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[Archery] thinking about a new template, need comments!!!

Discussion in 'UO Warrior' started by RaistlinNowhere, Feb 24, 2014.

  1. RaistlinNowhere

    RaistlinNowhere Slightly Crazed
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    Well since there is the unvendorable bug around, i wont be xsharding for trading, so ill return to my origins.... hunting !!!!
    I was thinking about a new archer template, and theorically seems pretty good, but need some comments about it.
    Its a something like this :

    archery 120 (+15 in jewel)
    anatomy 110
    tactics 120
    spellweaving 120
    heal 90
    chival 85
    SS 60
    necro 30


    LIFE : 120
    STAM : 176
    MANA : 120


    30 KINETIC EATER
    DCI 5
    HCI 45
    LMC 52 (with inherit LMC from studded armor)
    HPI 23
    MI 43
    MR 1
    STAM INC 63
    STR 5
    DI 100
    SSI 25 (55 SSI with composite)


    The idea is being around hitting in wraith form, and swap into a caster suit, for word of death at the end.
    With the caster suit, i would have 114 SDI, 135 mana, 40 lmc, 14 mr and 2/4 , plenty enough for doing high damage, and swapping both suits would only take some seconds, thx to UOAssist.

    At first sight, seems pretty good, but have been long time since i went hunting with an archer, so whats your opinion?
     
    #1 RaistlinNowhere, Feb 24, 2014
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2014
  2. Lefty

    Lefty Lore Keeper
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    Since you said hunting, perhaps fit SW in a ABC archer.
     
  3. RaistlinNowhere

    RaistlinNowhere Slightly Crazed
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    i know the abc archer, its the one im running now, but i think this template is more powerful than that one,and with 52 lmc thx to the inherit lmc, not having bushido isnt a problem at all for special moves mana cost
     
  4. kaio

    kaio Sage
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    Intresting template.
    What do you plan on hunting ?
    Must be something big, i mean not many swap suits in the middle of a battle to cast WOD.
     
  5. RaistlinNowhere

    RaistlinNowhere Slightly Crazed
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    I was thinking about EM events, navrey, doom, peerles and big guys like those.
    The swapping isnt a mandatory, if what im hunting doesnt need it, i dont have to do it, because is an archer after all hehe.
     
  6. kaio

    kaio Sage
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    Unless you have someone to tank for you, i dont think this template could work at all.
    Beeing on foot with 5 dci, and no resisting spells...Is suicide in most cases.
    I would't do doom on this template, almost any whammy/sampire build would outdammage you. (df would smack you real fast)
    Again if someone is tanking Narvery, then u might have a chance to kill her, but there are more effecient templates for dealing with narvery..(disco-mystic/tamer comes to mind, or warrior class)

    Killing melisande could be an option, but you still need someone to tank..(i would squezze in 50++ bushido for honor here.)
    Hope i didnt kill your'e dream of a new archer too much :)
     
  7. RaistlinNowhere

    RaistlinNowhere Slightly Crazed
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    Umm one thing that amaze me nowdays, is that hunting in UO means to do all solo, and as far as i know this is a MMORPG (that means more than one hehe).
    This template isnt for doing hunting all alone, its for doing it with more people, so no , i wont be tanking. So, knowing that this template is for going in group (at least a tank and me), more opinions?
     
  8. CorwinXX

    CorwinXX Babbling Loonie
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    I doubt you will be able to use SW when play solo. Casting time is too long. Well with protection you probably will manage to cast it but probably will die in the time it takes to cast it twice. And there is very little sense in such risk because you do about the same damage with a bow.

    30 necro looks useless as well. It's not enough for 100% Curse Weapon and for Wraith you could use human JOAT skill. I myself don't like Wraith form. You become to slow. And you can't use Double Shot.

    Spending 60 skill points for SS just to get 12% leach instead of 8% as well doesn't look as a good idea.

    Without Bushido your damage to peerless will be low (except Medusa and Dragons).

    With 174 stamina you need 40 or 60 SSI. With 180+ stamina you need 45 SSI.

    Your HP is too low for solo hunting.
     
  9. RaistlinNowhere

    RaistlinNowhere Slightly Crazed
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    ok ill repeat again : IM NOT GOING TO HUNT SOLO
    This template is for going into a group :p

    For solo, i would use my sampire, not an archer.
     
  10. kaio

    kaio Sage
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    Aha in that case, im pretty sure you will do alot better on a char like this.

    105 archery (+15 on some item u have)
    120 tact (Maxxx Dammage...)
    120 ana (Maxxx Dammage...)
    080 bushido (for honor, and special move reduced cost)
    095 chiv (Eoo and friends)
    100 ss (20% mana drain i think..)
    100 weaver (Easiere to get focus with 100, wod can also be used)

    So use scroll to cast wraithform.
    Heal with SS, and chiv, maby use balanced bow and use pots also..(it all helps)
    Cast attentude, gift of life, cast renew on initial battle. Case Chiv heal/cure when needed.
    Rely on good teammates to heal you once i awhile :)
    And be a good sport, and cast renew on tank, and remove curses.

    When and if you want to go solo hunt, u can swap weaver with healing.
    If u want todo pvp u can swap weaver with healing, and ss for resist..and use a 3rd suit for pvp with lots of pvp mods :)
     
  11. CorwinXX

    CorwinXX Babbling Loonie
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    I believe you do about the same damage with a bow as with WoD.

    30 necro looks useless as well. It's not enough for 100% Curse Weapon and for Wraith you could use human JOAT skill. I myself don't like Wraith form. You become to slow. And you can't use Double Shot.

    Spending 60 skill points for SS just to get 12% leach instead of 8% as well doesn't look as a good idea.

    Without Bushido your damage to peerless will be low (except Medusa and Dragons).

    With 174 stamina you need 40 or 60 SSI. With 180+ stamina you need 45 SSI.

    In group it's better to concentrate on DPS. With 215-220 stamina an archer can do about 175 dps using a Composite Bow. It's over 600 for 3.5 seconds.
    Against some peerless you can do much more with a Yumi but only if you not in Wraith form.

    So
    120 Archery
    120 Tactics
    120 Anatomy
    120 Chivalry
    130-150 STR, 211-221 Stamina, 50 HML.

    The rest skills are for mana cost reduction and/or healing a tank.
    And try to get a necro-bard in your party.
     
  12. RaistlinNowhere

    RaistlinNowhere Slightly Crazed
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    My char is an elf, so no JOATS.

    About the wraith form, have also used it with the archer, and allow me doing AI non-stop, with reforged HML and mana drain from wraith form.
    The SW is the new skill on the template, cause as far as i know, WoD with 114 SDI, focus and 120 skill, do a lot more damage than AI non-stop.
    Perhaps its better to ask at the caster forum, which numbers do they do with WoD with so high SDI and compare to those 175 dps per 3,5s as corwin said, but the first thought i have is that would be more damege with WoD.
    Im elf because with 120 mana and 52 LMC, it allows me to do 4 AI without need to recharge mana, and in those 4 shots, ill recharge for sure (wraith + HML).
     
  13. RaistlinNowhere

    RaistlinNowhere Slightly Crazed
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    the other doubt i have if swap heal for bushido, because with a disarm macro+pot, chival and SW, and being into a group, perhaps i wont need it, but not sure at all about this. What do you think?
     
  14. CorwinXX

    CorwinXX Babbling Loonie
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    WoD does 300 damage + 3 per 1% SDI.
    You have 114% SDI.

    Add here 39% from AE.

    I'm not sure but I think it will be 890.

    I don't see large advantage above archery. (archery works from 100% to 0% while sw works from 30% to 0% so when choosing between bonus to archery damage and sw bonus over archery divide the last one by 3.33)

    While you casting one WoD I can do 3 shots. Against 0 resists it is 1080 (at average).
    Against very high resists I can do 2.5 shots (with 150 stamina) or 3 shots (with 210 stamina). It's 540 or 650 (at average).
     
  15. RaistlinNowhere

    RaistlinNowhere Slightly Crazed
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    Until the the monster that we are hunting isnt 30%, we will make the same damage. So lets calculate what happens once it get to 30% life.

    umm lets say the WoD damage is 850 and lets say 3s casting?
    that makes 20 WoD in one minute = 850 x 20 = 17k damage
    Even if we say 4s per casting , its still 13k damage.


    Now lets say 175 damage per shot, at 1,5s each = 175 x (60/1.5) = 7k damage
    Even if we say 1,25s per shot, its 8k damage.

    It is a big difference, that could make a drop or not in a EM event for example.
     
  16. CorwinXX

    CorwinXX Babbling Loonie
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    With 2/6 you can cast 1 WoD per 3.5 sec. Casting AE 2x time takes 8 sec. So you can cast (60 - 8)/3.5 = 15 WoDs and do 12,750 damage.

    My archer does at least 216 damage per shot. So 216 * (60/1.5) = 8,640. This is damage against Slasher, etc.
    But usually Peerless Boss has one resist about 40. So I will do 180 * 2 * 0.6 * (60/1.25) = 10.368 damage.
    And when there is a necro/disco in a party I will do 180 * 2 * 0.8 (60/1.25) = 13.824 damage.

    No. As you can see from numbers above I will do 20-50% more damage with bow. It is because you don't leach enough mana to use Yumi. (so you do 8k with a composite bow while I do 10-13k with a yumi). Well except very few bosses like slasher, effusion, etc.
     
  17. CorwinXX

    CorwinXX Babbling Loonie
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    Here is an example video (30 sec):


    You can see up to 360 damage per shot. This is my old char. My current char does more damage because she has 50 Hit Lightning on the bow.
    This is without disco and corpse skin.

    For best results she need a support char like my necro bard:
    120 disco
    120 music (27 damage reduction, 19 each regens)
    120 peace
    120 magery (mage weapon)
    120 med
    60 necr0 (corpse skin, evil omen)
    90 ss
     
  18. RaistlinNowhere

    RaistlinNowhere Slightly Crazed
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    ummm i remember that you made a post talking about double shot vs AI, but cant remember which was your conclussion.
    So whats its better composite or yumi? or when is better using each one?
     
    #18 RaistlinNowhere, Feb 27, 2014
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2014
  19. CorwinXX

    CorwinXX Babbling Loonie
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    A composite bow (1.5s) does the same damage over time as a yumi (1.25s). If a monster has 50+ in its lowest resist then AI is better else DS is better.

    Notes:
    With a yumi you need 20/35 SSI while with a composite bow you need 45/60 SSI so you can add one more mod to a yumi.
    If you managed to get 1.25s then a composite bow is better against monsters with 50+ resists.
    When a monster has 50+ in lowest resist it often can be lowered under 50 by discordance and/or corpse skin.

    For a pure archer I'd advised to have both yumi and composite for each superslayer and one of each without slayers (14 bows).
    My melee archer don't want to have 14 bows and 14 swords so for each superslayer I have yumi or composite and double axe or bladed staff. And I have yumi, composite bow and double axe without slayer mod.
    Melee Archer

    There are may be about 10 bosses with 50+ lowest resist and may be about 2 bosses that can't be lowered under 50 by disco and corpse skin.

    p.s. I posted here how my disco archer fights against Navrey. And Duncan Drake posted here how his bushido paladin (with a double axe) fights against Dread Horn and Paroxysmus.
     
  20. RaistlinNowhere

    RaistlinNowhere Slightly Crazed
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    yeah have read the bushido paladin one, i made a garg mace really similar some time ago.
    About the disco archer , is a template i though to do some time ago , but never did hehe.

    About the compo and yumi , i think ill do composite for now , dont have enough runics to make 14 bows with HML reforged :(
     
  21. CorwinXX

    CorwinXX Babbling Loonie
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    When you reforge a composite bow you need to get "50 HML, 20 HSL" so you can add slayer and SSI. When you reforge a yumi you can as well use "50 HML, 20 HMD" and add slayer and HSL.
    Well you can use "50 HML, 20 HMD" compo but in this case you are forced to go without HSL (it's OK for arachnid/repond slayer).
    When you craft a bow without slayer ("main bow") you have 2 free mods on a yumi and 1 free mod on a compo.

    Really my collection of 8 bows contains only two "rare" "50 HML, 20 HSL" bows (demon and reptile slayer composite bows). For other bows you need just 10-15 attempts (30-45 charges). Well slightly more if you reject mods like resists, luck, etc.
    I have few reforged composite bow blanks with semi-useful mods (like HMD, HFat, etc) that can be used for main, arachnid and repond slayer. You want AI for Corgul (80-90 res) and Mempitis (65-75 res).
    And I have few reforged yumi blanks with useless mods (like Luck). You can use them for main, undead and elemental slayer.
    The only problem is Reptile and Demon. You want AI for Slasher (65-75 res) and Stygian (60-70 cold res). And you definetly want HSL against those heavy hitting monsters. Semidar and Riktor have 60-70 cold too.
     
  22. CorwinXX

    CorwinXX Babbling Loonie
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    WoD is a good spell but in this case I would preferred a disco-caster char:
    120 sw
    60 necro
    60+ ss (+ skills on jewels)
    120 disco
    120 music
    120 myst + 120 focus (or 120 mage + 120 eval)
    Magery has good direct fire damage spells but Mysticism has RC and Cyclone. (Well you can have both mage and myst and looking for a bard to party).

    p.s. necro for wraith and corpse skin
     
    #22 CorwinXX, Feb 27, 2014
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2014
  23. RaistlinNowhere

    RaistlinNowhere Slightly Crazed
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    hehe thats my main char right now, but i swap disco for provo , depend on what im hunting :p
     
  24. RaistlinNowhere

    RaistlinNowhere Slightly Crazed
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    about the reofrging bows, i dont need the DI from crafting so ill remove it, but my doubt here is what to imbue, HL, HF, velocity or something else. HLD with the AI isnt the best option, so ....

    The bow will have : HML - HSL - slayer - SSI and ????

    I think it will be better depends on the slayer, for example fireball for spider one, lightning for demon , but what about the others?
     
  25. CorwinXX

    CorwinXX Babbling Loonie
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    I don't think it's very important. I believe almost anything what you have got by reforging as the second mod in addition to 70 HML will be good.
     
  26. RaistlinNowhere

    RaistlinNowhere Slightly Crazed
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    ok ill finally do this template :

    archery 120
    anatomy 120
    tactics 120
    bushido 100
    heal 90
    chival 95
    SS 60
    necro 30

    But my doubt is having 100 bushido and 95 chival OR 80 bushido and 115 chival?