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weap damage - missing something

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Sevin0oo0, Dec 24, 2010.

  1. Sevin0oo0

    Sevin0oo0 Guest

    Went to shame to kill earth ele's to compare 2 weaps
    dunno what i'm missing in figuring the 30% damage increase in the one wep
    something just seems wrong, one is hitting for almost double the other


    elemental slayer - cleaver
    physical 100% base damage 11-13
    typ hit for: 38-47 (42 avg)

    earth elemental slayer - crescent blade
    physical 100% base damage 11-14
    dam increase 30%
    typ hit for: 65-83 (74 avg)

    I would had thought them to be within just a few points of each other?
     
  2. Doubleplay

    Doubleplay Lore Keeper
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    I believe that the elemental slayer will do double damage vs an earth elemental while an earth elemental slayer will do triple damage.
     
  3. Doubleplay

    Doubleplay Lore Keeper
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    You must have some other damage modifier at work.

    My calcs for first weap: 11*2=22 13*2=26. So damage expected from first weapon is 22-26.

    For second weap: ((11*.3)+(11))*3=43 ((14*.3)+(14))*3=55. So damage expected from second weapon is 43-55.

    Since these numbers do not agree with what you have experienced, I suspect there are other modifiers operating. Looks like you are getting about 50% more damage than accounted for on each. Other factors may be: Your tactics level, your DI, the earth elemental (30) physical resist and etc.
     
  4. Sevin0oo0

    Sevin0oo0 Guest

    yeah, I have those tok gloves, 25% add i think, must be the x3 vs x2 thing. I didn't know, or forgot a straight slayer got x3, thought it was all x2. Thanks!
     
  5. Nyses

    Nyses Lore Keeper
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    Unless something has changed, Super slayers (Elemental) receive a 100% damage bonus and regular Slayers (Earth Elemental) receive a 150% damage bonus.
     
  6. Vaelix

    Vaelix Guest

    Right here..

    Universal Slayers (Super) receive a 100% Damage INC (Elemental, Repond, Demon)

    Specific Slayers receive a 150% Damage INC (Earth Ele, Fire Ele, Skeleton)

    Thats all you are seeing.
     
  7. Basara

    Basara UO Forum Moderator
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    Excuse me, that should be +100% and +200%, (not 100% and 150%) - non-super slayers were specifically stated to do triple damage.
     
  8. Vaelix

    Vaelix Guest

    Super Slayers do Double Damage, which is 100% so Double of X to be a total of 100% would be 50%, so Triple of 50% would be 150%, where as 200% is quadruple.


    Correct me if I am wrong though :yell:
     
  9. Basara

    Basara UO Forum Moderator
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    You're so wrong that I'm having trouble finding the words to decribe how you're wrong. The only thing I can figure is you are confusing the base damage for DI.
    The "100%" for base Damage is NOT part of your listed DI. the bonuses for slayers are actually given as DI values, not actually a multiplier.


    Super slayers do +100% DI to their affected types, which is effectively doubling your base damage (but not other sources of DI, which just add on top).
    Regular Slayers do +200% DI, which amounts to tripling of your base damage.

    The only things that add +50% DI in the game every time when used are
    1. Items with 50% DI
    2. The Spell "Enemy of one"
    3. The special move "Crushing Blow"

    And, all of these are affected by the DI cap.
     
  10. Lorddog

    Lorddog Crazed Zealot
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    noone is making sense here
    if damage is 40 then what is the slayer amount and what is the super slayer amount?
     
  11. Vaelix

    Vaelix Guest

    Alright here is where I am confused..

    If Double is adding 100%

    How does triple which is only 1 more than double, add another 100%, if x2 Is adding 100%, it would take x4 to make 200%, Its impossible for Double to be 100% if triple is 200%, basically is the point i am trying to make.

    Double = 2
    Triple = 3
    Quadruple = 4

    Double = 100%
    Triple = 150%
    Quadruple = 200%

    If you are jumping to 100% From double, how is triple (Which is double and a half) Adding another 100%, Thats not making sense.
     
  12. Basara

    Basara UO Forum Moderator
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    Lorddog:

    if the base damage listed on your Status bar is 40-43 for the weapon (which would be against 0 resists, and includes the damage bonuses for STR, Tactics & Anatomy(and LJ if applicable)), then a superslayer adds another 40-43, and a regular slayer adds 80-86. Then, any other DI is added in, up to the cap (which a superslayer counts as 100% of the 300% cap, and a regular one counts as 200% towards cap)

    so, assuming you have 100% more DI from equipment or spells.

    versus 0 resist, base weapon damage 40-43, with 100% non-slayer DI

    A superslayer will add +100% more DI (to 200% of the 300% cap), doing 120-129 after modification. 40-43 of this is base damage, and equal amount comes from the weapon/jewelry/etc. DI, and another amount equal to this comes from the slayer.

    A regular slayer will add +200 more DI (200%+ the 100% from your weapon, jewelry, etc. takes you to the 300% DI cap), doing 160-172 after modification. That's 40-43 from the base damage, an equal amount from the non-slayer DI, and the DI from the slayer will be twice the base damage (80, 82, 84, or 86, depending if the damage "roll" was 40, 41, 42, or 43)
     
  13. Basara

    Basara UO Forum Moderator
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    :wall::wall::wall:

    The point is, you're still making no sense.

    Your BASE DAMAGE is what is getting doubled or tripled.
    It is NOT part of the +100%

    "Double" is "Base Damage" + "Base Damage"
    "Triple" is "Base Damage" + "Two Times Base Damage"
    or

    X= Base Damage (NOT PART OF THE DI CAP)
    Y = X, for purposes of Slayer DI (and is part of the DI cap)

    Superslayer = X + Y = which is 100% (Base Damage) + 100% (Displayed DI over and above the base damage)
    Regular Slayer = X + 2Y = wich is 100% (Base) + 200% (Displayed DI)

    Then, your other DI adds to the slayer DI, up to a total of +300% max


    Your statements are like saying that One person plus One person equals one and a half persons, because there is 100% MORE than there was before, and half of 100% is 50%.
     
  14. Naisikras

    Naisikras Guest

    Double = 2 * value
    Triple = 3 * value
    Quadruple = 4 * value

    If you double your money, 40 bucks, you have 80
    If you triple your money, 40 bucks, you have 120, not 100

    Basara's post is probably more accurate ^ I was just speaking in general terms.
     
  15. Vaelix

    Vaelix Guest

    Okay, so Slayers Double and Triple your current damage, they do not ADD Double or Triple damage to your current damage.

    I'll leave the bad stuff out.

    It is amazing though, that within in 5 years i have seen countless references towards 100/150% and Not once have I ever seen it explained this way.
     
  16. Thav12

    Thav12 Seasoned Veteran
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    i just hack away until the monster dies.
     
  17. Vaelix

    Vaelix Guest

    By the way, my statements were like saying


    "If double of something is 100% that means that the single version of that something has to be 50% therefore triple of that something would be 150% not 200% (50% x 3)"
     
  18. Nyses

    Nyses Lore Keeper
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    Ya, I had always seen the 100% and 150% tossed around, but Slayers do, do triple damage and that would have to be 200%

    Didn't mean to get into a Math argument, lol. Suffice to say Slayers do more damage than Super Slayers do, lol
     
  19. Nyses

    Nyses Lore Keeper
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    Ya, and I follow your logic, but you need to start with the base damage and not the percentages.

    If a fireball was doing 30 to Navery and I was not using any Slayer(or spellbook period), and I equip an Arachnid Slayer, I should be doing 60 damage (30+30), with a Spider slayer I should be doing 90 (30+30+30)

    If I started with the Arachnid Slayer in my hands, I would be doing 60 damage. Then if I switch to the Spider slayer I would see 90 damage, which is 150% of 60, but it is 300% of the base 30 damage, thus Triple damage.

    The percents are what confuses things here. From above you see 150% and 300% and go wtf? but remember the 100% and 200% increases are added to the base damage. 100% of 30 = 30. Add 30 + 30 and get 60, or double damage. 200% of 30 is 60. Add 30 and 60 to get 90, or triple damage.
     
  20. Raptor85

    Raptor85 Certifiable
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    Slayers are simple, the post right above mine is correct.

    Forget about percentages for the moment, slayers can be expressed simply

    Super slayers double the end damage (2x whatever)
    regular slayers triple the end damage (3x whatever)

    Now, onward..

    Vaelix: The only way that is true is if you treat the base damage as 50% damage....which is confusing at best. That's true only if you treat super slayer damage as the normal damage (100%), in that case, yes, 150% of "normal" damage is triple damage. But why would you treat the super slayer damage as normal, normal damage should be 100%, in which case super slayer damage is 200% (+100% as some people posted below) and slayer damage is 300% (+200% as posted below)

    I don't like using the +% either, as other damage increase in UO is additive, while slayer damage is multiplied to the end damage. (or base damage, but that really makes no difference in the end)

    I have no idea where the "150%" numbers first came from, but that's more or less never been true, at all. Until SA all slayers were 200% end damage...period.
     
  21. Sevin0oo0

    Sevin0oo0 Guest

    Thanks, least I don't think I was going nuts now. slight correction to my above post - I did Not have on my Stormgrips, That insured item was looted by a meer and did Not re-appear on his corpse, nor the bane that killed him which I promptly killed. Only got back my reg bag.
    doesn't matter what kind of game screw-up it was, I got 2 pair now, all while eating dinner & unwrapping xmas presents w/ the grandkid (he's 3wks old). gotta love automation