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What changes should be made to Siege?

Discussion in 'UHall' started by HD2300, Oct 30, 2010.

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What changes should be made to Siege?

  1. Replace ROT with fast x10 skill gains

    10 vote(s)
    13.5%
  2. Same number of character slots as production shards

    17 vote(s)
    23.0%
  3. Give an advanced character token to all new players

    14 vote(s)
    18.9%
  4. Add glass swords

    4 vote(s)
    5.4%
  5. Reduce cost of faction arties

    12 vote(s)
    16.2%
  6. Change the shard name in the shard list to Classic

    7 vote(s)
    9.5%
  7. None of the above

    34 vote(s)
    45.9%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. HD2300

    HD2300 Certifiable
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    If you have other suggestions please post them.

    btw the Shard of the Dead is a big fat "I told you so" to the anti-Change players on Siege from the devs.

    I'm also guessing that all of the above changes could be added to Siege very quickly and easily, because they already exist on the Shard of the Dead.
     
  2. Gandie

    Gandie Guest

    Others:

    1. Remove landmass! Fel is enough with todays populations.

    2. Remove ROT, do not speed it up with 10x.

    3. Remove any kind of blessed items, not even one per char or account.

    That would be a start.
    Something new and cool?

    Bring back a reviewed order/chaos system.
    Add new content in fel instead of new landmass.
     
  3. Uvtha

    Uvtha Grand Poobah
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    Removing rot would suck. Now that there is no daily cap you can level up quite quickly and easily. I think its a better skill gain system overall. But it DOES need some clear documentation. I don't think that most non siege players realize that rot was recently changed removing the main barrier that made it such a giant pain.

    Remove blessings for anything but non mod having spellbooks etc... keep personal bless.

    Drop faction prices, turn TOT back on, have cursed arties drop in fel dungeons, add more character slots (with soul stones it doesn't matter) remove the vendor x3 charge (so people can get gems for imbuing more easily) improve drop rate for monster stealable potions, add in auto detect but balance it out by having it factor in stealing/snooping...

    Short list.
     
  4. Sprago

    Sprago Certifiable
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    i like most of the above ideas

    ROT need to be removed and add accelerated gains this would bring numbers to siege just like there is in SOTD

    Land mass suggestion I DONT LIKE IT

    Adjust faction arties to that of normal

    remove all bless items but increase drops slightly


    AND A SIDE NOTE TO THE DEVS WE IN SIEGE HAVE BEEN ASKING FOR SOME OF THESE CHANGES THAT YOU INTRODUCED IN SOTD KINDA IRRITATING THAT YOU STARTED A NEW SHARD WITH SOME OF OUR IDEAS WEVE BEEN ASKING FOR
     
  5. Uvtha

    Uvtha Grand Poobah
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    QFT. :gun:
     
  6. Czarina

    Czarina Slightly Crazed
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    Wait Whaaaaaat? Seriously IMO Siege just needs to be heard. We need the involment that other shards get from EMs and developers. Alot of times it seems like our words fall on deaf ears. ROT system is fine. You can finish a skill much faster then a prodo shard. Just like in a prodo shard if you have the gold you can finish a skill faster. With all the alacrities and SoTs floating around you can finish a skill in under 2 days. (melee skills being a bit more difficult along with taming) Actualy any skill with a skill based gain is going to be harder but who cares?

    In all my years on siege the number 1 reason people dont play is the 1 character per account. There has been talk of at least adding 1 more slot but this got swept under the carpet years ago. There was even a poll where majority vote was 1 additional character slot. Vendor pricing x3 was put to make it even more of a commodity to run a vendor. Even tho i never agreed with it due to the hardness and trouble it is to make gold sometimes with no pvm skills i lived with it because its what makes siege siege.

    Now on a different note yes i agree lower faction cost on them items. Most if not all the pvprs on shard (and yes everyone pvps) are in factions so why not lower them? do the developers even realize that we dont technicaly have EMs? Ive gone to other shards they sure do have pretty deco everywhere. We still have the same deco'd towns that we started with.

    I really do like the idea of taking out some of the land masses I mean seriously theres places in malas that i dont think anyone has ever even gone to.

    I think just a little more advertising and more developer involvment and less making another shard with how people want siege to be would be the first step to fixing whats causing our low population.

    Okay im done ranting have a great day!
     
  7. ress me plz

    ress me plz Guest

    Replace ROT with fast x10 skill gains

    Give an advanced character token to all new players
     
  8. Viquire

    Viquire Crazed Zealot
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    I can see this as a sticky widget. I wouldn't want those players from Siege to feel like their playtime was without worth or merit. But by the same token, the curve being so steep makes investing the time and energy to play there and leaving all your stuff from other shards behind for lack of ability to house otherwise just doesn't make any sense.

    So I have underdeveloped characters there, and the reason I never took the time to grow them are stated above.

    So, quicker skill gain? Yes sounds like a good idea. 10x? I dunno I'm not sold yet.

    If we have quicker gains on a persistent shard I dont see any need for tokens to be handed out. You can buy them if you like, thats up to you. Most crucial is the ability to have some form of storage, and I am not talking about a boat, even a large one, where you cant have a forge, or organized storage.

    Maybe if they are insistent on avoiding a housing server change for this specific shard, then, what about a further, say 50 to 100 percent increase in bank storage? If they were to do that, then maybe we could look at something really interesting and unique with regard to what it means to be a guild and have a guildhouse.
     
  9. Sargon

    Sargon Seasoned Veteran
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    Some of the choices don't even make sense.

    Huh? There is very little about the current Siege Perilous that is "classic" UO. Anyone who thinks that putting a classic label on a non-classic shard would accomplish anything is very misinformed.

    With that said, I think Siege Perilous should be modified with characteristics of a true classic shard... removal of item properties, blessed items, etc. I don't think that Siege Perilous can co-exist with a separate classic shard, so it should instead become that classic shard.
     
  10. Skrag

    Skrag Visitor

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    Is this the official "A classic shard will kill Siege, quick let's panic!" thread?
     
  11. Babble

    Babble Guest

    That would be for siege players to decide?

    You could ask, what shard would we like to see and would you play?
     
  12. Førsaken

    Førsaken Guest

    QFT and I play Siege Perilous. :sad4:

    A classic shard would not kill Siege Perilous. Players afraid to lose pixels kill Siege Perilous. DEVS treating Siege Perilous like the red headed step child kills Siege Perilous.

    But not a classic server. *I'd play both, because I liked the pre-pub 16 era*
     
  13. Nurse Miss Maude

    Nurse Miss Maude Seasoned Veteran
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    What Forsaken said. It's not the fear that it would kill Siege, it is the frustration that Siege isn't getting the attention from the Devs or being heard when the players there ask for changes.
     
  14. Nurse Miss Maude

    Nurse Miss Maude Seasoned Veteran
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    Yes and in agreement with Czarina. Give a second char, not the full amount per account, just let there be two geez. Yes I know a few people would drop accounts if they could have two chars. Would the loss of accounts really be that great?
    Allowing housing and a second char would greatly help Siege. As was mentioned, people do not want to drop a house on a production shard to try Siege out. Living out of a bank is difficult with only one char. So people have to have multiple accounts in order to try it out for any length of time. Not many people want to do that.
    As it stands now it's an all or nothing commitment to develop a char on Siege.
     
  15. Petra Fyde

    Petra Fyde Peerless Chatterbox
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    Personally I voted 'none of the above' and I can't help wondering how you equate 'fast 10x skill gains' with 'hard shard for veterans'.
    The fast skill gain on the shard of the dead is so that people can get up to fully skilled in the shortest possible time and not spend the whole 2 months of the trial training their characters.

    And while I too would appreciate more developer's attention on Siege, I also realise the staff already work far longer hours than most of us just trying to keep pace with expected events and content for the game as a whole. Please, just for one tiny, tiny moment consider the possibility that the reasons Developers don't do things isn't always because they don't want to, or can't be bothered to, but because they simply can't.
     
  16. Critical Gaming

    Critical Gaming Lore Master
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    Uvtha is on the right track.

    I've put a lot of thought into a system that would work best for siege, as well as short and long-term effects of my proposed changes. I honestly feel like this plan will make actually playable. In it's current state, you basically hve to be friends with your enemy so they sell your gear back cheap or give it back. Without those relationships (which require mature people, and PvPers aren't mature), Siege literally would NOT be playable.


    1) RoT is fine how it is. It's a good skillgain system and it works for siege.

    2) One character has always been one of the "veteran" characteristics of siege. I'd leave that go

    3) Add cursed artifact drops in DOOM at a high drop rate. They're doom artifacts, and doom doesn't get farmed much anymore. It only makes sense.

    4) Make ToTs drop permanently in tokuno. You can't transfer to or from siege, so there isn't a fear of them being moved from shard to shard. Some of those no-longer-obtainable pieces are bread and butter for pretty much every class, be it tamer, mage, or dexxer.

    5) Make it so you can have a house on siege and on other shards. Treat siege like a separate deal, seriously. You can't transfer to or from, and there is PLENTY of room on siege for more housing. We're at the point where there's a spot open in inner-walls luna (PvP hotspot) and nobody even cares. Years ago that spot would have been worth so much.

    6) Remove ALL blessings except for the stuff that is supposed to be blessed. Yes, some of the GMs don't know what they're doing and had blessed a few items that shouldn't be blessed.

    7)Faction artifacts. Reduce the cost for them to that of production shards. Base the ranking system off of ACTIVE ACCOUNTS rather than all accounts that ever existed. Did you know that because of all the inactive accounts on siege, if you have a faction score of ONE, you're rank 10? That's right, a score of ONE falls in the top 98%! Either do that or make up a new ranking system. Faction artifacts currently are the only crutch holding siege together.

    It's hard to believe that siege is in the state where abusing a broken system is literally the only thing holding the current players.... Seriously.

    ____________________________________________

    Let's look at how this will affect Siege now.

    All expansions are being used. AOS (Doom), Tokuno (ToTs), ML (Minor/Major arties), SA (Imbuing), High Seas.
    - Currently, nobody really does ANYTHING with tokuno or doom, because there literally is no point. Sure am glad I bought those expansions!

    There will be PK hotspots (killing FARMERS) in Tokuno, Doom, etc...
    - Currently, the only PKing we get to do on siege is AFK silver farmers. Isn't that dandy?

    People will be able to construct suits with a bit of farming or trade. Tokuno, Doom, ML, imbuing, all of it. People will also be able to move items and re-establish an economy. With 1 char slot, I don't have taming, so I'd be a guy who would have to buy cursed artifacts.
    -Currently, people literally cannot make a suit worth a damn unless they farm for days and days, or possibly weeks unless they use faction artifacts. The broken faction system allows for everyone to use all artifacts, which is literally the only crutch holding siege up.

    I hope I didn't type this mess out for no reason. I honestly feel like this is a bullet-proof approach to fix siege.

    And devs, there are people making systems up like this on free shards, and they aren't even getting paid. They do it out of love for the game - So don't tell us you can't put a fix in. Earn your money.
     
  17. Czarina

    Czarina Slightly Crazed
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    Critical Gaming i love your ideas. Thier very well thought out and would benefit the shard in a great way.
     
  18. Raptor85

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    Agreed, most of the ideas seem to be make siege super easy so tons of people come, but then is it still siege at that point? Skill gains are fine, I had 0 issue building up to the point where I'm effective on 3 characters, and I used no alac's and only a few sots. (didn't buy any, just figured might as well use the few I had)

    now this I could really get behind, kinda sucks when a few people have blessed spellbooks more powerfull than my entire suit, and get to bless a orny or some other powerfull arty on top of that, NOTHING should be blessed, and in all honesty, pets should un-bond if they die unless a siege bless is used on a petball linked to them.

    That and full removal of faction artys (or at least stop selling new ones), or just make them ultra rare random drops off of faction monsters.

    I'm iffy on same number of slots as prodo, so I didn't vote for that, maybe one extra slot I could get behind, but still I think it's fine one per account.
     
  19. StoneAvenue

    StoneAvenue Guest

    None of the above changes make a lick of sense.
     
  20. Draxous

    Draxous Grand Poobah
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    -reduce faction silver costs to normal

    -guarantee [cursed] artifact drops for every doom boss killed, with the Siege blessable artifacts dropping as is.

    -turn treasures of tokuno on

    -boost the drop of peerless ingredients and guarantee ML artifact drops for killing peerless

    -boost drop rate of ML artifacts from ML named creatures (miasma, swoop, etc.)

    -boost drop rates of SA additions to be in line with peerless boosts.

    -guarantee relic drop rates on champs

    -boost bod rewards so that crafters can utilize crafting with runics without dedicating nauseating amounts of time to it.

    -boost imbuing ingredient drops across the board

    -adjust library turn in rewards to be more reflective of sieges full loot ruleset. It should be much cheaper to obtain things like mace and shield reading glasses.

    -allow runebooks to use gatetravel scrolls, allow gate travel much like recall is allowed on other shards (in wraith, reaper, etc. form and with chivalry.)

    -improve the skill detect hidden, it's currently damn near useless.
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Point blank, Siege players need to be able to reasonably obtain items and feel comfortable using them while playing out and about in the world. Players should be obtaining items all the time, dying and losing those items all the time. The current atmosphere is all about protecting precious pixels rather than having fun with them.

    Lots of us have lost faith that the shard is going to see any kind of solid effort to improve this problem.

    These things have been asked for over and over again by Siege players.

    Petra - we've been waiting pretty damn patiently... years in fact. When do we get to the point where it's flat out ridiculous to wait any longer?
     
  21. Uvtha

    Uvtha Grand Poobah
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    Good ideas.
     
  22. Babble

    Babble Guest

    Actually I bet that Siege players have more accounts than even normal shard players. So no reason to piß them off intentionally, just ignore them is good enough
    :p
     
  23. Czarina

    Czarina Slightly Crazed
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    The average siege player has 2-3 accounts multiplied by the minimum of 25-30 people on at a time = big money for EA then take into account that we spend buku bucks at uogamecodes to get soulstones and other stuff then it starts adding up what siege players are spending in real life money.

    on a side note on siege it costs around 26-28 mill worth of gold / items to get any item from the library turn in system That equates to about 6 years of full time playing for most siege players. So yes i fully agree they need to fix that system. oh for those that dont know, our library turn in rewards are NOT blessed same with anything else on our shard. except for our one siege bless item option.
     
  24. Victim of Siege

    Victim of Siege Crazed Zealot
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    I like Siege pretty much the way it is, although an extra character would be nice. but my 25 soulstones (and counting) make it unnecessary.
     
  25. Chad Sexington

    Chad Sexington Lore Master
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    This.

    What Siege needs is a revamp of the crafting system, specially designed for Siege. Throw out the current crafting system entirely. In the new system, it will use a new Blacksmithy menu (and Tailor, Tinkering, etc.) and every single artifact that's ever been added to the game over the past 10 years will be in that menu.

    No recipes. No special ingredients.

    Each item would take a certain amount of ingots and/or boards to craft.

    Then why would anyone ever do any of the peerless bosses? Put some deco drops. Add in some non-neon colored robes. But nothing with stats.

    And this isn't about a gimmie-gimmie-gimmie, now-now-now, attitude. It's about what was written in the quote above; without insurance people need to be able to play the game without having to protect the pixels as their main priority.

    Discuss.

    :popcorn:
     
  26. Czarina

    Czarina Slightly Crazed
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    where you been hiding chad? you adventures are great!

    Anyways parts of what you suggest there are actualy not a bad idea on siege considering imbuing killed crafting. I for one was a full time crafter on siege but without imbue theres no need for my services. Your idea tho would open up more room for everyone to pvp non stop instead of having to break to go farm more gear. which would make all them pvpr's happy. Plus instead of farming silver since they all went factions to pvp more they could just buy the arties they need at a cheaper rate.

    Unfortunatly this is a idea that has about as much chance as them putting some pretty deco in our luna like the other servers. :sad3:
     
  27. CroakerTnT

    CroakerTnT Guest

    Honestly, as long as there's no insurance and no leakage from prodo shard economies into Siege (no char transfers), I can go with most of those suggestions.

    Do not even consider adding the glass swords.

    I can already imagine the stealth pk template with one of those. Train and wait until you find a character with a super expensive suit, onehitkill, autoloot, hide. Even if you can only use it once, people will just delete the character and do it again next week.

    This item simply goes against the pvp grain. Pvp should reward skill and risk (wearing good stuff), but should not be distorted by such cheap tactics. This would drive all the good pvp'ers into retirement.
     
  28. Llewen

    Llewen Grand Inquisitor
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    That change all by itself would make a huge difference, imo.
     
  29. Siege was supposed to be the "Hard Core" shard. It sounds to me like you want to make it the Easy UO shard. If there are no "Hard Core" players left on Siege, maybe it's time to re-think the whole shard rules rather than add any of these ideas in the poll.
     
  30. HD2300

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    Although I like the concept of hard core, for some reason it seems like it is not what the majority of PvPers want.

    Why are there more PvPers on the production shards than on Siege?
    Why do 50% of the characters on Siege have Stealth?

    The answer is the change that Seige needs to be successful. Hard Core is not working, Seige should be the PvP shard instead.
     
  31. Uvtha

    Uvtha Grand Poobah
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    I want a shard that works and is enjoyable for everyone on it. Siege is the closest in my opinion, but it still needs help.
     
  32. Malek234

    Malek234 Adventurer
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    All these Ideas are well and good. But for me I just say "Hardcore" would be pre publish 16 5 char slots 1 house per account no arties or any of that bs that makes it gear base and not so much skill. Order/Chaos Sheilds no insurance and gm crafted items would make everyone want to pvp again, normal gain rate and then there is no need to worry about having to lose it because u can craft it
     
  33. Sunchicken

    Sunchicken Guest

    The hardest thing about siege is the fact that you cant pass through the mobs of creatures while trying to pvm...

    I dont have the time to farm the amount of silver it takes to get one faction orny in a week. 25,000 silver = a whole damn bunch of evs at blighted grove...

    I wouldnt have a problem with the prices of everything on the shard if they would add passive reveal, remove g-dragons and dread mares and make bonded pets use your siege bless deed.
     
  34. Llewen

    Llewen Grand Inquisitor
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    I don't agree with removing certain pets, but I've been saying that part for years. Really, all a pet is is an item, just like a weapon, or a piece of your suit, and it should be treated as such. A bonded pet should count as the siege blessed item. Or even better, completely get rid of the siege blessed item and pet bonding as well.
     
  35. TheScoundrelRico

    TheScoundrelRico Stratics Legend
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    It should be changed to make me want to come back to it...la
     
  36. Draxous

    Draxous Grand Poobah
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    Oh please. Nobody deserves to listen to an opinion on hardcore from somebody who doesn't play Siege or have first hand experience with it.

    There is nothing hardcore about playing the lottery in doom or on any other spawn. Wasting a lifetime on zoo turn ins or playing the bod game. Since when did Random Number Generations become flipping hardcore?

    Why don't you try completing a doom gauntlet when other players are attacking you? Why don't you try and get peerless keys while PKs are laying in wait? Why don't you try getting back into a fight instantly after being ressurected without your 100% LRC suit or insured weapons because they were looted?

    It's totally hardcore for new or existing players not to be able to get treasures of tokuno because they've been used/lost in combat over the years.

    Get real.
     
  37. Sunchicken

    Sunchicken Guest



    Very Good Point Sir...
     
  38. Give me a break attitude-boy... I've had a Siege character since the very first day it was active. I know about breaking items that don't have uses on the other shards, and time consuming skill builds. Siege just isn't my cup of tea, but that doesn't mean I don't know what it's about.

    What I said was that the poll items attempt to turn Siege into Candy Land. If you want Siege to be hard core, then don't sugar coat it.
     
  39. CroakerTnT

    CroakerTnT Guest

    Did you actually read the post, either the one you replied to or the original poll?

    Nothing in the poll makes the game easier to play. They mostly make the entrance fee to getting going on the shard lower by reducing the time needed to get into the field and actually play.
     
  40. Uvtha

    Uvtha Grand Poobah
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    I'm not for this. I wouldn't mind something like when you take a pet out of the stable you lose your siege bless till its back, it would suck to make pets that rarely get used used even less none of the other pets (that arent a high hp fire breathing caster) are much of an issue in pvp. Sucks to leave any pets that are used in tandem unused.
     
  41. Uvtha

    Uvtha Grand Poobah
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    I for one don't really care about it being "hardcore" but I agree the poll is a joke.
     
  42. Draxous

    Draxous Grand Poobah
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    What is the difference between losing your siege bless while your pets out of the stables and using a siege bless on your pet to bond it...

    You know, you've got one foot in the pool and the other out. Pet bonding is trammie crap.

    Oh well, nothings going to get done anyway. Thank god I've got Darkfall. The developers even play the game with us. Just had GMs spawn as monsters over the weekend and attack our cities in game.

    Anywho, here's a video of what it looks like to see your dev team supporting its players. YouTube - Player created events: Tournament Impressions (EU)

    Maybe one day I'll see that from this game.
     
  43. AEowynSP

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    X2

    In my humble opinion the bigest problem is lack of storage/not being able to place a second house on siege. I speak from experience since I have played on siege and been an active supporter of NEW for over 5 years. Well that and a lack of attention to the shard specific issues.
     
  44. Ishamel_Legends

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    The main problem with siege is that no insurance/ full loot pvp does not work in an item based game where you have to have certain items.
     
  45. CroakerTnT

    CroakerTnT Guest

    No, it just means you have to 'self insure', which means keep backup copies of anything you need, just in case you lose your crap. Or, you run with lower quality goods and accept that you are going to lose in pvp more often than not.

    That said, the super-duper elite suits from prodo shard are uncommon here. It's too expensive to get some items, so nobody uses them.

    The faction arties and imbuing greatly leveled the playing field however. It's much easier to get a pretty-good suit and much cheaper to replace it now, tho imho, faction arties need to be greatly reduced in price.
     
  46. Draxous

    Draxous Grand Poobah
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    No.

    It doesn't work when getting those items is like winning the lottery rather than an adventure with risks involved.
     
  47. Nurse Miss Maude

    Nurse Miss Maude Seasoned Veteran
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    If Candyland will bring players back and new players to the shard I'm all for it. Except for that dumbass sword thing. It is very difficult for a new player to start out on Siege at this stage of the game the way things are on Siege now. "Hardcore" with chars that have been built for 10 years and sitting on every rare that has come down the pipe isn't too appealing for someone new to the shard. Someone may want to try out Siege, but if their group of friends from their home production shard is unwilling to try it, they are all alone on Siege. Won't be any fun for them. It's a catch 22.

    That is the whole issue, lack of change, and it being only a favorable place for an established character. Hardcore should mean someone willing to die. Not a char from the beginning of the shard.

    I don't know what the answers or fixes are, something that has been going on for this long can't really be fixed to please everyone. It's the whole thing, you can please some of the people some of the time etc.
    People leaving over time, and no influx of new players = dead shard
    Dead shard isn't attractive for someone who comes from a very busy shard, who can find someone to play with all the time. It will be new char, all on your own, in a world where what few people you do happen to run across are all established players.
     
  48. aarons6

    aarons6 Certifiable
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    my answer..
    let us place a house that is separate then the one we own..

    i have a built up char on siege, but he doesn't get played much because he has no house and his bank is full of stuff..

    the bank is not large enough. once i ran out of room, i stopped playing.
     
  49. Ahuaeyjnkxs

    Ahuaeyjnkxs stranger diamond

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    [​IMG]

    oh yes ... IBTL
     
  50. That's kind of what I meant... these poll "fixes" for Siege are ridiculous and would change Siege into something new, but not something players would flock to. I don't think there is anything wrong with the Siege rule set, but it's not what the majority of players want or they would already be there.

    If the Siege dedicated players are happy with the lack of attention from Developers and low population then leave it alone - it just will never be a high population shard, which is okay. If the purpose is to create a shard with a large population, it will take a complete re-think on the purpose of Siege, not silly polls and tweaks.