1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. Greetings Guest!!

    In order to combat SPAM on the forums, all users are required to have a minimum of 2 posts before they can submit links in any post or thread.

    Dismiss Notice

[Discordance] The new way to train Disco (2010-11)

Discussion in 'UO Bard' started by Poo, Nov 7, 2010.

  1. Poo

    Poo The Grandest of the PooBah’s
    Professional Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend Campaign Benefactor 4H

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2003
    Messages:
    7,855
    Likes Received:
    2,409
    so,

    there i was.
    wondering to myself how the bard mastery was for training skills post 90 level.
    and i got to thinking and i got to looking, and i found 3 toons of mine that where only at 115 skill in disco.
    the one being a bard that is 115 in all skills because i allready have a 120 bard on that shard.
    and the other 2 being my disco tamer and bard on Origin who i never worked up after i got them 120 scrolls (which on origin takes a LONG time to find cheap scrolls)

    so i figured since these are my three hold outs on being done i mise well put the nose to the grind stone and try training disco with them by using the bard masteries.

    now, going into this i knew a few things.
    a) i know that you can train the bard skills by using the masteries.
    b) in using the masteries you gain only off the initial start of the skill and not for any of the re-up's so anything past the start up attempt was gonna be a wast of mana
    c) i was gonna have to turn OFF the bard mastery in order to re-start it
    d) i was gonna need a LOT of mana regen to do this.

    so what i found.
    well.
    so far im in on the first bard right now.
    and lets say im probablly in about 10 hours and im up from 115 to 118.5
    now im thinking back to the last time i trained it with Cu's and the gains from 115 where faster then the gains from 100, but i still think the 3.5 gains in 10 hours is faster then training with pets.

    so, how am i doing it.
    well first off i had to clear up some room for some med and focus.
    i was taking EI off my pure bard and putting med on anyways, so that wasnt too bif off a issue.
    and i also took off 120 peace so i could put on focus to help with the mana regen.
    the suit is a normal 100 LRC suit with 40 LMC and probablly about 10 MR.

    and i must say, so far my mana is barelly moving.
    i take the initial 15 mana hit and those are back by the time it goes to cast it again.
    i dont know if infact i even needed the GM focus on there to do this, but its there anyways.

    so what i have set up for my macro.
    im using my uoassist of course.
    its a pretty simple macro.

    use item type (instrament) ((started with 40 NPC ones)
    pause 1000 (1 second)
    use skill (Tribulation)
    target (myself)
    pause 1000 (1 second)
    use skill (tribulation again to turn it off)
    pause 2000 (2 seconds)

    and thats it.
    so all told its probablly a 5 second macro.
    compare that to training the skill with pets (or how i use to) you where talking shooting off like 10 attempts on 10 cu's then invising for 11 seconds.

    so lets look at the math.
    10 attemps (6 seconds between) then a 11 second invis = 71 seconds plus casting of the spell so add on like 2 secs, so lets say all in 73 seconds for 10 attempts.

    with casting the bard mastery for 10 attempts it would be 50 seconds.
    so right there we are getting more for our bang.
    allmost saving 1/3 of the time.

    so i guess then it all comes down to which is faster.

    they SHOULD both be the same if you look at it.
    when you use the bard mastery it does a skill check.
    same as if you where to use the skill directlly.

    so the gain rate should be exactlly the same.

    so if that is true, then doing the training with the spells would be 33% faster.

    interesting, eh
     
  2. Yeah, I 120'd another Discorder like this a few months back from 100/100.

    Just stuck it all on a new character with Med & Focus no other skills so the GGS would work more often. Also 40 LMC and 30 MR.

    Normal UO macro is fine, Cast Spell - Despair, Wait For Target, Target Self. The same macro stops the song again.
     
  3. Poo

    Poo The Grandest of the PooBah’s
    Professional Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend Campaign Benefactor 4H

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2003
    Messages:
    7,855
    Likes Received:
    2,409
    i found that the macro would lock up if you didnt do the 2 step method.

    just for the simple fact that when you turn the spell off it dosnt require you to target yourself.

    so i had to make it in 2 steps to get around that and make it run smoother.

    that said.
    done the first guy to 120.
    now im into the 2nd guy.

    seemed to run smooth and with no problems.

    ate up 22 NPC instraments from 115-120
    total time in was under a day (under 24 hours)
     
  4. Poo

    Poo The Grandest of the PooBah’s
    Professional Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend Campaign Benefactor 4H

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2003
    Messages:
    7,855
    Likes Received:
    2,409
    2nd guy done.

    same as the first.
    just under 20 NPC instraments.
    under a day to go from 115.0 to 120.0
     
  5. Not in my experience it didn't. Though I forget, I may have been targeting a mount I was riding instead of myself.
     
  6. Poo

    Poo The Grandest of the PooBah’s
    Professional Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend Campaign Benefactor 4H

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2003
    Messages:
    7,855
    Likes Received:
    2,409
    lucky me

    i found a 3rd bard hidden away on Legends that i had been too cheap to pick up a 120 disco scroll on.

    so ive picked up the scroll and am working him right now.

    so this will be bard #3 from 115 to 120 using the barding mastery skills.

    so far im up to 117.7 and all seems to be the same as the other 2.
    im fully expecting him to be done today as well.

    definatlly a lot easier way to train high end barding skills.

    after im done this toon im gonna go do that 2nd line bard i have on Napa that has all 3 barding skills at 115 and see if the provo and peace gains are the same.

    ill report back.

    *snaps off a crisp salute*
     
  7. NuSair

    NuSair Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    May 21, 2008
    Messages:
    2,989
    Likes Received:
    999
    100 music?
     
  8. NuSair

    NuSair Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    May 21, 2008
    Messages:
    2,989
    Likes Received:
    999
    Starting at 109.6
     
  9. Yeah you should have 100 Music when training.
     
  10. NuSair

    NuSair Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    May 21, 2008
    Messages:
    2,989
    Likes Received:
    999
    still no gains yet. I have 478.1 total points and discord it turned to go up.... :(
     
  11. NuSair

    NuSair Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    May 21, 2008
    Messages:
    2,989
    Likes Received:
    999
    Squeeky wheel gets the grease.... +.1
     
  12. Just to make sure you know, you can only get gains from starting a spell song, leaving it running wont do anything.
     
  13. NuSair

    NuSair Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    May 21, 2008
    Messages:
    2,989
    Likes Received:
    999
    yeah, I set up a macro to start it over and over and over, lol.
     
  14. NuSair

    NuSair Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    May 21, 2008
    Messages:
    2,989
    Likes Received:
    999
    110.4 now.
     
  15. I found it worked well for Discord but not so well for Peace. Though admittedly I couldn't really be bothered with Peace as I was just doing it to have on stone.
     
  16. Poo

    Poo The Grandest of the PooBah’s
    Professional Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend Campaign Benefactor 4H

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2003
    Messages:
    7,855
    Likes Received:
    2,409
    in all the cases i did above i had music at 115 or 120.

    it dosnt seem to really matter for the barding masteries if you have the music up or not.

    i thinking (assuming) that the skill is just getting toggles and the the barding check is not there.

    cause realistically what WOULD the barding check go against for the party skills like peace and provo?

    and what is a players barding diff when using the disco skill?

    so again, i just assume that there is no barding diff to be added into this when training with the masteries.

    unless someone from the dev team wants to come and clear that up for us.
    but either way the training seems to fly along either way, not like when training with the skill directlly where you have to tailor your skill level to the animals you are using it on to pass the 2nd check and possible skill gain.
     
  17. Logrus

    Logrus UO Legend
    VIP Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2009
    Messages:
    857
    Likes Received:
    389
    Its a flat difficulty check. Though since you don't have a chance to fail there's that slight bonus in chance to gain compared with barding a mob at the same difficulty. (Not to mention you can do it much quicker with no skill time out.)
     
  18. Poo

    Poo The Grandest of the PooBah’s
    Professional Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend Campaign Benefactor 4H

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2003
    Messages:
    7,855
    Likes Received:
    2,409
    i have a question logrus....


    where the heck is YOUR specialy colored pumpkin!!!!

    come on brother bard, get out from the cubical at work and fight for some of that well deserved spot light that Messena is hogging.

    im thinking hot pink for your pumpkin!

    and ill expect my Logrus pumpkin to be the first to get colored!!!!
     
  19. Logrus

    Logrus UO Legend
    VIP Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2009
    Messages:
    857
    Likes Received:
    389
    I'm just not much of a pumpkin fan. Maybe a carved watermelon instead. Though lighting a candle. In a watermelon may prove quite interesting if properly prepared.
    Maybe a hot pink and neon green carved watermelon. Working like A purple pot.
     
  20. Alekslandr

    Alekslandr Journeyman
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2008
    Messages:
    132
    Likes Received:
    3
    So Poo, how did it work training provocation using this mastery method. You said you would report back... Thanks...
     
  21. Poo

    Poo The Grandest of the PooBah’s
    Professional Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend Campaign Benefactor 4H

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2003
    Messages:
    7,855
    Likes Received:
    2,409
    sorry bro.

    RL got buisy and it had to take a back seat.

    i should be back to my normal rotation on monday and ill dig into it and see how the peace and provo gains go and ill report back.
     
  22. kRUXCg7

    kRUXCg7 Sage

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2010
    Messages:
    620
    Likes Received:
    227
    So, any differences to Discordance or all the same?
     
  23. Poo

    Poo The Grandest of the PooBah’s
    Professional Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend Campaign Benefactor 4H

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2003
    Messages:
    7,855
    Likes Received:
    2,409
  24. Robsmack

    Robsmack Guest

    Ok just to confirm. Should music be 120 or 100, or does it not matter? Thanks.
     
  25. Poo

    Poo The Grandest of the PooBah’s
    Professional Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend Campaign Benefactor 4H

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2003
    Messages:
    7,855
    Likes Received:
    2,409
    if your training on a animal the old way then you have to have it locked at 100 or you get the bonus, which wont help you for training.

    if your using the masteries to train then it dosnt matter.
    there is no music check, just straight skill check.

    so once you hit 90 in disco (or peace or provo) then you can unlock your music and let it rise as you work the mastery up.
     
  26. Robsmack

    Robsmack Guest

    Awesome. Thanks.
     
  27. Thrakkar

    Thrakkar Slightly Crazed
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2004
    Messages:
    1,358
    Likes Received:
    343
    I'm currently trying to raise provo (111.6 ATM) with casting inspire, but I haven't gotten a single gain until now...
    I think, I'll burn a few more instruments... let's see if something moves...

    EDIT:
    Got one. If gains keep coming this slow, I think I'll need two instruments per 0.1 point.

    And when I want to train peace? What would be more effective? Area peace or mastery?
     
  28. Poo

    Poo The Grandest of the PooBah’s
    Professional Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend Campaign Benefactor 4H

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2003
    Messages:
    7,855
    Likes Received:
    2,409
    both are slow.

    area peace dosnt require mana.
     
  29. Thrakkar

    Thrakkar Slightly Crazed
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2004
    Messages:
    1,358
    Likes Received:
    343
    I'm currently sticking with the bard song instead of area peace, since the latter has a 10 sec delay and with decent mana reg you can cast and decast the buff in 4 seconds without running out of mana...
     
  30. Poo

    Poo The Grandest of the PooBah’s
    Professional Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend Campaign Benefactor 4H

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2003
    Messages:
    7,855
    Likes Received:
    2,409
    6-7 seconds

    i just logged on to confirm.

    and no mana used.

    so 2 seconds different, and if you dont have the med cause you have eval or a crappy suit then its still the 'cheap scottish *******' way to train, hehe
     
  31. Cirno

    Cirno Purple Pony Princess
    Stratics Veteran Alumni

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2009
    Messages:
    961
    Likes Received:
    224
    Surely they're not exclusive.
    If you have the peace mastery, the delay is 8 seconds minus 2 seconds. So you can make a macro to cast a spellsong, area peace, cast spellsong (to disrupt it), and hit that key every 6-7 seconds.
     
  32. Poo

    Poo The Grandest of the PooBah’s
    Professional Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend Campaign Benefactor 4H

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2003
    Messages:
    7,855
    Likes Received:
    2,409
    and i thought "I" was a power trainer!

    im gonna go try this right now!
     
  33. Poo

    Poo The Grandest of the PooBah’s
    Professional Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend Campaign Benefactor 4H

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2003
    Messages:
    7,855
    Likes Received:
    2,409
    i have the provo mastery on right now, but ya, you can hit the spell, then hit area peace, then back to the spell ect ect ect ect

    nice.

    double dipping!
     
  34. Thrakkar

    Thrakkar Slightly Crazed
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2004
    Messages:
    1,358
    Likes Received:
    343
    I stoned magery and set focus to raise. So I'm training with 110 med, 100 focus, 40 LMC and 11 MR (you can safely ignore LRC, because the songs don't use any resources, so the suit can be crappy easily :))

    With that setup the delay between each song sums up to 5600ms in my UOA-macro, without loosing mana over time. This is casting tribulation though, which is the most expensive song mana-wise (15 mana, compared to 9 mana for resilience or inspire). So peace or provo should be even faster.