I still have the guildstone to his SL Guild.

    Right now they're are just too many penalties for being in Factions, we won't be able to entice a lot of people into factions because of it. The Stat Loss is way too long (Make it like 10 mins instead of 20-30), the Bene in Tram is a pain in the ass (I'm fine with it in Fel, so a blue non faction can't heal a faction player in a faction fight.) Only faction that i can see getting a massive surge of players is TB, because they're unlikely to die because of their unfair advantages in their Base. Because of the inactivity of Factions on Napa, i haven't been able to ride my Trained SL Warhorse for a VERY long time. Last good change to Factions that i remember is when they changed it to where we can rez our own Warhorses with 0.0 Vet, just takes a Bandy.
     
  35. Guest

    Guest Guest

    True Britannians should have an advantage. They're the segment that chose to stay loyal. The others all formed the "factions" or trying to undermine/overthrow Britannia. Rebels get what rebels can, because that's exactly what they are before they gain control. And yes, my main is in True Britannians.

    Personally I don't see the changes as amounting to anything much, good or bad. Regardless of which faction you are. I'd have been more impressed if they simply added some point or life back into it.
     
  36. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    the day they take out stat loss is the day that factions are truelly dead.
    risk vs reward.

    where is the risk if they remove stat loss?

    not everything can be rainbows and lollypop land.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Sorry, I don't know where "lollypop land" is. You'd have to tell me...

    But stat loss has always done more harm to growth &amp; activity in factions than good. Basically people get tired of dying and suddenly being useless for the duration of nearly any conflict in the game.
     
  37. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    traditionally trammies swarm over anything new and shiney.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    And the reds just ***** because they don't have it to swarm over in Fel. Come on...
     
  38. hey ... whatever ... we'll see how it plays out ... ... just saying ... and not just blindly ...
    but ... we'll see.

    as before
    Sincerely good luck
     
  39. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    <blockquote><hr>


    give the thiefs some love for ^*(^&amp;&amp; sake.
    they do 90% of the work in factions and cant get kill points, so they can never ride thier horses or wear the armour ect ect ect.
    the people who do all the work and arnt afraid to die to help their guilds win never carry any kill points, hence they NEVER get any of the perks.

    so if the new 'perks' are decided like the old and current ones are (by killpoints) .... well that the heck is the point of doing it then?

    [/ QUOTE ]<center>Love for Thieves?</center>

    Yes. Love for thieves. Oh, and healers. Why not?

    [/ QUOTE ] [​IMG]
     
  40. Guest

    Guest Guest

    What faction changes? [​IMG]
     
  41. Raj-Europa

    Raj-Europa Guest

    Well as along factioneer both solo and part of a guild I cant wait for the lift-off,but im still very dubious of the planning and thought process behind it.
    As poo said about thieves and im biased here as i play a thief my roll is gonna be pointless cant earn points and i doubt very much if im gonna be needed to steal sigils.
    Factions is a great way to play uo and has alot of depth but surely there could of been a way to get ppl to play without the "here have some shinies to play factions because we cant be arsed to think of a original and innovative way to breath life into factions".
    After all the shinies is the way to go, "go to tokuno hunt stuff and you can get shiny stuff, go to doom and get shiny stuff" and as we know they are still the hive of activity they were when those events started.
    It might work out and hope its does but on this games track record for bringing forth worthwhile and lasting content i cant see it [​IMG]

    *waits for the mercenaries to arrive*
     
  42. Winder UO

    Winder UO Guest

    I totally agree with Raj here. However, the devs are welcome to prove me otherwise. But the outcry for faction content has made them do something, but it seems like a fast and painless easy fix.
     
  43. <blockquote><hr>


    What I objected to was your comment about giving CL's the ability to boot people out of a faction. If large guilds end up dominating factions because of eliminating the balancing rule, adding another change where CL's can boot anyone they please out of factions could spell the end of small guilds even attempting to participate in factions.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I don't think a CL should be able to boot anyone out of factions... BUT

    Since the beginning I've been saying that a CL should be able to denote someone in the faction as being a spy and for 24 hours that person is freely attackable by ALL members in factions (including his/her own.)

    I used to get fed up quick with the lame as hell spy tactics... and let me be honest with you.

    Not having a Guardzone is going to screw people actually in it for factions because there will be non-factioners determining the success of factions.

    booooooooooooo

    I think people should be freely attackable if they are in factions ANYWHERE in UO... that means in DOOM, Ilshenar, ANYWHERE!!!! The only difference I suggest should be is that statloss is only suffered in Felucca.

    That would stop people from abusing the system... and make it fun for those who participate in it because you just never know where you'll fight!
     
  44. Well i for one like that Factions are getting some attention. I dont think getting rid if the balancing factor is such a good idea. I thought i read something about Chaos/Order comming back with factions?


    Well any way now the Com town of Magincia is destroyed there are 3 Factions that can harbor the reds.

    An one that can harbor the blues TB this could be a tie with Chaos /Order. Not sure what is going to happen I do think guard zones are a must to keep the reds from controlling everything again.

    I just hope what there doing wont kill the factions. Oh i always hated that a red never showed up Orange than they always got the jump on you. In factions i never hunted reds just oranges. I hope there is a fix to that problem
     
  45. Lord Kotan

    Lord Kotan Slightly Crazed
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    <blockquote><hr>

    This is a question for Draconi: Are you planning to waive the 30-day rule to join factions when you put this next publish on Test Center, or should we all start making characters now?

    [/ QUOTE ]
    What do the plan to do to factions?
     
  46. More than one player per account is a bad idea.
     
  47. Poo

    Poo The Grandest of the PooBah’s
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    <blockquote><hr>

    More than one player per account is a bad idea

    [/ QUOTE ]

    what do you mean, im looking forward to having 21 toons per shard in factions

    [​IMG]

    ya know, its a double edged knife.
    in a way its nice cause if you have a thief, now you can put in something else like a mage or a warrior.
    or if you have an account tied up being the faction tinker now you can add more muscle to the defence.

    bad side.
    people who are gonna drop everything with a pulse into factions.

    i allways thought of factions like a little mini siege shard on production shards.
    it made you THINK about how you could help your faction cause you where limited as to what you could put in.
    it also made you get very good at that one template.

    we will have to wait and see what happens.
     
  48. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    I thought i read something about Chaos/Order comming back with factions?

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I really hope not, since we had an entire in-game fiction scenario with Lord British reconciling with Lord Blackthorn after the latter's passing. I really, really hope that Order/Chaos isn't going to be pulled back out of the box because that's all anyone at Eathic can think to do for "new content".

    There is no place for the concept of order versus chaos in modern UO. Blackthorn is dead, British has left the world, and the entire basis for the conflict is long in our past. I really don't want to see Blackthorn resurrected in some sort of weekly television show style, and obviously British can only be referred to in very obscure ways anymore for legal reasons. Please, please don't try and revive all of it in some overly cheezy, BSed way...

    Besides, the things that are happening now are centered around virtue/antivirtue, the three principles and their opposites (the shadowlords). These are good versus evil conflicts, which order/chaos wasn't about.

    "Chaos and Order are not enemies, only opposites. Chaos and Order combined equal balance." -Richard Garriott