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The PvM logout timer has long since outlived its usefulness

Discussion in 'UHall' started by GalenKnighthawke, Oct 23, 2014.

  1. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    Subject line says it all. Or, at least, says enough.

    -Galen's player
     
  2. SpyderBite

    SpyderBite Sage
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    Is this the timer that prevented ghost cams at the champ spawns?
     
  3. drcossack

    drcossack Babbling Loonie
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    No, the two minute timer/heat of battle. For pvp, fine. For PvM it's just dumb. I have to wait for 2 minutes just to switch even though the monster I just killed is dead.

    vvv made it worse. If a vvv battle starts, I have to wait to switch.
     
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  4. The Zog historian

    The Zog historian Babbling Loonie
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    No, it's that if a monster hits you outside your house, you're considered in combat and can't log out. Edit: what he said.

    There was never a valid reason for it, only lazy coding. It would require a few more lines so that the combat flag is activated only by other players.
     
  5. SpyderBite

    SpyderBite Sage
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    I see. I've never experienced a situation where this was inconvenient for me. So please.. Carry on and forgive my interruption.
     
  6. Smoot

    Smoot Grand Poobah
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    if it were instant the camping skill would be useless....

    in all seriousness, i would definitely abuse an auto-log out. if i were about to die or were mobbed id just log out and log back on in a few mins when stuff had cleared out.
     
  7. Barok

    Barok Grand Inquisitor
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    The OP is talking about logging out in your house, not out in the wilderness or in a dungeon.
     
  8. FrejaSP

    FrejaSP Queen of The Outlaws
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    I agree, there should not be a timer if you are in your house or an Inn. Now I only have one char on each account on Siege, so not really a problem for me :p
     
  9. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    It's really annoying to recall home to have a mongbat there flag on me and then I can't log out right. Totally needs to be put to rest.
     
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  10. Dot_Warner

    Dot_Warner Babbling Loonie
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    It's high time that this timer is removed!

    +1
     
  11. Dermott of LS

    Dermott of LS UOEC Modder
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    ...

    Well past time for this to be taken care of. Nothing more annoying than brushing up against an insta-kill creature (sewer rat, snake, mongbat) that aggros you and taking a point of damage and/or killing it instantl;y then being unable to log out in your own home afterward.
     
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  12. Captn Norrington

    Captn Norrington Trade Forum Administrator
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    I completely agree, the timer has messed me up many times while I was trying to complete a deal, and by the time I got my character logged in the other person had logged out. Also, when a guild member calls for help, or rez and the timer prevents me from helping....it's not a good feeling.
     
  13. Yadd of Legends

    Yadd of Legends Certifiable
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    Well, this would also make it easier to switch characters in the middle of a spawn - say start off with a sampire and quickly switch to a greater dragon. Sounds nice, but are there any downsides?
     
  14. TheDrAJ

    TheDrAJ Slightly Crazed
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    Wow you keep a house at your spawn!
    I'm impressed.
     
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  15. Yadd of Legends

    Yadd of Legends Certifiable
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    You missed a key ingredient in the formula there - recall to your house and back - or else you're being facetious :)
     
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  16. Captn Norrington

    Captn Norrington Trade Forum Administrator
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    To recall, or not to recall...that is the question ;)
     
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  17. DJAd

    DJAd Stratics Legend
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    +1 for removal of this timer
     
  18. azmodanb

    azmodanb Grand Poobah
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    i think the timer should be longer.... and not just aggro of monsters and player attack.. but should be also if you use a spell or walk .... and should be no less then 30 mins.

    /sarcasm
     
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  19. TheDrAJ

    TheDrAJ Slightly Crazed
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    Actually I think recall should be eliminated totally - course I play Siege so I am a little biased.
     
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  20. FrejaSP

    FrejaSP Queen of The Outlaws
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    I could be without recall too.
    I think all should have a home stone, that take zero skills, they can then link it to a player house or an Inn. They should only have one for each char but together with Crystal portals and house teleporters, it would allow non mages to get around.
    Mages in the guild would again be important to a guild to help group traveling
     
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  21. Captn Norrington

    Captn Norrington Trade Forum Administrator
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    I agree that recall kinda killed the traveling aspect of the game. It would be great if we all had a "book of travel" or something, and it would have runes to each of the facets, but not the towns. So you would click "travel to Trammel" and it would drop you in some random place in Trammel, same for the other places. That way, if you don't want to risk being dropped in the middle of nowhere, you should just walk instead of using the travel book.

    Of course, that would only work if the game were popular and people weren't so used to recalling....lol.
     
  22. JohnnyO

    JohnnyO Journeyman
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    ^ This, I don't see the point in it. I guess it's not a big deal but it can really get irritating.
     
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  23. Captn Norrington

    Captn Norrington Trade Forum Administrator
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    Especially when the same monster hits every single character you log in while claiming holiday gifts. Turns a 5 minute process into an hour long ordeal lol.
     
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  24. Endrik

    Endrik Sage
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    It is these kinds of comments that I just do not understand. Not trying to attack you personally DrAJ. But I see a lot of these kinds of comments; "Items are too powerful, I can solo any monster now, take all powerful items out of game" or "Sampire makes it too easy for me to solo spawn, nerf it". It just seems to me that if this is an issue to some players, then those players should simply not use the feature they do not like. But it makes no sense to ask for it to be removed and force it on everybody.

    Instead of requesting a change to the game, how about you just don't use it. Simple, immediate, and bug free solution to the problem. Just sayin.
     
  25. TheDrAJ

    TheDrAJ Slightly Crazed
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    Like I said I play Siege so I don't use it.
     
  26. Dermott of LS

    Dermott of LS UOEC Modder
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    ...

    I used to be MUCH more against Recall (even before Siege), however I DO believe that all inside-Dungeon runes should be un-Marked and Mark unable to be cast within dungeons so that you can Recall/Gate out, but not INTO deep spawn areas. Of course you can always send a "scout" to gate everyone in in groups this way, but I don't see that as a bad thing either.
     
  27. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    I was wondering how folks would seek to derail this thread, and the answers are:

    1 - Siege talk;
    2 - Misleading arguments about how one could switch characters in the middle of some kind of spawn;
    3 - Either not relevant or irrelevant talk about removing the Recall spell.

    I must bring my own thread back to reality.

    With regard to the first derailing: Siege is its own creature, with one character per account, and doesn't have this issue sort of by definition.

    With regard to the second derailing: One could do that now, just by using different accounts. Or by hoping that the process of recalling out finding a safe logout location, and logging, all by itself runs out the timer. Of course there's always the chance that a mongbat could target you while you're switching characters for that purpose thus foiling your dastardly character switching plot. But there's a greater chance that a mongbat could target me while I'm, say, switching characters for the purpose of helping at one event on one character and helping at another event on another character.

    And then of course, again, there's multiple accounts. The current system doesn't touch this.

    And finally the recall spell talk. The cat's many years out of the bag on that.

    *shrugs*

    -Galen's player
     
  28. Yadd of Legends

    Yadd of Legends Certifiable
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    I didn't mention recalling out of a spawn to quickly come back with another character to derail the conversation - it's a consequence that should be taken into account - for good or bad - if they are going to consider changing the system - there are other consequences not yet mentioned that probably also should be considered - carry on


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  29. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    Tell me if I'm wrong but in all champ spawn area's at least the important Fel ones you can't recall there anyway... you have to physically leave the dungeon go to a moongate and such which can take time and really if you spend all that time leaving the spawn and coming back when it gets to the boss or whatever then come back which you'd have to again walk all the way there... or ride.... by the time you got there someone else probably came along and finished it for you. Not really a very good anti-removal of the silly timer argument... IMO

    As for the "real" reason behind the stupid timer I believe it was more to counter folk getting killed in Fel PvPing and coming back on another character to "re-engage" the battle without statloss effect... so in my opinion the timer thing should ONLY apply if you were fighting against another PLAYER .... and should NOT apply if you were fighting a mob..... and also shouldn't apply at all in TRAMMEL... Unless once again you were fighting a PLAYER.
     
  30. drcossack

    drcossack Babbling Loonie
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    Can't recall in or out of ANY Fel Dungeons. But help/stuck works.

    Granted, for the champ spawn dungeons, that's not too bad. Despise, Destard, and Deceit/Primeval Lich are easy access. Terathan Keep takes about a minute from the Despise drop-in, and the spawn in the Fire Dungeon takes 1-2 minutes from the town entrance (you COULD come in from t2a to get there, but that takes longer.) Hythloth is the only spawn where it'd be a pain in the ass, honestly, but you can enter that one from Trammel (and even then, the Fel route to the Abyssal Infernal doesn't take too long)

    For other dungeons, the lack of recall is a total pain in the ass, Shame in particular. I don't like going there for the spawn on lower levels, so I'll only go there if that's where the Harrower spawns. Don't get me wrong, I love hunting in Fel, but I also look at how long it takes me to get in/out of the dungeon. For that reason alone, Fel Wrong was my favorite hunting spot prior to Pub 86.
     
  31. Yadd of Legends

    Yadd of Legends Certifiable
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    I think you're right on the original reason for the timer. I'm thinking of the effect on champ spawns in Despise, for instance - finish off most of the spawn with a sampire - only takes a couple minutes to run out, recall home, switch to a PvP character (if the timer were removed), recall back to the entrance, run back down and rejoin the fight on a new character. The timer makes this impractical. I'm not voting one way or another on the proposed change - hell, I'd probably vote for it - just saying this is a factor that should be considered.
     
  32. The Zog historian

    The Zog historian Babbling Loonie
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    Originally it was not so much to prevent character switching, but to prevent people from escaping during combat. Order/Chaos, factions, guild wars, moongate fighting, there was always some coward that would head for a house, or an inn/tavern while in towns.

    It was not based solely on the aggressor flag, so that someone orange (and thus agreeing to PvP) couldn't log in at an inn, get hit, then log out to escape. But it should have never applied to getting hit by monsters, or getting attacked while blue, and it would not have been hard to program it that way from the start.
     
  33. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    I agree 100% it should NEVER have applied to PvM... and honestly it shouldn't apply to blue's... it should apply to PvP and only PvP.
     
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