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Bards not properly credited for damage at Champ Spawns

Discussion in 'UO Bard' started by Luke Carjacker, Sep 12, 2009.

  1. I was hunting at the Mephitis (spider) Champ Spawn the other night with two guild-mates, an archer and a dexxer; I am a provo disco mage. We worked the spawn, steadily. As is generally the case, the dexxer dealt out the most damage during the early stages of the spawn, I'm pretty much limited to being a mage (not much point provoking a couple of spiders or discording a giant scorpion). However, in the later stages, I could kill and advance the spawn much more quickly against the more powerful monsters - such is the benefit of being a bard as you all know.

    Then, after Mephitis spawned, I quickly provoked 2 poison elementals and 2 terethran avengers onto her (funny as hell watching the poison eles trying to run from her, and her reeling them back in with her web, but anyhow), then got a discord, and followed up with a steady stream of provokes - maybe 20 top level creatures in all. The dexxer was doing limited damage at this point, while the archer was still laying out good damage - especially after the discord. As an estimate, I'd say my provoked did 60% of the damage, the archer 30% and the dexxer 10%. We brought her down quickly, maybe 10 minutes total and out came the powerscrolls and rain of gold.

    I then suffered the ultimate indignity when I went to check the corpse and received the message: "You did not earn the right to loot this corpse". What!?! I'm supposed to get credit for damage done by my provokes right? But as it stands, it seems that at best bards get credit for 1 provoke at a time, with subsequent provokes wiping the slate clean (not to mention the fact that the discord probably shortened the fight by 50-70%). This is not just a one-time experience either - I have completed dozens of champion spawns with a bard character and have never received a drop. It was just very clear in this instance because there were only three of us, and I was clearly responsible for a majority of the damage. As a flip I've done many spawns with my discord tamer and I've received quite a few top-level drops (sashes, detective boots, ultra-rare decorations, etc.) so I understand what it takes to contribute at a spawn (bard has 1400+ luck, tamer 1700+).

    I asked an EM about this when she had a moment at a recent event, and she confirmed that she knew about this, but that she didn't have direct contact with devs. She suggested that complaining on the boards was the best way to get attention.

    So, as it stands, it's completely pointless bringing my main character (not to mention my favorite) to champ spawn unless I plan on acting solely as a mage. Everyone else benefits from the discord on the champ, as well as the easily handling of the level 3 & 4 spawn, but I never get credit for that damage so what's the use? For all the nerfs and indignities that bards have had to suffer through the years (see my other post), couldn't we at least be credited properly for what we do? We get left out when it comes to fancy new equipment and pets, but couldn't we at least have a chance at a drop?

    Thank you
  2. Capt.E

    Capt.E Guest

    Finally someone else that feels my pain!!! Yeah it really stinks doesn't it? I think the problem is that when in pvm vs pvm you get credit for basically all damage. But since it is a champ and other players are hitting it you would technically get credit for their damage as well, which is why they ended up nerfing bard because like you said it's not always obvious that you aren't damaging it. It stinks and is the reason I went Provo weaver instead of Provo disco :(.
  3. The damage of the provocated creature is valid only if you get a direct damage ( 1 energy bolt, 1 word of death .... 1 magic arrow!!) too.

    Besides I think that the archer get big big percentage of damage , and you need at least 5% (right?) to obtain the loot.
  4. Wait, so you're saying that if I get in one piece of direct damage, I'll get credit for all the damage my provokes do as well? I'm wondering, is this documented anywhere? In any case, I'm going to definitely give it a shot.

    Also, I agree with you that the archer in our group was doing a lot of damage, but not as much as 10 poison elementals and 10 terethran avengers.
  5. Yes, but I Dont Know if this is documented.
  6. Poo

    Poo The Grandest of the PooBah’s
    Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend Campaign Benefactor 4H

    Sep 18, 2003
    Likes Received:
    im rather suprised that you dont do more while sitting back waiting for your barding timer to die off.

    EVs or some lightning strikes or mind blast if you dont have ei.

    or are you the team healer?
  7. Actually, I spend the time gathering up more stuff to provoke on the boss (in those situations).

    The challenge for some of the bosses is that it's really not worth it to try to do direct damage. Take Mephitis for example - every time you deal direct damage to her you run to risk of her shoot out her web and dragging you next to her - and if that happens I find I have about a 50/50 chance of staying alive. If I die, then the discord goes away, and depending on the action, potentially all of the provokes dying (on an average day I can keep 6-8 provokes going at all times). Of course, if the provokes go down, it becomes a bit of a mess with a bunch of poison elementals and terethran avengers attacking everything in site. If I just sit back and maintain my provokes and discord, Mephitis stays happily in one place fighting the provoked mobs, and the whole thing goes down faster. EVs are particularly challenging, because as it continues to do damage, she'll keep dragging you back to her time and again, even after you invis or get away.

    Against other champs I do try to do direct damage (with 120 eval I am able to help), and in a particularly well coordinated situation we can use runners to bring spawn over to be provoked onto the boss. Rikkitor is a good example for this - he has an area attack but doesn't single out people doing damage to him and provoking dragons onto him is worthwhile (as opposed to say ratmen). But when it's just 3 of us, that's tougher, and it's definitely smarter to just try to stay alive and maintain the discord and provokes.

    I've pretty much resigned myself to using a my discord tamer in most situations. This works great against Lord Oaks, Neira & Baracoon. Get the discord and with the good vet skills, healing and positioning my greater dragon can just about handle the situation alone. But again, this goes back to my complaint. I'm forced to use a discord tamer because pure bard skills are not properly credited.
  8. I have some new news to report regarding the new abyssal infernal champion spawn in the new SA Dungeon (haven't had a chance to do the clan spawn yet), and surprisingly what I have to report seems to be good for bards.

    The leveling up of the spawn is pretty standard. For the first two levels bard skills are pretty useless, but by the 3rd and 4th levels of spawn, the provoking bard can probably advance spawn as fast or faster than any other profession (this is the same for most champs). The bad news has always been that once you reach the champ, bards aren't properly credited for provoke damage.

    I can happily say, that wasn't the case last night! We had a party of 4, with an archer, dexxer, tamer, and me disco/provo/mage. First off, let me say that the champ is tailor made for bards. It seemed every 15-60 seconds he would call up secondary spawn in the form of nightmares, hellhounds, fire elementals, imps, fire steeds, phoenixes, and other demon type spawn. Let me just say that without a bard on hand, a small hunting party could easily get overrun by this secondary spawn.

    But in this case, instead of running around trying to find additional things to provoke onto the Boss, they were custom delivered right to me and I was able to stack on provoke after provoke. To tell you the truth, our tactics were not very refined (first time for all of us), but after a 30 minute battle we were able to take him down.

    So at this stage I'd normally be complaining that as a bard I did 40-50% of the total damage and didn't even get looting rights, but shock of all shockers, that isn't the case! I actually got a drop (first time ever as a bard after dozens of attempts as a top damager)!! I got an awesome replica shield named Tongue of the Beast with spell channeling, stamina regen 3, mana regen 3, physical resist 10%, energy resist 5%. An awesome item, and at this stage of the new expansion, extremely rare of course. I'm ecstatic.

    So maybe they finally heard our complaints and maybe I won't have to leave my bard at home any more for future champs. Maybe things are different with SA. As I've mentioned before, I'll always think of myself as a bard, and it really fits my play style, so it's always disheartening to have to leave him at home to bring the archer, necro mage or disco tamer.

    Maybe there is hope for pure bards after all. I'll report more as I have more information.