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Can a PvM char defeat a PvP Template char?

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Prince Caspian, Nov 11, 2008.


Could a character designed for PvM defeat a PvP Template character in a clean 1-on-1?

  1. Yes, the template isn't that important.

    5 vote(s)
  2. Not consistently -- not against a character designed to PvP

    62 vote(s)
  3. It really could go either way.

    19 vote(s)
  1. Well?

    Of course every situation is different. But to qualify a bit: the PvPer is a PvP template designed and played by an experienced PvPer. The PvM template is played by a mostly Trammel-playing character, whose forte is not PvP.

    In a straight up 1-on-1, what chances are we looking at here?
  2. Mystikal GIL

    Mystikal GIL Guest

    half question.
    depends which pvm char and which pvp char and most of all, who's playing the char.
  3. ForTheOcean

    ForTheOcean Guest

    Absolutely, it just depends on the templates for sure, and whether or not the person playing the pvm template is resourceful.

    Personally, I've killed a pvp mage on a sampire, that was using bush necro and chiv to keep me alive and I never missed which was lucky. So luck has something to do with it as well.
  4. My PvP is my PvM also, just need to change the suit... so it really depends on items if you ask me... but then again i die alot :p hehe
  5. Salty Pete

    Salty Pete Guest

    Lucky kill once in a while? Absolutely. Consistently win? No ****ing way.
  6. I remember back in the day (after the DLDs, houses were bannable.... but before UO:R) when I finally got fed up with being preyed on PK and struck back with my miner. I actually had the guy on the ropes and he ran back into his house and banned me. But that was the point I decided to become an AntiPK and stamp out PKs. It was kind of a revelation for me that PKs werent all the bad indestructable boogeymen after all.

    Admittedly, it wasnt too long when I started tangling with with other PKs that I realized my shining moment largely had to do with one thing: the PK that attacked me was terrible at PvP. :(
  7. ColterDC

    ColterDC Visitor

    May 13, 2008
    Likes Received:
    In that situation in the PvP will win every time.

    A better question would be; Will a PvPer playing a PvM template still beat a PvMer playing a PvP template?

    The answer would still be yes.

    All that matters is the person behind the keyboard.
  8. I see Lynk still hasn't gotten over his crush on me. :blushing:
  9. Wenchkin

    Wenchkin Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran Alumni

    May 16, 2008
    Likes Received:
    I think so long as the PvMer is resourceful and calm, they can at least put up a darn good fight. If you haven't thought "what if I get attacked" and you dive into Fel and meet a red, I wouldn't bet on you at all. But if you normally play with decent macros and know how to get the best from your template, it's just a matter of being adaptable vs the player attacking you and staying calm. At least that's my experience as a PvMer who occasionally gets into PvP. If I die, 99% of the time it's because I lost my cool and fluffed a macro. I've fought back with all sorts of templates and kits, but that's always the main reason if I lose.

  10. Sarphus

    Sarphus Guest

    This scenario is so situational that I can't really vote on it. I kill lots of ppl with pvm chars, though. I don't have any chars designed for pvp, but that doesn't stop people from attacking me.

    I kill them when I can (roughly half the time)

    My pvm bard/mage has killed more than her fair share of pvpers. When greater dragons were first introduced I killed a few people with provoke (only because they attacked my innocent, unmounted tamer)

    Despite my successes, I die just as many times as I kill.

    My pvm discord tamer tears pvp tamers apart. I win 90%+ of the time in those encounters. The other day I had 2 bokuto/cu tamers try to gank me. I killed both of them and one of their cu's. I just kept teleporting away from their pet while my frenzies tore them and their pets to shreads.

    You're often at a disadvantage when you're playing a pvm char and fighting a pvp char. I'm just pointing out some of the exceptions (provoking multiple greater dragons on someone or using discord to wipe out another tamer)
  11. Sam the Scribe

    Sam the Scribe Visitor

    Mar 10, 2007
    Likes Received:
    What is the point of the question?

    "Could Scott Dixon beat Jimie Johnson in a Nascar event?"

    "Are apples the same as oranges?"

    "Could Jimie Johnson beat Scott Dixon at the Indy 500?"

    "Are oranges the same as apples?"

    Sounds like you kinda tilted the table a bit since the qualifying rounds end up being a PvP event.

    How 'bout a horse race instead? I'll meet ya at the New Haven stables. Bring about 600gp.

    Safe Travels, Sam
  12. Turdnugget

    Turdnugget Guest

    A lot of PvMers have PvP templates... because more often than not you're going to get raided and need to learn how to defend yourself.

    But then again it also depends on what kind of PvM you're talking about? Most champ spawns you'll find chrs with some sort of PvP template. Now if it's just for Doom, Peerless or something to that nature it's a little different.

    I PvM with my tamer or my bushido/archer/macer. Both of which I have no problems fighting a PvP template. My bushi/archer is who I typically PvP with anyhow.

    At one point in time my tamer had bushido + archery. It was a major damage machine, but a little harder to stand next to my pet vetting it as i'd targeted a lot more.

    As most will say, it depends a lot on the person behind the player. Unfortunately, a mediocre player can still be a good player with the right equipment. Not hard to have next to nothing ping, and stay on someone DP'ing them and AI'ing them.
  13. peanutbutter

    peanutbutter Guest

    yeah, i mean... a thief PvPr vs a thief PvMr...? i'm not sure who would win...
  14. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
    Stratics Veteran

    May 12, 2008
    Likes Received:
    In the situation you describe, the template wouldn't matter as much as the experience.

    -Galen's player
  15. Rix/\

    Rix/\ Guest

    it's all about the player not the template
  16. i agree its not the temp both a pvp and pvm mage will have same basic skills only a few minor differances in equipment its macros and the ablity to use them i have maybe 4 pvm macos i use for my mage most pvp have man y many i love watching them type

    fireball fireball
    corspe skin
    flame strike

    oh hello to you too !!!!
  17. Chaosy

    Chaosy Guest

    Two words for you: "all kill." That is all.
  18. aarons6

    aarons6 Certifiable
    Stratics Veteran

    Oct 14, 2007
    Likes Received:
    there is no way. a pvp char will stay alive until your pvm char either misses a heal, or runs out of aids, mana, pots, bolts, etc... then will kill you.

    you cannot kill a pvp char with a pvm char temp.
    unless you get super lucky and they lag out.

    or unless your pvm char temp is close to a pvp one.. then its up to player skill.
  19. In Flames

    In Flames Journeyman
    Stratics Veteran

    Jun 24, 2008
    Likes Received:
    I can't answer with the above poll options.

    It depends on the player.

    I've killed PLENTY of people on my PvM characters. It all depends on

    How well each person can play

    How well each person knows their own character

    How well each person knows the OTHER person's character

    How well each person is equipped

    and Last but not least

    Each players connection.
  20. Aye to summarize...

    No ping, bling, or brain means no win.. (also hacks seem to have an effect but i will not walk on that bridge today hehe)

    There have been fights i've lost to a pure mage... this is because they are really fast with their reactions and timeings, and doesn't lag one bit, during the game, then others were i can kill the "all kill" or 3 paly archer gankers because of their lack of knowledge...

    I must say a very well said post (talking about the quoted one... not mine hehe) *claps*
  21. Dragkiris

    Dragkiris Seasoned Veteran
    Stratics Veteran

    Jun 14, 2008
    Likes Received:
    A pvp char will win most of the time just from general setup of the template. If the pvm player is good at pvp he will most likely be able to stay alive against but not be able to kill a char built for pvp. But there is a lot of luck with the random number generator but between equal skill players the pvp template will win probably 80% of the time.
  22. You also need to take into account character age.... this may sound strange, but the age of a character will change things alot... some people just run away from reds thinking AHH!!! OMG!! ITS A MONSTER!!! AHH!!! others go "I am the brave... OOoOo" and others go in wisely... People who've been playing since year one would know reds (saying reds since most are PvP temp.. so if i say it just replace it with PvP template characters :D sorry for the inconvience...) have many weaknesses based of the class... and if you know about each class it makes it easy to tell what to do to counter it... although that also requires some fast reflexes.. :O hehe

    The point with the older characters, some people stil have 12X GM character or better from back when there was no cap... so they may be PvP but tehy are also PvM (reverse taht :O)

    Wow this has now become the heated debate OOooOooOo
  23. Demonous

    Demonous Rares Fest Host | Ches Jul 2010
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Feb 13, 2006
    Likes Received:
    theres no option for just no :/
  24. aye the options are limited it would see aren't they hehe

    but then again if they added "NO lolz we pwnz tehm nubs" it would be unblanaced since there are already so many votes :(
  25. Viquire

    Viquire Crazed Zealot
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Jun 5, 2008
    Likes Received:
    Its not nearly as much about the character as it is about the player and the players mindset.

    You can loose with really sub gear if you have the instinct, but over the long haul pvp in this game isn't really so much about killing the other guy as it is about staying alive long enough for them to screw the pooch somehow.

    Can I say that? LoL
  26. I think its highly possible. In todays UO, most templates in a class have very close relations. Most of the difference is in items though.

    For mages, it would be very easy. Most mages use the same gear and similar builds. For PvM, sdi is the major factor so the template will most definatly be built for mana and SDI and all the other mage mods/items.

    Warriors would be the most difficult case because in PvP v PvM since the items used in both tend to be dramatically different.

    Archers are straightforward and usually the same in both scenarios.

    So yes, I believe its very possible. The only factor that I could see that would make the biggest difference is the experience in either field. If a PvPer only PvPs, they will most definatly have an advantage over a PvMer who only PvMs.
  27. WildWobble

    WildWobble Sage
    Stratics Veteran

    May 21, 2008
    Likes Received:
    All Kill enough said
  28. Hunters' Moon

    Hunters' Moon Grand Inquisitor
    Stratics Veteran

    Oct 19, 2004
    Likes Received:
    From reading most of the posts here from ya'll brings up a question. What exactly is a "pvp" template? A mish-mash of skills with lots of lmc pieces and sdi and hci items?
  29. Petrify

    Petrify Lore Master
    Stratics Veteran

    Oct 17, 2008
    Likes Received:
    My PvM chars are my PvP chars...
  30. T'Challa

    T'Challa Certifiable
    Stratics Veteran

    May 12, 2008
    Likes Received:
    There has never *not* been a skillcap. Noone ran around with 12X GM chars, unless they abused a major bug.
  31. Year one there was not skill cap :O

    (Imanewbie LS, and PKghost(although he is not sertain because he known counclers and that fact can't really be check.. were all full GMs back in the day as far as i remeber, although i have been wrong. :O