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WoW vs. WAR as it relates to UO

Discussion in 'UHall' started by MoonglowMerchant, Oct 22, 2008.

  1. I don't know how much you are following the WoW versus WAR stuff lately, but I've found it sort of interesting.

    Now, I've never played WoW and I never plan on playing it or WAR, but here is my take as it relates to UO.

    It looks like WoW is a multiplayer game designed to get people to work together to kill monsters or do other quests in game. These are called scenarios.

    It looks like WAR is a multiplayer game designed somewhat to get people who want to do the same thing WoW does, but moreso to get people who want to fight other players. They call it Realm versus Realm. I don't know exactly what that is but I think it is large scale PvP.

    Ok, so what does this have to do with UO?????

    Well, years ago, some of you were here, most probably weren't, PvP was a big part of UO. The game was roughly divided into three parts, PvP, PvM, and crafting. (Note to Jeremy, we don't call it PvE in UO.)

    Anyway, after AOS PvP was pretty messed up. Then, we had Fertbert do a fantastic job of interacting with the player community to fix it. That was when things like casting caps were implemented, some of the very fundamental things that we take for granted now.

    Unfortunately, the next release UOSE, destroyed PvP. It wasn't so much that it unbalanced it (although it did), it was the incredibly slow speed with which any balance pass was done.

    The same thing happened with UOML. Instead of bushido crits, it was ridiculously overpowered bows. Again, it took waaaaaaaay too long to balance things.

    Basically, through neglect, UO lost almost all its PvPer's.

    At the same time, crafting was gradually climbing out of the post AoS gutter. It has actually become a significant part of the game again.

    So what does this have to do with WoW versus WAR?????

    Well, maybe, just maybe, we are seeing some of the DAoC/WAR influence in UO now. Or, you could argue that UO influenced those games and UO is getting back to it's roots.

    Either way, I'm encourage to see some effort put into factions. It is one of the few PvP systems we have and it has needed some love for a long time.

    Now, if we can just get the balance pass things will be good until the release of SA which of course will completely mess things up again.

    Oh well.

    Two things I'd really like to see balanced in the "balance" pass.

    1. Greater dragons and pets in PvP in general.
    2. Hide/Stealth (We need to put passive detect in or out) Currently it is in on production shards and out on Siege. Once we decide whether it is in or out, we can adjust both rulesets accordingly. Currently it is nearly useless on prodo shards and godly on Siege.

    Hopefully, PvP can find its place in UO again. After years and years of neglect, it is about time.

  2. Nexus

    Nexus Site Support
    Administrator Professional Wiki Moderator Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend Campaign Patron

    Oct 1, 2006
    Likes Received:
    Your not gonna find a good balance for PvP as long as insurance allows players to keep items that allows players to quickly jump from one skill set to another.

    The Hard Cap is 720 (defendant on age but this is max) I can have 6 skills at 120, or 7 skills at 100 and one at 20, or 8 skills at 90 and carry a bunch of jewelry, and items that lets me flip flop around to get 120 in various skills, as needed, with some items you can stretch this even further. You can tailor you character on the fly to meet the needs of your environment, and situation. Factor in Mage Weapons, and UBWS items and it's gets even worse, so you got 120 magery.....equip a Mage Weapon -20 bow...and a crystalline ring...you've got 120 magery and count as if you have 120 archery....the variables in place make it impossible. Tank Insurance in Fel, now players can not depend on items, they have to use what they have available, adapt to that and work inside their skill cap.. I don't know about you but I don't have tons of replacement gear lying around of PvP quality, it's expensive, and as far a jewelry it's not really common to get the pieces that match the template I run (yes I'd have to and be willing to adapt too). Focus turns back on crafting as a supplier for PvP and not Events and Artifacts.
  3. TheScoundrelRico

    TheScoundrelRico Stratics Legend
    Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend Secret Society

    Aug 12, 2001
    Likes Received:
    LOL, the ole "let's nerf stealthing" thread again...Enough already. Learn how to fight stealthers...problem solved...la
  4. Are you that dependent on a single skill that you can't see that having a shard literally half full of stealthers is bad for the shard?
  5. Masuri

    Masuri Seasoned Veteran
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Apr 24, 2003
    Likes Received:
    Just to clear up your confusion:

    WoW has PvE servers and PvP servers. Both types of servers have battlegrounds, which are instanced minigames akin to capture the flag, and they pit pseudo-random teams of roughly the same level and faction, against people from the other. On PvP servers, people from opposite factions can kill each other randomly in the world also, although they're only rewarded if the victim is within a handful of levels. WoW also has a system of arenas - pre-set teams that compete against other teams in their bracket. Most of these systems have rewards in the form of gear and consumables. WoW is currently in the process of heavily nerfing its PvP rewards (aka "welfare epics") after close to two years of PvP almost being worthwhile for normal players. It's a shame.

    WAR has PvE servers and PvP servers. PvP servers have the same sort of open-ganking on WoW PvP servers. Instead of battlegrounds, WAR has scenarios (WAR, not WoW) which serve the same function, and are played at lower levels much more frequently than WoW's battlegrounds. There is also open PvP even on PvE servers, in the form of flagging areas for staging raids on enemy keeps. At the moment, PvP rewards are quite awful compared to their PvE counterparts and WAR players have been promised upgrades.

    For the record, I play on a PvP WoW server and a RP-PvE WAR server.

    I do agree that UO is following in the footsteps of other games, to make PvP less a part of the world and more a minigame that runs alongside the world. That has good points and bad, but at this stage in UO's life, it's probably more good. I don't believe that WoW/WAR/DAoC/et al. were influenced by UO very much, definitely not in the PvP sense; they follow other trends in faction PvP found in games from the FPS genre.

    I will say that it certainly seems as though EA's learned lessons from WoW/WAR in the PvP rewards department.