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Today's Ultima Online needs a looting macro/script....

Discussion in 'UHall' started by popps, Mar 23, 2014.

  1. popps

    popps Always Present
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    Well, over the years I have seen Ultima Online increasingly become, at least in regards to PvM, a game where for most hunts it is necessary, by specific game dynamics, to kill over and over and over, and the more kills in the least time the better, in order to get some of the nice items.

    Whether they might be minor or major artifacts or even the Minax items in the Blackthorn dungeon, or the Abyss mini-spawns and so no, players have to be fast in their kills if they want not to spend forever to get something nice as a drop.

    And infact, because of this, changes have been done to the game where some items would no longer drop on corpses but actually in players' backpacks so that players would no longer need to spend too much time to actually open up corpses, check the items in it and decide what would be keepers and what would not. Just kill over and over, as fast as possible, and only keep whatever drops right in the backpack.

    Now, I think there is a problem with this because there may be instances where checking up corpses might be usefull, for example for imbuing resources.......

    I think a change was made time back for the Enhanced Client (but I only play CC so I am not sure) where a macro to "auto loot" gold from corpses was allowed but I think that given how changed Ultima Online has, the looting needs to also make a step forward and it should be made possible to players to set up macros/scripts to "auto loot" from nearby corpses whatever items the players may find usefull to them without actually having to open up the corpses, pick up the items and drag them into backpacks which takes too much time and works againsts todays' dynamics of many spawns and works against chances for players to get items (whatever slowa down kills makes it more time consuming to get the in backpack drops....).

    Another reason for allowing this, is that now most spawns if not all spawns have automatic respawn of monsters and this often may create problems to players to check corpses AND keep fighting respawning mobs at the same time (especially for tougher spawns). This often results in corpses being overlooked, especially since decay often has been accellerated so as not to have too many corpses laying around which would lag the playing area, and corpses overlooked means items and imbuing resources lost.

    If such an "auto loot" macro/script was to be made available in the game, players could just set it up to auto loot the wanted items/resources and go on with their killings and auto loot from corpses while walking around.

    It would be an important enhancement of UO and of its playability and overall enjoyment, IMHO.
     
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  2. Kojak

    Kojak Lore Master
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    hmmm ... a looting script ... hmmm hehe
     
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  3. kRUXCg7

    kRUXCg7 Sage

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    Today's UO should be all about minimizing unnecessary tediousness. Anyone remember Anti-Macro-Code which led to make people train skills like magery on boats? This thing gone means more fun for everyone and it minimized tediousness.

    Anyone remember the good old crafting menus? I don't remember fully but I think it was tedious, you always had to scroll to the right like mad. Look at today's crafting windows which even sport a "make it 10 times" or "make max" method. Maybe not perfect it took a lot of tediousness out of the game and I believe everyone benefitted from this change.
     
  4. popps

    popps Always Present
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    A "legal" one from within the game client.

    Personallly, I am of the opinion that players playing by the rules should be by all means helped in increasing their enjoyment from the game through legal ways and not need to look elsewhere for ways to enhance their enjoyment of the game.
     
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  5. General Lee

    General Lee Adventurer

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    Have you tried pinco's ui? That has a looter built into it.
     
  6. popps

    popps Always Present
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    I play the Classic Client.

    The looter you mention that is built into pinco's UI what capabilities has it ? Just loot gold or is it also possible to make discriminants as to what items one wants to have looted automatically from a corpse and what not ?
     
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  7. Dermott of LS

    Dermott of LS UOEC Modder
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    ...

    Basic functionality of the EC is that you can right-click to loot items (at least in list and grid views). Pinco's UI does have a loot script, but I have not really used it to any decent degree. Pinco's will also (again in List or Grid views) sort the loot out by type putting them in a specific order.

    The CC is a product of its time and likely won't be given such scripting unless you go to external (and likely disallowed) programs.
     
  8. kelmo

    kelmo Old and in the way
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    *chuckles*
     
  9. popps

    popps Always Present
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    It can merely sort out the loot or can it also allow to auto-pick what the players may want ?

    I am asking, because I have been reading about Pinco's Scavenger Agent but am not sure I understood exactly what it does (I could not find the complete Guide to it, just bits or info here and there...).

    I will make an example to what I'd like to get done.

    Say that I am doing one of the mini spawns down the Abyss, one of the renowned ones. Some corpses "may" contain imbuing ingredients and basically junk magic items for the most part. Since I do not want to get annoyed and waste my gaming time by having to open up any and all corpses "just in case" there may be imbuing ingredients, I'd like the loot agent to just do it for me, check out the corpse without even opening it up (not to mess up with my screen), and loot up in my backpack all of the imbuing ingredients and the occasionally good magic item that may be in the corpse.

    Does pinco's UI do that ?
     
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  10. Winter

    Winter Lore Keeper

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    As far as I know, Pinco's UI does not do what you are asking, and I hope it never does. If you find it annoying to open up corpses, then don't. Asking for this ability is just asking for trouble. No program that does this should be allowed in UO - ever.
     
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  11. popps

    popps Always Present
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    I find it annoying simply because UO has "evolved" into a mass killing game where one has to kill faster and faster at the spawns in order to pile up enough kills to get decent chances at something good.

    Not my fault, I did not ask for it and yet, that's what the game has become.

    Think of all the timers we have for spawns to be done with, keys etc. It is all or for the most part a race against time.....

    I just find this necessity to kill spawns faster and faster in opposition with the ease and time needed to check corpses one at a time for imbuing reagents and so forth. That's it.

    If UO had not become a kill a go-go game I would have not felt the need for such a looting help....
     
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  12. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    :/....rigggghhhhttttttt

    -Loot for me
    -While I stand still on my invincible sampire
    -With literally .01% chance of dying to most anything currently in UO other than (some)bosses
    -Great idea!!!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  13. Necronom

    Necronom Adventurer
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    Okay, so I noticed no one mentioned what Pinco's UI actually does with the so called 'auto-looting'...

    You can set it so that whatever you want specifically by Item type is looted... The catch is, you still have to open the corpse up and click on a button, then move your mouse continuously until the looting is done and the corpse gump closes if you prefer... If you don't move the mouse, then nothing happens I think.

    Also note, for you to loot the things you want, you need to also have it already to be able to specify the type. So any random magical items won't be looted...

    I just use the right click looting.

    Edit: Btw, the Scavenger agent is different from the looting agent which is the Organizer. The Scavenger agent is the one that picks up anything that is on the ground, such as reagents.

    My bad, I said ID when it should be item type..
     
    #13 Necronom, Mar 23, 2014
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2014
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  14. azmodanb

    azmodanb Grand Poobah
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    if you want to loot stuff do it....

    i kill elementals for blackthorn drops..

    I MANUALLY loot ore and crystalline blackrock and gold. from each corpse.

    I use CC .

    Its how its always been. Kill stuff.. target .. loot while killing the next.

    I also dry loot everything in shame... to unravel. and go through it while doing so

    Keep bag.. unravel bag.

    .....

    i understand ur idea.. but lets not make it even easier for farmers.

    my two cents
     
  15. popps

    popps Always Present
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    Well, as I see it, the thing is that it already is easier for farmers, I am just asking that players who play the game legally and do not use third party nothing, would not be at a gross disadvantage at least on primary issues and, as I see it, looting corpses time IS a primary issue in today's Ultima Online where killing faster and faster and faster is increasingly more required unless one wants to take forever to get any decent drop....

    Just think at the lesser artifacts Minax drops in the newest Blackthorn Dungeon, it takes perhaps somewhat 300 kills to get 1, and then it takes 50 if not 100 points (which means 50 or 100 Minax drops) to claim anything decent from the Agent. Now, 50 x 300 = 15,000 kills and, of course, 100 means double that or, 30,000 kills......
    Now, saying that looting each corpse to check out loot takes 30 seconds (but it can take more, depending on the complexity of the loot inside the corpse...), having been slowed down 30 secs for 15,000 kills means having been slowed down some 7,500 minutes which is, 125 hours !!!! Of course, in the case of 100 points they become 250 hours !!! Having been slowed down just to loot che corpse of wanted items !!!

    So, those who use not legal looting scripts basically in the same time frame of players who play the game as intended, save up a TON of time which they can use for anything else be it in the game or not.

    Since a loot agent implemented in the Clients should not be a major thing, I imagined that at the very least for simple like imbuing reagents which do not appear on all corpses but just randomly, it could be offered by the game itself....
     
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  16. Captn Norrington

    Captn Norrington Trade Forum Administrator
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    I read everything...but I'm still not understanding it, so...currently everyone who does not cheat and use scripts, does so by choice and for the betterment of the game...and the idea is to make cheats and scripts legal?....how does this improve anything lol it will just make even more people script loot "legally" and wreck the UO economy even more.
     
  17. Petra Fyde

    Petra Fyde Peerless Chatterbox
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    I've never played any game but UO - are there games out there where you kill stuff and don't have to open packs to see what your victim had that you can loot? I've watched my family play other games, I've never seen them loot without looking.
    You can set Pincos so that only corpses not yet looted show in the object handles. That's what I use. Once I've looted them they don't show up.
     
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  18. popps

    popps Always Present
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    No, I am not saying that cheats should be made legal.

    My point is, that the way ultima online has "evolved" is that now time has been put in as a factor for many spawns. That is, there is timers for a bunch of things and unless one does not play as a killing machine, it takes forever to get good drops or, worse, time spent on the hunt gets wasted because the spawn resets.

    Treasure hunts, the chest decays unless the chest is not dug up, guardians beated (and looted) and chest emptied out in a given time.
    Several spawns do not spawn the boss unless the spawn proceeds at a certain pace.
    And so forth with a number of things, increasingly.

    The issue with looting, is that is SLOWS DOWN the needed progression of fast killing and thus, works AGAINST the intended game play i.e., kill faster and faster and faster.

    I did not ask to put UO on turbo mode, but in many things it now is and, I cannot help realizing, looting works AGAINST this modern UO in turbo mode because manual looting slows down and quite some the killing at spawns.

    So, I am by no means saying to legalize cheats, I am saying that since UO has been decided that it had to go on tubo mode where time effects on many issues the quality of the hunt and of the drops, THEN it has become necessary to introduce within the clients a way to allow players to automate looting, AT LEAST for some items needed to play the game like the imbuing reagents.

    I am calling it in merely as a LOGICAL CONSEQUENCE to the Developers' choices to evolve UO into turbo mode where time has been factored in for the quality of drops, progression of spawns etc.

    Hope I have been more clear now.
     
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  19. popps

    popps Always Present
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    The problem, as I perceive it, goes beyond not having already looted corpses not show up on screen.

    The problem is the time that it takes to actually open up the corpse, check the various items whether they are trash or keepers, select the keepers and pick them up to put them in the main back pack.
    All this takes time, it may be seconds for each task but they add up and in the end become minutes, hours, hundreds of hours. Now, if this delay did not affect game play, then no biggie.

    Unfortunately, because for many hunts time has been put in as a discriminant, I brought up the example of treasure hunting and some spawns where in order for the Boss to spawn the progression of the spawn is required to proceed at a certain pace, that's when manual looting comes into conflict because it takes time away from the fast progression of the spawn and thus works against the actual playability of Ultima Online.

    Now, IF time was not a factor for the progression of spawns, then I would have no problem in saying that such an automatic looter was not a necessity, but unfortunately, today's UO does have this annoying timer for many aspects of the game and that is why I am saying that, unfortunately, an automatic looters is now a necessity, IMHO.
     
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  20. Captn Norrington

    Captn Norrington Trade Forum Administrator
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    Ah I understand it more now, thanks for the expanded explanation. it would definitely be a useful tool, but I personally don't see it as necessary right now, if looting makes things slower...could always just not loot the smaller monsters that 99% chance don't have anything worthwhile other than the gold anyways.
     
  21. Winter

    Winter Lore Keeper

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    NONE of the spawns that you are referring to require you to loot them in order to progress through to the Champion. There is nothing on them worth looting except gold. However, these spawns were designed to be played in a group, not solo, although there is nothing wrong with playing them solo.

    The only spawns that have something worth looting in progress to the Boss mob are the Abysss mini-champ spawns, and there is plenty of time to loot individual corpses for gold and imbuing ingredients.

    What you are asking for is not going to happen. Broadsword just isn't going to allow an auto-loot macro. All that will do is help out the AFK players and scripters, and there are too many of those now.

    My advice, learn to adjust. An auto-loot macro is a bad thing and not needed.
     
  22. popps

    popps Always Present
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    The problem is, that for imbuing ingredients they often are ALSO on corpses of smaller monsters so, unfortunately, they cannot be skipped out.............

    That is why I was calling for "at least" an auto loot system to get automatically imbuing (or refinement) ingredients, so that one can skip the smaller spawn as you suggest, but without missing to bring home the much needed imbuing (or refinement) ingredients...
     
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  23. popps

    popps Always Present
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    Well, it was myunderstanding that also the Abyss mini-champ spawns are set up with a progression timer. That is, one needs to kill the lower levels at a certain speed in order to progress the spawn to the higher levels and so to the renowned Boss to spawn. Yet, checking any and all corpses for the imbuing ingredients that they "may" contain definately slows down the progression pace of the killing...

    And what about the elementals, just as another example, in Blackthorn Castle ?
    The Golden elementals have a chance to carry Crystalline Blackrock, another imbuing ingredient so, they need to also be checked. Yet, "unless" one kills them VERY fast, one after the other, forget about being able to gather 50 or 100 minax artifacts to have enough points at getting something decent so, yes, the spawn has no timer for its progression BUT, since an enormous number of kills is required per minax drop, the necessity to check out corpses for imbuing ingredients inevitably slows down the killing pace and so the building up of enough minax artifacts to accumulate the points needed to get something decent out of the time spent there...........
     
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  24. S_S

    S_S Certifiable
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    I agree with Winter. NO on any type of auto-looter. You are just asking for trouble with something like that in game. Quit being lazy and open the darn corpse or whatever. I have ZERO issues looting ore and crystalline blackrock at the golden elements and keeping up with them.
     
  25. Warpig Inc

    Warpig Inc Babbling Loonie
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    If I remember right. The doing away from gold coins was going to have loot gold just shoot to your bank total. Looting regs. Unless your using alky and scribe there is LRC. And any true alky will tell you the ammount of regs on a corpse is a tease when it comes to filling a keg. Mats for crafters. Well I have moved on to the right click grid world and don't miss the squint & drag life.

    When it comes to items. Usefull for current template. Can be imbued and enhanced for vendor bait. Unravel worth loot. Like making a jewelry box the sorting factors would be a pain in the ass coding to the Nth degree. They can't figure out how to make BOD books auto sort any better. Don't all the special relic arty drops not need looting? Those of us that live in the grid know when you open a chest the better item loot comes first. After the first five items the remaining might be unravel or a 1/3 jewel that needs filling out.

    In short. The less involved hands on you are the less it is appreciated that is done. Your given a car for free or bust your butt for a few years to buy the same car. which one gets regular oil changes and wash more? The less connected the easier it is to forget it. The death of crafting was a huge nail in UOs coffin for me. WIthout a bag full of duped runics and 60k material comm deeds nothing can be crafted can keep a mules name out there. Think lack of pride in cheating is not out there? Why is there so many uber crafted items on vendors out there with no crafted by on them?

    Some easy buttons don't make life better.
     
  26. Winter

    Winter Lore Keeper

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    That's a nice summary of this topic.

    Popps keeps changing his argument any time anyone points holes in his arguments. He seems to be trolling his own posts now.
     
  27. kRUXCg7

    kRUXCg7 Sage

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    I clicked "like" on most of his posts even though I haven't read them fully.

    I really thing you all give him a hard time, maybe too hard!

    After all, he is not breaking into your house and stealing things, so why don't you give him a little break. It's hard to concentrate if everybody and their brother is attacking you or your ideas. I think it has been expanded to an extensive degree that lots of people disagree with popps and now it's almost become kind of a man hunt!

    I disagreed with lots what popps wrote over the years. Today I might still disagree with his looting idea. But I don't disagree with the idea that some things are too tedious in current UO. Intelligent design could incorporate both a certain degree of difficulty - and still maintain a lower degree of tediousness. I don't want to judge if popp's current idea is good or bad but I do think a lot of returners leave because UO certainly is tedious in a lot of aspects.

    My suggestion:
    We should all respect each other, hug each other, give everyone a kiss on their cheek. So people who quit UO in the past know they will be welcomed by current players. Stop the man hunt, please.
     
  28. Winter

    Winter Lore Keeper

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    I read Popps' suggestion and try to understand what he is saying and why, and I don't disagree with some or all. It's certainly not a manhunt; I just don't know Popps well enough to like or dislike him.

    But this suggestion is a bad idea, and would just lead to more unattended macroing.
     
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  29. Petra Fyde

    Petra Fyde Peerless Chatterbox
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    This is incorrect. There is no speed requirement. I've used these spawns as training grounds and often taken considerable time to clear the spawn.
     
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  30. kRUXCg7

    kRUXCg7 Sage

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    No offense meant. It's just... sometimes it is overwhelming how much resistance one has to face if one suggests a game change in UHall. I felt the urge to try to urge people to go a little easier on popps.

    I cannot tell if it will lead to unattended macroing. That is beyond my knowledge. I do agree that it is certainly possible that today's suggestion of popps might be a bad one. What's your point of view, is there anything you would change about looting, Winter?
     
  31. Goldberg-Chessy

    Goldberg-Chessy Crazed Zealot
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    So basically you are saying that you have no clue or input on the topic at hand.
    You are simply in this thread to beg other posters to be more polite? On a public forum for an adult content, violent rated game that involves killing and looting?
    Who has the issue here that needs to be addressed?
     
  32. kRUXCg7

    kRUXCg7 Sage

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    Oh that is very kind of you, Goldberg-Chessy! You didn't notice, so I have to explain it to the adults!

    I did add a layer of abstraction. My abstract definition of the problem would be: "UO often times is too tedious as a game". About popp's idea: Auto-Looting would be a very pragmatic attempt to lower the stress of tediousness. I don't want to judge if it is good or bad, I just call it 'pragmatic'.

    So your grown-up statement is that this is a perfect world? A perfect discussion means people may propose one single idea, but noone is allowed to reflect about the scenario, nobody is allowed to abstract their ideas and problems? All we grown-ups do is attack each other? And some arbitrary definition of UO being a violent game is your law that allows us to do nothing but attack each other? If that's what UO discussions are all about I fear a simple macro or script could do this discussion as well, too. Attack, attack, click, click, loot, loot? :D
     
    #32 kRUXCg7, Mar 24, 2014
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2014
  33. Winter

    Winter Lore Keeper

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    I really don't find this to be much of an issue - that is how easy it is to loot a corpse. I use the EC, so it is just a right-click to loot a single item and it goes into a loot bag. Artifacts for the most part, drop into your backpack, except a few locations like the Abyss mini-champ spawns. There is plenty time enough to loot any and all corpses there. I would like to see loot tables changed, but not the ease of looting.

    The two areas that I find difficult to keep up with the spawn and looting - and I loot everything that I can, even mongbats - are Champ spawns and the red mage room in Blackthorn's Dungeon. All other areas aren't a problem for looting. I don't see the need to change the whole looting system just for these two areas.
     
  34. Goldberg-Chessy

    Goldberg-Chessy Crazed Zealot
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    You simply do not have a clue kRUX
    Who are you or popps to determine what is tedious? Or what level of tediousness causes stress? Seriously lol?
    If you or anyone else is stressed out by some abstract level of tediousness in an mmorpg maybe you have larger issues to resolve first?
    Sorry Miss Manners but you just are not making sense.
    But kudos on your flowery prose darling :)

    I can now add you to my list of trolling fools who believe it is ok to troll if you do it politely lol.
    If you are going to troll at least man up and do it directly next time maybe.
     
    #34 Goldberg-Chessy, Mar 24, 2014
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2014
  35. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    [​IMG]


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  36. popps

    popps Always Present
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    Not allowing a looting macro which could enhance the enjoyment for many players just for fear of unattended farming I do not think would be something which I can possibly agree with. I am totally against farming and cheating and always have been (just check my posting history), but I think that there should be other ways to counter it than making game play harder and less enjoyable by depriving regular players of in game tools which could make their enjoyment of the game better.
     
  37. Pawain

    Pawain Crazed Zealot
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    In Diablo 3 you just walk over the gold and choose the items by clicking. The items are color coded by quality.

    I would rather just walk over the bodies and get gold. I earned the gold, why cant it be given to me.

    Im sure the scripters have figured out a way to open corpses and grab gold automatically.
     
  38. Meat Elemental

    Meat Elemental Journeyman
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    [​IMG]

    Sent from my SGH-I317M using Tapatalk
     
  39. NuSair

    NuSair Babbling Loonie
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    That isn't quite correct Petra, if you don't kill a certain number of creatures over a period of time the spawn will regress.
     
  40. S_S

    S_S Certifiable
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    I'm going to agree with Petra on this one. Champ spawns regress if not completed within a certain timer... mini renowed champ spawns in the abyss do not.

    I just did the pixie spawn up to 2nd lvl, I'll leave and check it again in 30 mins and see where it sits.
     
    #40 S_S, Mar 25, 2014
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2014
    Barry Gibb likes this.
  41. Olahorand

    Olahorand Slightly Crazed
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    In LotRO you get a selection and can click loot all or click single items to loot them, coins are going automatically to your account.
    Also in other games you will be presented the loot list or even auto loot.

    The problem for me is the overhelming amount of stuff to loot in some of the monsters (take the recent EM events) and the fact, that I cannot always find the corpse in the first step (i.e. the final boss monster from such event buried under all the player, pet and monster corpses) or if you open it another player cuts it or uses necro skill on it or if the single player loot mode timer went off, which closes the open corpse and make it necessary to find it again, often in another form. So only people with certain scripts gain what ever good stuff may be in these corpses.
    Therefore I agree, that some loot help mechanics are necessary.
    *Salute*
    Olahorand
     
  42. Winter

    Winter Lore Keeper

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    That's wrong and Petra is correct. The mini-Champ spawns in the Abyss do not regress - unless the Champ has already spawned. Then it resets after a couple hours or after the server save. But it does not regress.
     
  43. popps

    popps Always Present
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    With imbuing, I find myself sometimes looking for some low level items, for example at the moment I am looking for jewellery with SSI and no other modifier on it so to be able to imbue it as I prefer.

    This, unfortunately, forces me to have to look at all loot just in case I finally bump into something usable. But since this is a very rare occurrance, even though is a very very low level item, this means that I have to go through checking hundreds, thousands of corpses..... It gets old............
    If the client had a looting agent that I could filter for what I am looking for (a jewellery piece with SSI on it), I would just keep on hunting and killing until eventually I see that piece of jewellery appear in my backpack without having to waste countless time to check every single corpse I kill "just in case"....

    I don't know, perhaps my idea of "fun" and "enjoyment" differs from that of other players, who knows....
     
  44. Petra Fyde

    Petra Fyde Peerless Chatterbox
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    I think there is a misunderstanding here. I am fully aware that normal Campion spawns regress, but my comment was in reply to a question about the Abyss mini champ spawns, which don't.
     
    Barry Gibb likes this.
  45. Shackles

    Shackles Adventurer

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    I agree with points on both sides of the argument.

    If not a auto built in looter, how about at least having the most recent kill corpse open up when the mob dies? THAT is my biggest frustration when killing in a small area, those bodies stack up, and it becomes harder and harder finding your most recent kill.
     
  46. NuSair

    NuSair Babbling Loonie
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    My apologies, I didn't see the reference to the mini champ spawns.
     
  47. Winter

    Winter Lore Keeper

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    The EC with Pinco's UI show the latest kill using object handles, then goes away once you open the corpse. It's easy to find corpses that haven't been opened.
     
  48. azmodanb

    azmodanb Grand Poobah
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    UO has always been a kill massive amounts of stuff and loot type of game. It has not evolved IMO.

    I remember pre trammel killing massive amounts of spawn trying to get more vanq weapons or invul armor. And always having to open the corpse and loot... and back then I would still dry loot and smelt for ingots.

    Keep bag.. smelt bag.
     
  49. The Zog historian

    The Zog historian Babbling Loonie
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    Heaven forbid you should have to put in at least a little effort. You're talking about all but setting the game on auto.
     
  50. The Zog historian

    The Zog historian Babbling Loonie
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    And UOA has a setting "Auto show corpse names," which displays the latest for several seconds. But heaven forbid popps would have to double-click the name to open it and check the loot...