1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. Greetings Guest!!

    In order to combat SPAM on the forums, all users are required to have a minimum of 2 posts before they can submit links in any post or thread.

    Dismiss Notice

Young Player status used in blocking spawn in dungeons?

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Goodmann, May 9, 2014.

  1. Goodmann

    Goodmann Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2008
    Messages:
    2,890
    Likes Received:
    1,124
    Trial accounts can be made and young characters can be setup to block spawn from entering rooms? I see this tactic being used in blackthorns dungeon and want to know if this is legal or just something that was overlooked in the new dungeon?
     
  2. popps

    popps Always Present
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2004
    Messages:
    13,445
    Likes Received:
    461
    I thought that unless one does not renounce to the young Status the game blocks into adventuring in felucca and into dungeons......this was changed ?
     
  3. Merus

    Merus Babbling Loonie
    Governor Stratics Veteran CasteoftheForgotten

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2010
    Messages:
    2,587
    Likes Received:
    2,045
    You realize there is a Blackthorn dungeon in tram right? I don't think young status ever blocked tram dungeons.
     
    #3 Merus, May 9, 2014
    Last edited: May 9, 2014
  4. Merus

    Merus Babbling Loonie
    Governor Stratics Veteran CasteoftheForgotten

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2010
    Messages:
    2,587
    Likes Received:
    2,045
    Are they being used like bag balls to trap a monster while it is being killed or are they being used to block doors to prevent spawn from being lured?
     
  5. Dag Nabbit

    Dag Nabbit Seasoned Veteran

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2013
    Messages:
    464
    Likes Received:
    350
    I thought that the young status didn't give protection in dungeons.
     
  6. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
    Reporter Professional Governor Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend Campaign Supporter Royal Knight

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2000
    Messages:
    18,957
    Likes Received:
    5,449
    I'm going to assume they are being used to block spawn from entering where they don't want it to. Perhaps to be able to lure one mob at a time from the city spawn or something... Perhaps Young players shouldn't be allowed to enter some places. Another way of abusing game mechanics.
     
  7. Goodmann

    Goodmann Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2008
    Messages:
    2,890
    Likes Received:
    1,124
    Yes like bagballs, except they cant be blown up lol
     
  8. CovenantX

    CovenantX Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2009
    Messages:
    2,720
    Likes Received:
    1,391
    I'm sure it was overlooked, young status isn't supposed to stop monsters from attacking in any dungeons tram or fel.

    I'm also pretty sure young players aren't supposed to be able to enter fel until they renounce their young status.
     
  9. Picus at the office

    Picus at the office Certifiable
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2009
    Messages:
    1,681
    Likes Received:
    582
    These area's most likely don't get viewed by the game as dungeons. It's not a mistake but simply a feature as designed.
     
  10. S_S

    S_S Certifiable
    The Squirrel Empire

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2012
    Messages:
    1,966
    Likes Received:
    1,231
    Monsters have never attacked "young" players no matter where they are. Young players can renounce their status and enter fel, but that still does not allow them to enter fel dungeons. Young players can keep their status to enter any tram dungeon with no fear of being attacked. Yep, this probably needs to be fixed.
     
  11. Goodmann

    Goodmann Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2008
    Messages:
    2,890
    Likes Received:
    1,124
    If we can get a dev to comment on this to know its legit that would be nice. Personally I don't think so but you never know. Just fire up 10 trial accounts and have your own wall of young players to farm lol
     
  12. S_S

    S_S Certifiable
    The Squirrel Empire

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2012
    Messages:
    1,966
    Likes Received:
    1,231
    From what I remember, IF a young status player does an aggressive act towards a monster, then it will attack back.
     
  13. Merus

    Merus Babbling Loonie
    Governor Stratics Veteran CasteoftheForgotten

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2010
    Messages:
    2,587
    Likes Received:
    2,045
    I'm not sure there is a fix for this without nerfing the intent of being young, the ability to explore and train low level skill in relative safety. Clearly with the varying difficulty of spawn in blackthorns dungeon the Devs intended for new players to be able to hunt and train there. It is that same intent that allows it to be farmed afk or with very little intervention by advanced players.

    Clearly it is an abuse of what was intended, but unless you are prepared to say that young status should bar them from the tram content I don't see a fix for it... Technically it could be abused with any mob.
     
  14. Lady Michelle

    Lady Michelle Sprite Full SP
    Stratics Veteran The DarkOutlaws, TDO

    Joined:
    May 12, 2008
    Messages:
    2,451
    Likes Received:
    1,113
    I don't see why there isn't a fix with out nerfing the young player. This is trammel not felucca so why is the young player char blocking monsters like its in felucca, because in trammel you or any creature is able to move through each other.Need to find out why, and fix it so the monsters pass threw.
     
    Tjalle likes this.
  15. Merus

    Merus Babbling Loonie
    Governor Stratics Veteran CasteoftheForgotten

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2010
    Messages:
    2,587
    Likes Received:
    2,045
    Mobs and pets can not pass through people in tram or fel. Even a hidden character will block passage.
     
  16. Uriah Heep

    Uriah Heep Crazed Zealot
    Stratics Veteran Alumni

    Joined:
    May 26, 2008
    Messages:
    3,813
    Likes Received:
    2,329
    Yep. go to any idoc and walk around with a packy in tow, you will know where every hider is, no matter the facet. Thats also the reason at events and spawns you see the random dragon just bouncing around in one place...
     
  17. Lady Michelle

    Lady Michelle Sprite Full SP
    Stratics Veteran The DarkOutlaws, TDO

    Joined:
    May 12, 2008
    Messages:
    2,451
    Likes Received:
    1,113
    oh I thought they could, or is it that the character I'm on is only able to move through the mobs and pets in trammel?
    Been sick so I haven't been hunting for a long long time maybe a year or so.
     
  18. Tjalle

    Tjalle Grand Inquisitor
    Professional Stratics Veteran Campaign Supporter Gilfane

    Joined:
    May 12, 2008
    Messages:
    4,846
    Likes Received:
    1,304
    Which shard is this?
     
  19. drcossack

    drcossack Babbling Loonie
    Governor Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    Messages:
    2,706
    Likes Received:
    575
    It doesn't, and they can't.
     
  20. Goodmann

    Goodmann Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2008
    Messages:
    2,890
    Likes Received:
    1,124
    If it's intended thats awesome. I tried it and soloed a whole lighthouse from stage 1-finish. Mobs cant pass through young players so you can farm to your fill with no worry of being killed. Throwers are best for this because of there range
     
  21. a slave girl

    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2008
    Messages:
    507
    Likes Received:
    111
    The [young] that I encountered in Blackthorn's dungeon on Atlantic was actively luring monsters to the entrance.

    As a tamer, my char isn't allowed to equip her weapon of choice before entering, effectively handicapping her and pretty much assuring her death, since I couldn't see anything for several seconds after entering.

    Who's doofus idea was it to not allow a tamer to enter without their pet?

    MOVE the hitching post to the TOP of the stairs please thank you.

    Even with a pet, if every single aggressive mob is clustered at the entrance, I would die before I could see what's happening when I go down those stairs.

    After I was killed going down the stairs at Blackthorns, I self rezzed and moved to behind some closed doors to re-equip, and the [young] then dragged the mobs over to where I was.

    So I knew then that it was intentional and not just some noob running away from monsters because they were scared.

    Of course monsters do not attack [young] players. So he was always safe unless he targeted them on purpose, which was obvious he did because he would lure the monsters where he wanted them, then he would hide.

    The owner of that [young] was the same person who recently held a player run pvp event on Atlantic, and the reason I know this is because the same event host invited me to meet him in Blackthorns when I, on my tamer, pointed out in general chat that he gave the event prizes to his alts (his other character(s) won his event).

    He was angry I told on him after his 'event' and wanted to hurt me and the only way he could was how he had already done it in Blackthorns.

    I did send feedback through UO.com contact us feedback , and I also paged on him. I heard he was back at it a couple days later.

    I believe he is trying to get everyone killed and looted in Blackthorns, he can then use a skilled character to kill the looting monsters and get your Minax arties.

    Of course then it wouldn't make sense to kill people at the entrance before they've gotten any Minax arties, but I am not saying he is intelligent.

    He kind of proved he wasn't very intelligent by hosting a pvp event and then, on the winning character, placing the top event prize, an ethy tiger, on a vendor at his house.

    Now, if [young] are blocking [young] from luring on them, well they are fighting fire with fire aren't they? The GMs and Devs sure aren't doing diddly squat, so you go [young]s.

    This is a big DUR to lurer [young] and another big DUR to the devs for allowing lurer [young] to use his [young] status to exploit and cheat in Trammel ruleset dungeons.
     
  22. drcossack

    drcossack Babbling Loonie
    Governor Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    Messages:
    2,706
    Likes Received:
    575
    Couldn't a GM do something about that? (I know, I know.)

    I would suggest pre-casting Invis before you entered, but magic is blocked in the castle. What you CAN do, however is this:

    Claim your pet(s) & leave them outside of the castle. Once you pass the pentagram before the staircase, log out. Once you log back in, QUICKLY use your "follow me" & "guard me" macros before they get sent to the stables. Since the guy likely hasn't lured a Greater Dragon to the entrance (he may be on a "Young" player, but there's no way a young player can handle a GD. They aren't developed enough to do so), your pets will chomp down on everything. Unfortunately, you MIGHT die in the process, but the spawn will be dealing with your pets & you should be able to self-res safely.
     
  23. Pawain

    Pawain Crazed Zealot
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2003
    Messages:
    3,693
    Likes Received:
    130
    So instead of using young players, they could use accounts with chars hidden. The problem isn't young players its the game mechanics. And is this shard so busy you cant find some other mob to kill???

    In other words who cares. The drop rate in blackthorn is so horrendous that it in itself leads to players finding ways to get a few drops.

    The slave girl post was not up when I started typing.

    Someone getting you killed on purpose is harassment. Tag and bag them.
     
  24. weins201

    weins201 Certifiable
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    May 14, 2008
    Messages:
    1,686
    Likes Received:
    266
    Did you report this as harassment? If not ah well let them eat cake, but defiantly not something that was intended :-( just another pathetic griefer having their day just like Despise, prob will stay abused forever :-(
     
  25. weins201

    weins201 Certifiable
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    May 14, 2008
    Messages:
    1,686
    Likes Received:
    266

    Wow what a worthless response hidden player could be revelaed and eventually killed a young can stand there forever without any problems, as for being forced to go somewhere else because a griefer, come on :gun:
     
  26. drcossack

    drcossack Babbling Loonie
    Governor Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    Messages:
    2,706
    Likes Received:
    575
    Actually, if it's a dungeon, monsters WILL target you if you're young. At least, for the old dungeons like Destard. Castle Blackthorn's dungeon may be different. I would guess this player is luring hell hounds & stuff - the Greater Dragon would kill him effortlessly unless he's mounted (which he likely is)

    If the GD is there, you're screwed. If it's other stuff, you can outrun it.
     
  27. LetheGL

    LetheGL Seasoned Veteran
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2009
    Messages:
    465
    Likes Received:
    120
    He's right, if a young player enters a dungeon you get a popup saying you will be attacked on sight by monsters. A young player can however walk in overland trammel champ spawns on not be attacked.
    The problem isn't with young player status but more with being able to open and run multiple free trial accounts.
     
  28. Pawain

    Pawain Crazed Zealot
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2003
    Messages:
    3,693
    Likes Received:
    130
    I was talking about the OP. The youngs were used as bagballs. So, yes a hidden player could do the same thing on a low population shard where few players are in the area. In the OPs question he asked if it was legal. If they make young players illegal then should they make hiding illegal? But when Officer Weins is around there will be no hiders.
     
  29. Vexxed

    Vexxed Certifiable
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    May 14, 2008
    Messages:
    1,581
    Likes Received:
    351
    Hmm.. last time I made a trial Account and took it to Doom (Tram obviously) I was able to run around all day without being attacked... You do have to watch out for area effects that damage your Trial Acc Character though... bc if you get hit in a wither bc the monster is attack someone else etc. you will auto defend which flags you to the monster. Anyway..... I'd say that that USE of Trial Accounts ins't intended and is no different than using bagballs in a fel spawn area. I would be amazed though if the GM's actually did something useful about it though. I can see them removing the Trial account in question but they wouldn't touch the developed non-trial acct. I bet....
     
  30. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
    Reporter Professional Governor Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend Campaign Supporter Royal Knight

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2000
    Messages:
    18,957
    Likes Received:
    5,449
    Don't even have to do that try taking your pet into a building in Luna with a bunch of vendors on the front. They won't pass the NPC's.
     
  31. TheWeather

    TheWeather Adventurer
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2011
    Messages:
    47
    Likes Received:
    3
    So are they blocking spawn to gain an advantage? Or are they blocking spawn you are luring on them? Big difference. Lots of speculation going on here why don't you tell us the entire story.
     
  32. drcossack

    drcossack Babbling Loonie
    Governor Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    Messages:
    2,706
    Likes Received:
    575
    From the sounds of it, using spawn for griefing & indirect PK'ing. It's the same as gating right into the Ratman Village in the Ice Dungeon, except this takes more work.
     
  33. Vexxed

    Vexxed Certifiable
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    May 14, 2008
    Messages:
    1,581
    Likes Received:
    351
    Umm no.... The OP's point was that trial accounts don't get auto attacked by monsters yet still physically block monsters like any other character & thus can use their own body as a moveable wall...... If this wall was in response to someone lurring in the tram ruleset well then just LoL. I always found Tram side of PvM to be FAR more rude than the fel side bc there is no easy option like killing the other guy. To Lure other mosnters would technically be illegal just as the block with a trial account would be. If your in tram and someone is being a twink... it's pretty much a given that unless you get a magically awesome GM that has a brain your going to have to be a twink yourself to deal with the problem... heh
     
  34. LetheGL

    LetheGL Seasoned Veteran
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2009
    Messages:
    465
    Likes Received:
    120
    doom1.png
     
  35. Vexxed

    Vexxed Certifiable
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    May 14, 2008
    Messages:
    1,581
    Likes Received:
    351
    Hmmmm. Ok I'm wrong. I wonder when that happened..... it has been ages since I remember using trial acts to help farm bone demon etc...
     
  36. PlayerSkillFTW

    PlayerSkillFTW Lore Master
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    May 12, 2008
    Messages:
    1,019
    Likes Received:
    430
    Lol, sounds like something AND? would do. Maybe it is one of them.
     
  37. Tjalle

    Tjalle Grand Inquisitor
    Professional Stratics Veteran Campaign Supporter Gilfane

    Joined:
    May 12, 2008
    Messages:
    4,846
    Likes Received:
    1,304
    Just saw another way players are using Young characters to farm arties down there in complete safety.
    They need to change the Blackthorn dungeon to be like Doom is in the picture above where monsters will attack them on sight if they enter it.
     
  38. Goodmann

    Goodmann Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2008
    Messages:
    2,890
    Likes Received:
    1,124
    Young player status for the win!
     
  39. LetheGL

    LetheGL Seasoned Veteran
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2009
    Messages:
    465
    Likes Received:
    120
    I think that was put in back when they made it so trial accounts couldn't collect bods, farm colored/special resources etc. When ever that was
     
  40. Goodmann

    Goodmann Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2008
    Messages:
    2,890
    Likes Received:
    1,124
    I am sure they will change it until then it's mass martis for us all
     
  41. drcossack

    drcossack Babbling Loonie
    Governor Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    Messages:
    2,706
    Likes Received:
    575
    Exciting! Though I do like the variety of spawn in the main part of the Blackthorn dungeon - it makes for great pet training. The stuff in the northern part of it can go to hell though. Those stupid "Name the job class" enemies suck. I'm unable to invis on them, they hit hard/have AoE attacks, and I think they move as fast as some Paragons. Not to mention the spawn, especially in the Demons room - Bone Daemon (I like the one with higher HP & reduced resists. The Balron past the Evil Mages gets that treatment too), Succubi, Chaos Daemons & regular Daemons, and two boss-level enemies.

    Having all of that crap breathing down your neck isn't fun.
     
  42. TheWeather

    TheWeather Adventurer
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2011
    Messages:
    47
    Likes Received:
    3
    Just so we're all on the same page: Goodman is complaining about a player using a clever legal tactic to prevent him from griefing in the form of him luring monsters onto other players.
     
  43. azmodanb

    azmodanb Grand Poobah
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2004
    Messages:
    5,912
    Likes Received:
    1,186
    i love people that lure ... more for me to kill without moving. lol

    i don't think lureing is a crime. just fun.
     
  44. a slave girl

    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2008
    Messages:
    507
    Likes Received:
    111

    Luring to get other players killed in non fel rulesets is illegal.
     
  45. a slave girl

    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2008
    Messages:
    507
    Likes Received:
    111
    Good grief I had to get this off UOguide.

    http://www.uoguide.com/Harassment

    When googling harassment policies for UO a UO page should come up.

    Anyhow:

    Physical Harassment
    The following information applies primarily (not exclusively) to the lands of Ilshenar, Malas and the Trammel facet of Ultima Online. While you have the ability to attack other players freely on the Felucca facet, players are generally not able to defend themselves against physical harassment in Trammel, Malas and Ilshenar.

    We'd rather not go into the specifics of all the actions we consider physical harassment, but we do want to make it clear that it is not okay to ruin the fun of UO for other players, specifically when that is the intent behind your actions. It is important to realize and accept that everyone plays this game differently, and everyone has different expectations from the game and from the other players. Ultima Online is a social setting, and as such, we expect our players to treat one another with the same respect and dignity they would use in any other social situation.

    If your sole purpose and intent in any action is to continually upset, aggravate, or otherwise annoy another player, you may be a "grief player." Using game mechanics to cause grief to others can also be seen as exploitation, and will be treated accordingly by game staff.

    If someone is using grief tactics against you, please report it to a Game Master using the Help button on your Paperdoll. Once the Help menu appears, choose the Harassment option, and enter the exact name of the other player, and a brief description of his actions. For example: Jody keeps luring these Poison Elementals to us and hiding. Clearly luring!
     
  46. Goodmann

    Goodmann Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2008
    Messages:
    2,890
    Likes Received:
    1,124
    Not sure what you are talking about but I was referring to people using young player status characters to block spawn from killing them. I have been using this tactic until they say its not legal or legal. Trial accounts are free and use 4-5 of them to block area off in blackthorns area to kill the captains for easy martis.
     
  47. Tjalle

    Tjalle Grand Inquisitor
    Professional Stratics Veteran Campaign Supporter Gilfane

    Joined:
    May 12, 2008
    Messages:
    4,846
    Likes Received:
    1,304
    So in other words you are exploiting the Trial account system...
     
  48. Goodmann

    Goodmann Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2008
    Messages:
    2,890
    Likes Received:
    1,124
    Not sure it's exploiting but yeah i'm making good use of the trial accounts until I hear it's illegal/legal
     
    DJAd likes this.