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We need more options for soul forges!

Discussion in 'UHall' started by It Lives, Nov 24, 2014.

  1. It Lives

    It Lives Lore Master
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    The current soul forges are massive and take up too much real estate.

    I know there is a small reward soul forge but chances of the drop are dismal.

    What Do You Think?
     
  2. Captn Norrington

    Captn Norrington Trade Forum Administrator
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    They added the small reward soul forge for that exact reason, but if they added a new one that was easier to get it would make the small reward one pointless, and then nobody would hunt the boss that drops it. So...although I understand what you mean, I don't see a reason for more of them to be made.
     
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  3. Uvtha

    Uvtha Grand Poobah
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    You may know this, and I know it's not aesthetically idea in every home but if you place your SF on goza mats you can raise the mats up, which will break the forge, and you can chop it down to as few pieces as you wish.

    In my case a full size SF simply did not fit in my house without major decorative compromises, so I dyed it and chopped it, leaving behind just the east and west pillars, which are perfectly easy to decortae around. :D

    But I do agree. What I really want is the soul forge from the P.Lich spawn to actually work, because the art on the deeded Scalis (its on Scalis right?) dropped one is simply atrocious. I wouldn't put that thing within ten feet of a house of mine, regardless of utility. But that's just me.
     
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  4. HoneythornGump

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    Let's invalidate even more content? No...hell no!

    Go get your fisherman and your friends and get after Osiredon if you want the small soulforge that's why we play the damn game not to make everything easily attainable and readily available for everyone.

    People want high end items handed out like it was candy. Everyone wants a vending machine created for items they want and can't get, or are too lazy to work toward. Anyone who puts in the time can get the forge.

    Hardly any BOSSES in the game drop any good content. Osiredon is one of the few that actually drops a highly sought after item.

    Terrible thread and request.:thumbdown:

    I want a +20 Royal Guard Stealth Cloak. I don't have one. You know what my plan is?

    I'm gonna go farm Primevil Lich or Abyssal Infernal until I get one. I consider myself on a Quest for the item and it's what keeps me playing the game (going after the things that I want but don't have).
     
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  5. Uvtha

    Uvtha Grand Poobah
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    I think the point here is that non 9 square tile soul forges should have been available craftable since day one, I mean if you own a small home the thing could occupy an entire floor. That's stupid. Soul forges are an essential requirement of a common skill, the equivalent of an anvil, not some special artifact like the sash you mention, it shouldn't be rare unless it does something special. It's lame that the "special" thing (other than being a special kind of hideous) about the 1 tile forge is that it doesn't dominate your floorspace.

    They should have offered a varying size of soul forge (as they did with regular forges) adding at least an alternate 2x2 or 3x1 soul forge if no a 1 tile forge and the one that drops off the boss should have had a special bonus like the queen's forge offers. That way players would have incentive to get the forge on the boss, and people who cannot kill 100 bosses or spent 100m for a small forge wouldn't have to go through the process of chopping a big forge down to a mutilated 1 tile forge to fit the damn thing in their house.

    It's very similar kind of situation to the refinement amalgamaor. They introduce something that people really don't like, then rather than change it to the way it had ought to have been on day one, they force players to invest more time or money to fix it themselves.
     
    #5 Uvtha, Nov 24, 2014
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2014
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  6. Warpig Inc

    Warpig Inc Babbling Loonie
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    Something 30% the size should be an option build that has a rare drop component to craft. With the bonus at the Queen's forge I never use my home forge. I use it to check an item for imbuing or altering an item is all.

    Have to look at players could circle at their home. Instead they use the Brit bank one for the bonus. The queen's forge needs to be advertised better. Maybe a more public forge with bonus props could be added someplace. Story arc for the event / RP world. A more public populated area could work better for newer character/players to get some easy quick work done.
     
  7. Zuckuss

    Zuckuss Order | Chaos
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    What if they made a four tile soul forge? That way it would fit much more easily into our homes, and it wouldn't diminish the value of the single tile soul forge.
     
  8. Lorddog

    Lorddog Crazed Zealot
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    it use to be when you break it you cant redesign your house without losing it and having to rebreak a new one.
    is that still true?
     
  9. Mandrake of DF

    Mandrake of DF Lore Keeper
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    Yep
     
  10. Hardy

    Hardy Lore Master
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    Afraid so, any broken item will be lost when you customise
     
  11. Lorddog

    Lorddog Crazed Zealot
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    also, for those that don't know - you can have the forge on any floor and still access it from any floor up or down just as if you are next to it.
     
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  12. Merlin

    Merlin The Enchanter
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    Exactly. The single tile soul forge is main reason people run Scalis and typically goes for 100M+. We shouldn't diminish the value of that because people want 8 more tiles of deco room.
     
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  13. It Lives

    It Lives Lore Master
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    All valid points and ideas!

    I do not want the reward one tile forge at all to be diminished. I have hard working up to date Chars that can do and do peerless, I get that point.

    However I do not like that my only option is to stuff a over sized soul forge into my old school house with a patio, not to mention it does not match any deco scheme I can create given my house type. I do know how to break a soul forge with goza it can only be broken outside a home with no roof or in a customized home.

    My suggestion is implement a Hide helmet button idea except what i am hiding is the soul forge. perhaps an existing graphic like the large forge graphic.
     
    #13 It Lives, Nov 24, 2014
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2014
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  14. Smoot

    Smoot Grand Poobah
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    you can lock down the individual pieces and they will stay thru customization. not sure if its still the case but you could a while back.
     
  15. HoneythornGump

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    A soulforge is not an essential item, it's a luxury.

    No one has to have a soulforge at their house. Use the public Soulforge in Ter Mur or the Queens's Forge or get a bigger house.
     
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  16. HoneythornGump

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    Also, it's worth noting that any change to the 1 tile soulforge will invalidate Osiredon which in turn will invalidate fishing and decrease the reason to fish as it too is no longer lucrative. One of the major reason people fish is for the chance to pull up Ancient SoS, to either sell or fish up the ASOS content, and then sell the nets or perhaps hunt down Scalis.

    So you'll be making fishing essentially useless much in the way VvV has made treasure hunting worthless via the introduction of 'Royal Pardons' and massive decrease in 'murders' due to the new system of flagging.

    Yes I know, they just recently revamped treasure hunting in the last publish, however unless there is something unique to Treasure Hunting Chest which separate it from ever other aspect of the game then I'm going straight to the trough and I'm going to fight the BOSSES that drop the best #$%%. I'll bypass the treasure hunting alltogether until they add something UNIQUE to it again.

    Alot of these systems are connected and when you make a change to one it can make the other obsolete. Major aspects of UO lik Treasure Hunting and Fishing for example could become totally useless (Treasure Hunting is worthless imo) and will be hearing calls for Fishing needs a revamp and treasure hunting need a revamp etc.

    Is that worth it all because someone can't cast recall to a public soul forge?

    Is that good for the health of the game?
     
  17. R Traveler

    R Traveler Babbling Loonie
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    I have soulforge on roof and don't care about its size. On other side it cover larger area around my chests with resources to craft and imbue.
     
  18. Uvtha

    Uvtha Grand Poobah
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    If you have Imbuing, yes, it is an essential item, you cannot use your skill without it.

    No one HAS to has anything thing in their homes. No one HAS to have a home at all. But of course is it reasonable to expect that players will both want a house, and if they have a character with imbuing (which is all but a requirement to play these days) they would want, just like any other crafting skill, to be able to do it in their home.

    I get what you are saying, but you must get what we are saying.
     
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  19. Uvtha

    Uvtha Grand Poobah
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    Replace it with something else? Let crafters make a 2x2 forge? Give the queens bonus to the one he drops? The forge drop is not some crucial element to that boss, it could be easily changed and still have him maintain his value as a target. You could have it both ways easily.

    Anyway, scalis is not the ONLY thing fishing has. It may be the only thing you value, but its not the only thing. People would still fish if the boss didn't exist at all.
     
    #19 Uvtha, Nov 24, 2014
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2014
  20. Uvtha

    Uvtha Grand Poobah
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    You could just change what it does, or change the drop to something else altogether, or simply give people a SMALLER but not 1 tile forge, 2x2 whatever. House floor space may not be of value to you, but it may be of value to others. Not everyone has a castle.
     
  21. Spree

    Spree Babbling Loonie
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    the soul forge is just too big you cant place it in a smaller house. Give the reward forge the same benefits as the queens forge and ir will still have a reason to hunt for it.
     
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  22. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    You say it's not essential!?! What the crap are you smoking!?!

    That's like saying it's not essential to have a regular forge in your house because you can go to one in any town. I call BS.

    You by that thinking don't need anything in your house at all. Infact you don't need chests because you can just lock things down... you don't need to have an anvil there is one at any city smith.... you don't need a spinning wheel, loom, forge, or anything because they are at smith and tailorshops in any town... so why have them in your house.

    That has got to be the most insane argument ever.

    I have to agree with everyone... First off in order to put one of those monstrosities at my house I'd have to have a huge open area for it without anything "over" it... Don't have it.... Hell I'd be happy if they gave us a craftable one that was 4x4... that would be just fine... But the whole thing is just so frelling large. I'd be super happy with something 2x2. I have no idea wtf they were thinking making it take up such a Large amount of space. Totally and completely insane.

    And I always do my stuff at the Queen Forge so that wouldn't stop me from doing that. I don't like to waste resources... So offering us a more useful item just makes freaking sense... would make players VERY happy..... Hell I'd be ok if it was a 5 year vet reward item to have a 2x2 soulforge. I'd waste a vet reward on it. But that's me.

    As for the 1 tile soulforge I've killed Osridain a ton of times... I've actually gotten 2 to drop. It's so overly rare it's not even funny. I thought it was going to be great that there was this mob that spawns from the white nets rarely.. but think about how rare a white net is.... how they screwed up folk hunting the leviathans to put this on that and not be able to hunt yourself with white nets anymore because of Osridian now being summoned by them.. ruined white nets for me.... then.... to top that off you figure in how freaking rare it is to get a drop at all from him..... and top that with the other crap you get and the chances of getting one are so freaking slim it's not even funny.

    And having actually gotten this drop 2x.... I'll say this... I've killed so many of them I highly doubt most folk would do this... first off the crap that drops on most sea monsters including him is CRAP..... the loot sucks. Even the Leviathan has super lame loot and the one you have to have the special stuff to spawn.... even a bigger waste of time and resources to spawn and fight... total crap on that thing. So don't go telling me that it is not something we need....

    That's the most preposterous load of Bull I've ever heard.
     
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  23. Warpig Inc

    Warpig Inc Babbling Loonie
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    Not holding an ASH and wearing a tally at that anvil is dorked. It is done for the bonus. Using an at home arcane circle vs the WBB or crystal caves ones. For the bonus. Same goes for using an at home soul forge vs the queen's forge. It is all about dat bonus. There are a few uses for the at home one. Just not Imbuing for any other reason but for training with the lower chance rate. Only use my at home one has had for the last year was a few altering or checking if something is going to go to the queen's forge.

    The rare rate of the one spacer has one powerful factor. Only hunt you go on CHAT about starting and a group of random players show up. A hunt that draws players without some PVPing lure and an hour of smack talk after.
     
  24. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    Doesn't always draw players anymore... after killing the thing dozens of times and NEVER getting drops most folk won't bother wasting their time or resources trying to kill it. THAT is the biggest flaw of the game right there. People do it a few times find they never get a drop and quit doing it.... who wants to invest 30 to 40 minutes killing something risk losing 30k in insurance cost and everything to walk away empty handed or with 200 gold to show for your efforts. NOT really good... So yeah most folk just say no to doing those sorts of things anymore. Rather like EM events.... People got upset about never ever getting a drop.. and they quit coming. Or they complain constantly about it.

    It's not fun to put a lot of work into something to get nothing in return.
     
  25. Lord Arm

    Lord Arm Seasoned Veteran

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    u will get one if u do a lot of them, just do it ill help. there's not many things that really sell in the game. if they give out like candy becomes worthless and if u just bought one for millions, you wouldn't be very happy. we have done community white net events, napa. haven't done one in awhile. oh good loot now too.
     
  26. Mandrake of DF

    Mandrake of DF Lore Keeper
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    Actually a whole lot of peoples enjoy that!!! They like the challange and the fun, and yes - its 40min in game having fun with other players. As for the reason to do other stuff in game!!!

    Not everything has to be profitable, or give you the best items or loot - but you have a shot at it! Its like lotty, why do you think so many peoples around the world buy their lottery tickets?

    Im sad to hear that for you it has to be top loot or you wont attend.

    As for the soulforge - we are given it as it is, and there are tricks to make them smaller and more convinient. They also work up and down on floors, so placing one at top level of your house and chop it up is easy to deco around.
    If you want a small you can place wherever you want - you have to pay uo gold for it or hunt it down.

    The small soulforge is a chain reward including several levels, and peoples are doing them every day. They are not supposed to be spawning so everyone can have one. And as the game and design is now - it works well.
     
  27. Uvtha

    Uvtha Grand Poobah
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    I mean obviously its too late toe change now, I'm just disappointed about the choices they made. The most annoying thing is that they had plenty of opportunity to add a smaller forge post SA-pre HS, when people were first complaining about the size, but they didn't.
     
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  28. HippoRedux

    HippoRedux Adventurer

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    No, I did not know that -ty:)
     
  29. Smoot

    Smoot Grand Poobah
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    only thing i could suggest would be to offer a smaller soulforge for around 30 dollars from UO store. It would give players the option if they really wanted it, while keeping the value of the Scalis encounter.

    We all know the devs dont revamp boss loot drops, so many worthless bosses. Nothing should be added that would de-value those bosses anymore than they already are.
     
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  30. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    30 dollars is a bit steep IMO. But they could offer one on the store for some reasonable price and I'm sure it'd sell.
     
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  31. Warpig Inc

    Warpig Inc Babbling Loonie
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    30 is just the current gold rate vs the dollar as it sells now. 14 years ago at what the forge sell for gold now, one would cost over $1000 RL cash.

    30,000 in insurance? You might be doing it wrong. Might want to check your insure table list. Hey it don't crawl out da water and you don't have to fight it in cramped quarters.

    Considering the drop rate of the one spacer. The fact your second task is playing the RNG game with all the MIBs that had to be farmed. The RNG still has it's say when tossing the net. And we all know how the RNG hates us when it comes to drops of any sort from a boss. At one point you find something better to do with your time then hope for some deco thing. As a way of making gold one figures out farming Miasma is a better profit.

    What needs to be done is improve the means to spawn the boss. I'd say an NPC at the Buc's docks/shore that sells a dye that turns normal nets white. Limit the number times an ACCOUNT can do this a day. BAMM new goldsink.

    Still left scratching head on best forge use when imbuing. A home deco item most likely vs there being a queen's forge out there. I wasted time working a skill on a fisher so I could put a very valuable deco piece on a very expensive boat. A boat that could glitch poof and get a canned your SOL. I'm to lazy to load a pack of packies to move loot. Let alone friend my Imbuer to my boat or my pets. "Got Multiclient?"

    There needs to be a one shot craft 2x2 recipe added to the game for a smaller forge. There needs to be a window option when placing the bigger forge for a 3x3 version. A 3x3 vet reward forge that has the queen's forge bonus.

    FYI: The HellHound can not be retouched becuase? There is no artwork for a dead bonded HellHound.
     
    #32 Warpig Inc, Nov 25, 2014
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2014
  32. Lady CaT

    Lady CaT Seasoned Veteran
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    *casts recall on rune to Queen's soulforge*
     
  33. Smoot

    Smoot Grand Poobah
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    i think 30 is reasonable. considering the one in game is about 125mil ($25 gold converted to cash) , the one in the store should be slightly more expensive, because you are paying for the convenience of not having to find one available, or hunt for one in game, or take the time to chop down the craftable one.

    another option would be to offer a less desirable, but cheaper one in the store. say 8 tiles instead of the 16 tile we have now for maybe 10 bucks or something. it would still hurt the value of the single tile, but not so much to make the boss not worth doing.

    Personally i would never buy a single tile or double tile or whatever.
    I like my 2 tile just fine. it doesnt look big and bulky at all and is very convenient. I have my work area on the first floor, with the 2 tile chopped forged illusioned into the plants on a small second level just big enough to cover up my ulgy looking containers in the work area.

    [​IMG]
     
  34. It Lives

    It Lives Lore Master
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    I like a lot of the ideas and find the best argument for some optional soul forges to be that it is a reasonable request from a craftsman's view point. Smiths can make forges and have several to choose from Tailors can have all of their tools of the trade in house........

    I understand the arguments but still feel there is reasonable middle ground with plenty of options to keep the reward soul forge a viable loot.

    I use the public forges daily/ I hunt for the reward forge when I can/I know how to break the larger soul forge with goza/I play hard and earn my loot. I still feel an optional smaller forge would benefit all.
     
  35. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    Like I said I'd be happy with using a Vet reward to get one that is say 2x2 or something... I think that would be reasonable IMO. As for chopping one up I've considered it but with my current set up I honestly am not sure I can do it. I'd like to avoid going into custom mode at the Garden but I honestly don't know where I'd put this thing in the first place to even chop it up. NONE Of my floors has the room save the first floor to even raise the number of goza mats I'd need to place a forge. Be a royal pain to place all the tiles on the first floor raise them over the 3rd floor to place this thing then drop the pieces I need back down to the first floor. Not sure it's worth the bother. As "often" as I actually imbue anything and as I said I pretty much ALWAYS use the Queens forge to do anything the only thing I use the one at home for (which right now is at my Theatre and I'd much rather have all my crafting stuff at one venue.) is to check exactly what things I need to have before heading over to the Queens forge. Certainly I could move my 1 tile forge there.. but ever since I got the thing it's sat where it is and I've never had much desire to move it as they were always pretty buggy in the beginning and I've always had fears of chopping it. Especially given it's $ value.
     
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