All the other discussion made me decide to look at how things stack up... Maps have certain set contents by level - a specific amount of gold, gems, scrolls and regs. These will add up to within a range of 1-2 points per pile of regs, so that, for example, all first level map chests have 27 stones of the first 3, 15-18* stone of regs, then the weight of 6 items. *theoretically 12-18 (4 to 6 stone per pile), but the range is 40-60 per pile, and one would have to have EXACTLY 40 for the pile to weigh 4 stones. So, it's near certain each reg pile will weigh 5-6 stones (41-50 = 5 stone, 51-60 = 6 stones). The highest chests will have 2 "piles" of some regs, that stack as one pile when the chest is generated, for space, as there are only 13 regs, and the number of reg piles is 3*level. Now, for items, there are about 110 item types (treating facings/jewelry metal color as not relevant - most of the items, other than masks, wands and jewelry. are on the list - just a matter of editing out the irrelevant items, adding the missing items, adding the weights and dividing by the number) that can spawn in map chests. This results in an average weight of a chest item of almost exactly 5 stones. As means go, this means there will be a little more variation on this in a small chest, than a large chest with lots of items to balance each other out. The lightest items weigh 1 stone. The heaviest weapon weighs 17 stone (war mace), the heaviest armor 15 stone (most ringmail pieces). Note that there are 13 types of regs, and 9 types of gems. As these stack with their own type, with 10 equal to 1 stone, each time one combines loot from multiple chests, some of the weight will "drop off" from piles combining to make a lesser weight. This will happen half the time with regs, when the same reg type already present, about 80% of the time when that gem type is already present. This said, now is the time to run the numbers. These numbers do not count the incidental loot from a given map, but will list these as notes. Level One Map Loot Gold: 1000 (20 Stones) Gem piles: 3 (3 Stones maximum) Scrolls: 4 (4 Stones) Reagent Piles: 3 (15-18 stone) Items: 5 items (average 5 each) Theoretical Maximum Weight: 130 Stones Typical average weight: 70 Stone <u>Incidental Loot:</u> minor amounts of gold (about 30-50 per kill), spined leather from any ratmen that spawn, potential bones from Zombies. Trip Impact: If all loot kept, probably able to do 5 per trip before unloading. If junk items dropped in corpse or otherwise disposed of, could get 8-10 maps done per trip without a pack animal or BOS - more if you don't take the scrolls to sell back/stuff books (T-maps an excellent way to fill the level 4-7 spells in newly crafted books, or the 5-7 level spells in the New Haven book). A blue beetle can allow you to double these numbers without it running into speed issues, maybe even quadruple them if you don't need mobility (but beware islands where less careful hunters may have left behind level 6 map spawn). beyond that point, one starts having ITEM COUNT issues in your pack and pet, if you keep everything for sale to NPCs. Level Two Map Loot Gold: 2000 (40 Stones) Gem piles: 6 (6 Stones maximum) Scrolls: 8 (8 Stones) Reagent Piles: 6 (30-36 stone) Items: 10 items (average 5 each) Theoretical Maximum Weight: 260 Stones Typical average weight: 128 Stone <u>Incidental Loot:</u> some gold (about 50-100 per kill, and more kills), and additional reagents and gems from the kills (all but gargoyle have at least 1 reagent, and the gargoyle and earth ele have at least 1 gem each). Orcs & Gargoyles have scrolls (the orcs have the level 1-3 scrolls most other monsters do not, for book assembly). Random potions from gazers (probably worth more as an empty bottle - save and use as needed); slightly more worth looting since like potions stack now, and you can always take them to save and stack the bottles. Minimal weight increase from anything other than the gold, bottles and scrolls. Trip Impact: If all loot kept, probably able to do 3 per trip before unloading. If junk items dropped in corpse or otherwise disposed of, could get 4-5 maps done per trip without a pack animal or BOS. Leaving out scrolls will get you 1 more round, probably, but this is the point where they start actually accumulating to measurable amounts of gold when sold, for the effort to haul them. A pack beetle will get you 2-3 more in before you start hitting the ridden bug fatigue issue. You could probably do up to 10 extra, ignoring the fatigue (hoping lag doesn't take you at a bad time or wandering leftovers greeting you), but again, eventually you start having item count issues. Level Three Map Loot Gold: 3000 (60 Stones) Gem piles: 9 (9 Stones maximum) Scrolls: 12 (12 Stones) Reagent Piles: 9 (45-54 stone) Items: 15 items (average 5 each) Theoretical Maximum Weight: 390 Stones Typical average weight: 216 Stone <u>Incidental Loot:</u> considerable gold (about 100-300 per kill), and additional reagents and gems from the kills, especially about 20 necro regs per lich. Extra weight will start to pile on from the kills for this map and higher ones. Trip Impact: If most loot kept, probably able to do 2 per trip AT MOST before unloading. 1 trip is much more likely. If junk items dropped in corpse or otherwise disposed of, should get 2 maps done per trip without a pack animal or BOS. Leaving out scrolls MIGHT get you 1 more round. A pack beetle will get you 2 more in before you start hitting the ridden bug fatigue issue. You could probably do up to 5-7 extra (keeping most loot - maybe as many as 10 throwing most of it away), ignoring the fatigue (but this map's spawn is potentially lethal if you can't move). Item count issues also start occuring more frequently. Level Four Map Loot Gold: 4000 (80 Stones) Gem piles: 12 (9 Stones - probably at least one of each gem, but 2-4 gems is still just 1 stone weight) Scrolls: 16 (16 Stones) Reagent Piles: 12 (60-72 stone) Items: 38 items (average 5 each) Theoretical Maximum Weight: over 700 Stones. Typical average weight: 350 Stone <u>Incidental Loot:</u> large amounts of gold (about 300-500 per kill), and lots of necro regs from the lich lords. Additional scrolls from the LL & Daemons. First real chance of potential keeper loot from the spawn as well as the chest. Trip Impact: If most loot kept, you'll only get 1 per trip, 2 with a beetle, without going overweight. Even dropping most of the junk, you might be able to squeeze in one more before unloading, even with the beetle, and still have the beetle able to run. The bump in items added to level 4 & higher maps (note how they went from 5 per level to 38, instead of 20, at 4th level) means it is likely that even 4 maps will give you item count issues on you and your packy. If you have a safe (friend or public) house that the map spawn can't cast into, or otherwise get to pack horses kept nearby, one MIGHT try that route, to get 5 or more done in 1 trip at one location. Even a boat hold is little more than a bandaid for the situation, but it does at least give you an easy way to get back from the bank or home after a loot drop, via the ship key (since all these high-level maps are on islands). Level Five Map Loot Gold: 5000 (100 Stones) Gem piles: 15 (9 Stones - probably at least one of each gem, but 2-9 gems is still just 1 stone weight) Scrolls: 20 (20 Stones) Reagent Piles: 15 (75-90 stone - note that at this level, you get 1 pile of each reg, plus two more. This will result in 2 "double-size" reg piles, or, rarely, one triple-size pile) Items: 50 items (average 5 each) Theoretical Maximum Weight: over 1000 Stones. Typical average weight: 470 Stone <u>Incidental Loot:</u> 1-2 times as much gold from the kills as from the chest itself. Lots of necro regs from the lich lords (and smaller amounts of nightshade from the poison eles). Additional scrolls from most of the spawn. High chance of potential keeper loot from the spawn as well as the chest. Trip Impact: To even do one of these, you'd best have a pack animal or beetle present, if you plan to haul most of the loot back. I've seen just one map come close to fatiguing the beetle from its load plus the rider. A second might be possible, if you junk a lot of stuff. See Trip impact notes for Level Four for hints. Level Six Map Loot Gold: 6000 (120 Stones) Gem piles: 18 (9 Stones - probably at least one of each gem, but 2-9 gems is still just 1 stone weight) Scrolls: 24 (24 Stones) Reagent Piles: 18 (90-108 stone - note that at this level, you get 1 pile of each reg, plus five more, resulting in several "double-size" or "triple-size" piles) Items: 60 items (average 5 each) Special Items: 1 Backpack (2 stone?) and within it, 1 minor artifact (can weigh up to 17 stone, for the arctic death dealer) Theoretical Maximum Weight: 1300 Stones. Typical average weight: 560 Stone <u>Incidental Loot:</u> 2-3 times as much gold from the kills as from the chest itself. Huge piles of barbed leather from Ancient Wyrms that spawn, plus scales. A few regs and scrolls, but LOTS of potentially high-end treasure to sort through on the corpses. Trip Impact: These by their very nature require AT LEAST 1 pack animal, friend, or bank trip - probably a packy AND bank trips. One can easily bring back 20-25 THOUSAND gold from one trip, BEFORE selling any gems, scrolls, etc. you might bring back. You WILL overload your beetle before you complete this map, so be prepared to do a bank drop immediately after killing the initial spawn, looting them, and grabbing the gold & minor arty from the chest, if you do these solo. You'll still probably overload your beetle again with stuff if you keep the junk and skin the AWs (remember - an AW is good for 40-44 barbed leather (elf/human), which is enough to craft 1 suit of runic-made gear, or 600-660 points at the library. The scales are 20 points each in value there, too, at an upstairs donation, for 240 points toward the anthro glasses). I personally suggest taking a bunch of friends and having fun with at least as many level 6 maps as you have people present, and having each person get at least one chest to loot as "theirs" (with the minor arty), and having someone willing to run excess loot (like the skins and regs that the chest looter-designate doesn't want) back to a safe house regularly for later splitting among those who do want the items.