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DEVs make UO consensual PvP only

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Lord Frodo, Apr 27, 2018.

  1. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Stratics Legend
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    Make all of UO consensual PvP with the exception of the 2 special shards. This will allow all players to have access to all of UOs lands without fear of getting PKed and those that wish to partake can do so by selecting a I agree to PvP switch. Now everybody that wishes to can PvP to their hearts content anywhere in UO and those that do not want to can go where they please without worry.
     
    railshot likes this.
  2. North_LS

    North_LS Journeyman

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    why is it a fear? worst possible case, your'e out some time and insurance money, but even that isnt super likely. if you dont want to pvp at all, you already have the vast majority of the game to avoid it in. im not really interested in pvp these days either, but i still do spawns in fel. know where and when youre less likely to be interrupted, and if somebody does drop in, just know your exits and get out of dodge. i also mine and lumberjack exclusively in fel, and havent encountered a single other person while doing that.

    the days of not being able to go more than a dozen steps without being PKed are long gone. 95% of the time, you can do whatever you like in the pvp facet and never encounter another soul.
     
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  3. Tabin

    Tabin Seasoned Veteran

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    Sure would be nice to do a champ spawn on ATL during peak hours without getting raided lol. The price I pay for the ability to buy and sell stuff on vendors...
     
  4. Picus at the office

    Picus at the office Certifiable
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    You do select a "I agree to PvP" switch, every time you go through a red gate. Stop being a chumpy troll, not everyone likes the carebear lifestyle nor should everyone be stuck playing your version of UO. Grow a pair and step up to the plate.
     
  5. Archnight

    Archnight Legendary Crusader
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    No.png
     
  6. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Stratics Legend
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    So why not just go consensual PvP everywhere and give all UO content to every player Blue and Red alike. Blues get PSs and Reds get all the Tram goodies that they want and no more he got she got BS .
     
  7. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Stratics Legend
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    You are missing the point is that would no longer exist and all facets would be Tram or Fell rule set to you by selecting it in you character settings.
     
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  8. Great DC

    Great DC Lore Keeper
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    Literally the stupidest idea I ever heard. What would stop people from just bringing in armies of stam-blocking characters and increasing their botting by 1000 fold. For someone who advocates banning cheaters, this would give them unlimited access to cheat forever. Use your brain more before making such a ridiculous post.
     
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  9. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Stratics Legend
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    Really, what stops them now from doing the same thing right now. I guess if you have zero valid complaint then throwing hate is the next best thing to you. Why are you so afraid of letting UO go consensual PvP, something that should have happened pre tram. This gives everything you wanted all UO content to fight over.
     
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  10. Great DC

    Great DC Lore Keeper
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    You can kill them right now!!!!!. If it was non consensual they would be free to basically script it. Apparantly you like scripters and want to them to take over the game
     
  11. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Stratics Legend
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    WOW You caught me, you are %1000 right I want to let scripters run everytrhing, In case you haven't heard UO is banning scripters or din't you get that memo. What are you really afraid of? You are getting all of UO to fight over for those that want to play it with Fel rule set turned on, isn't that what you want more content.
     
  12. OREOGL

    OREOGL Crazed Zealot
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    Seems like a ploy to freely farm powerscrolls.

    Otherwise this was already accomplished by separating facets.

    Why not just ask what you're really wanting from this?
     
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  13. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Stratics Legend
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    I am asking that all content in UO be freely available to all UO players and giving all the UO content to Fel rule set players to fight over. Isn't that what we keep hearing is give us more content to fight over, well I am giving you all the facets and you are giving us the Fel facet. Alls you do is get all the other PvPers together and see what you want to fight over this time and maybe next time it will be something different. Isn't what you want something to fight over or is it in fact only special items that you want.
     
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  14. OREOGL

    OREOGL Crazed Zealot
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    All content IS freely available.

    Fel players aren't asking for same content, that would be trammel players for power scrolls.

    Fel players generally ask for different content to incite pvp.
     
  15. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Stratics Legend
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    PvP is not about the item it is about testing your skills against another like minded person, PKers went after the item. PvP has become about controlling content how amazing. PKing under the guise of PvP, lets call it what it really is or are you to ashamed to.
     
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  16. King Greg

    King Greg Lore Keeper
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    :hahaha:

    Let me get this straight.... a PKER is someone who fights other players with the intent of getting a reward for PVPing.... a Pvper is someone who fights for no reward other than to win...

    So to YOU Gate fighting is PvP, but defending/raiding a spawn/harrower isn't. And somehow wanting to have a reward for pvping, makes you a Pker, which you consider to be bottom feeding garbage.

    :facepalm:
     
  17. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Stratics Legend
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    A PKer is someone that kills another player, PvMer, resource gather, etc because he knows they do not strand a chance because they are to afraid to fight someone that is set up to PvP. Go back to your killing the weak because we all know there are no more real PvPers left in UO.
     
  18. Great DC

    Great DC Lore Keeper
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    Next this guy is going to say that monsters in the game pked him at lady melisande and took his bandaids. We'll need to ban lady melisande from the content of UO.
     
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  19. CovenantX

    CovenantX Crazed Zealot
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    Considering Trammies don't enter fel because the "Carrot on a stick" (Powerscrolls) doesn't work... I'd say the people doing the spawns are other PvPers (damn, I hate when my own whining is used against me in an argument... don't you?) It would also explain why when you kill one of them, typically several more show up... but I guess you wouldn't know anything about that?


    Someone must have really taken a huge poop in your oatmeal during the early days of UO for you have to such animosity against anyone engaging in the Fel arts that is pvp.

    So what kind of PvM do you partake in Frodo, still farming skeletons & Zombies in Haven these days, or did you move up to the fierce earth elemental in the mines?
     
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  20. King Greg

    King Greg Lore Keeper
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    Alright, just trying to get this straight here.

    "we all know there are no more real PvPers left in UO"

    By your definition gate fighters are real pvpers. Players there just killing other players who are suited and geared, for the sake of killing. So either that is your definition of Pvp, or there are no more real pvpers left in UO. It can't be both.

    So, there must be this magical line in the sand at which killing a player changes from being pvp to being pk.

    "PKer is someone that kills another player, PvMer, resource gather, etc because he knows they do not strand a chance"

    A chance at what? Survive? Kill? Do you have to kill to consider it pvping? If two pvpers fight each other for 30 minutes and no one dies is it not pvping? If a player came out with 120 parrying, 120 wrestling, 120 resist, alchemy, 4/6 chivalry, ninjitsu, and just stood there doing everything they could to stay alive without ever fighting back you would consider that a pvper because they stand a chance at not dying? A character that just disarms another dexxer over and over again would be considered a pvper because they stand a chance? However, If a dexxer forgets a trapped box/teleport scrolls, gets crossfielded, and slaughtered now it's Pking and not Pvp because he didn't stand a chance? 2 Players with the same exact gear and template come to fel, one has supplies the other doesn't. The one with supplies kills the one without supplies, it's considered pking instead of pvping because the other player didn't stand a chance without supplies?

    So, the difference between getting Pk'ed and Pvping is based on the competency of the player who died.

    Logically the only solution to end Pking is that everyone who enters fel should be ready to pvp. Then no one would be Pked.
     
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  21. celticus

    celticus Babbling Loonie

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    LOL..Nice effort!
    You are playing with semantics and wordplay! You know very well what Frodo and others said, you as well as I know : Waiting in the shadow stealthing with Ninja Archer poisoner at the champ spawn..Victims back then had no chance to survive this. Today there are other specialized PK temps. There is no honor in this. No fellowship. Some of us tried that back in the day for the adrenaline. But at the end of the day we felt dishonest, dirty and guilty of stealing other people's efforts. Ask around..people will tell you what they did when they PK'd. Nothing to brag about. This was years ago. Since then lots quit and came back years later. Now we are older more mature and the vast majority want to just have some fun, be social and not engage in things that would hurt some1 else's play or feelings. Now we have a sense of game play HONOR and a game conscience, though i agree its just a video game and pixels. This game is a true sandbox, supposedly catering to ALL play styles. The ones you call Trammies, they choose a more peaceful relaxing game. They are people also deserving to play THEIR style of game, after all they PAY for this game, it seems they are the majority, and their subscriptions are what is keeping this game alive for the most part. And that seems to be the reality of it. I think we should have some respect for the "Trammies" as you call them. I really think the game should cater to all players, and especially those whose RL money are keeping this game alive. I amd sure you would agree.
    Also: Reality is there whether we like it or not:
    The Devs @Mesana, @Kyronix created a major game imbalance with the Pet upgrade, and have NOT made the LEAST effort to balance it out at all: They created a massive need for PS for tamers, the PS prices have skyrocketed since people now may need 240 - 300 PS for multiple pets per tamer sometimes, and on top of that we now have every one wanting to make a tamer. Do you think that there are less than 1,000 tamers in the game? Can you count how many PS they may need? Prices are slowly going down after 1 year of the revamp, but not enough yet. This makes toon PS also hard to get..SO : RMT stores here we go to get gold and PS etc..I think that the Pet revamp PS deal was a major mistake. Some day it may be fixed, who knows. I personally mostly like to beat up on things with my Sampire, until he gets nerfed. I also have one tamer who has very few pets that I refuse to scroll and dont play much with tamer, gave that up after all the screw-ups, reverts, adjustments etc.
    Leaving the PS system as it is is great for challenge, adrenaline etc, but it ALSO does not seem to be helping the gold bloat and gold imbalance we have I reckon.
     
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  22. Max Blackoak

    Max Blackoak Babbling Loonie
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    oh boy...I pity the felucca population of prodo shards for having to put up with the constant crying threads like this. You people make it sound like going to felucca means you will see monochrome 100% of the time as soon as you leave guardzone.
     
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  23. King Greg

    King Greg Lore Keeper
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    I'm not even sure what you are doing here in this post since you seem to be both anti PvP, and for leaving power scrolls as they are..... I've typed a dozen responses, but I'm curious on a few things.

    1.Do you think Pvp Isn't a Playstyle? That pvpers don't support the game?

    2.What % of Pvp Vs Non Pvp Players do you think play this game.

    3.Do you think that certain playstyles should have exclusive content that you can only get through playing that playstyle, or from buying from other players. (Fishing, Treasure maps, Thief, Crafter, Etc)

    4.What % of content do you think has been added that is Pvp Exclusive vs content that isn't even available in Fel over the last 15 years.

    5. List the content that is Fel Exclusive Vs the Content that you can't do in Fel at all.

    6. Do you think #4 and #5 have anything to do with #2

    7.Do you support taking one of the few fel exclusive content away from pvpers?

    I'm curious what your view of reality is on those matters.
     
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  24. OREOGL

    OREOGL Crazed Zealot
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    I PVPed for years, mostly under factions then VVV. Most times before I left spawns were only used to start fights mostly in fire down to despise.

    I lost interest before the pet revamp and left shortly after its release because of the nerfs and pet fighting.

    Trammel players will always try and detract from PVP because they want to have power scrolls with only PVM involvement.

    Fel players don't control content they simply use it.

    I never really PKed a lot because it wasn't part of my play style. Some players did which is generally annoying because it involved "griefing" also.

    Try not to lump sum everyone into a general group because you're unable to make an argument to farm power scrolls without any player involvement.
     
  25. Mithryl Elves

    Mithryl Elves Elves Suck
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    Correct... The only real fear in dying now is ego's being hurt. Get a name change token lol.
     
  26. Great DC

    Great DC Lore Keeper
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    Its funny what the trammies say about felucca as if the boogeyman still lives in the closet or under the bed. Do these people still sleep with night lights on too?!!??!
     
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  27. Yadd of Legends

    Yadd of Legends Babbling Loonie
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    Cutting through all the BS on both sides here, amusing as it it, I hear the "trammies" saying what they want is to farm PS without being attacked by other players. It's not my thread, and I'm not the OP, but I think that would be a more helpful point to debate. On the other hand, I also hear the PvP argument that without Pvpers, spawns would be so crowded by multiclients and bots that nobody would enjoy them - the Pvpers are nature's balance in the ecoystem. So it's a tough point to debate, in my opinion.
     
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  28. Uvtha

    Uvtha Stratics Legend
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    Well... it would be fun to pk him, so maybe it's personal experience. :D
     
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  29. The Craftsman

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    I wont even bother explaining to you how bad an idea this is as you've already been told and served up a can of whoop-ass by many other posters.
     
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  30. Morgana Grim

    Morgana Grim Lore Master
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    How would this work for thieves? Ask permission before you attempt a robbery? Or it wouldn't be considered a hostile act?
    What's to fear from dying?
    What is this all about really? Wanting to go to idocs and grab loot and no one able to kill you? Want to farm and have no one able to kill you or a pet?
    Insurance, sending bags
    Idk, how about anyone afraid of dying in a game just stay in trammel, isn't that the point of trammel vs fel?
     
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  31. celticus

    celticus Babbling Loonie

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    PVP is a play style. PK is also some playstyle? So is bank sitting, and Tramel/Ilsh play etc.
    It will be really interesting to know % of PVP vs non PVP accounts/players. Is from what we see at the forums both in UO and here suggestive that the majority of accounts PVP or even better PK? How do we otherwise get this information?
    Also : Do you agree that the Taming Revamp and tamers in general wanting to scroll every pet has changed the PS system drastically to a completely unbalanced decrepid system without any amends from the Devs?
    Do not advocate to take any PVP specific content away from Fel, but do something to balance the needs of pet advancements, like so many others have already mentioned. There are many ways :
    --Make PS do what they have done for years, use them only for players toons. Take away white PS from pets.
    There were not white PS pet scrolls before, so this will restore things to what they were before the taming revamp, and that PVP content will be same as for last 20 years.
    --Make pet-specific PS : Color them green or other. Have them drop at Tram or Ilsh spawns or Fel Spawns even in higher stat or number. The PVPers still get their white PS, and get to benefit from Pet PS, and the "Trammies" get at least some of their pet scrolls from places they feel more comfortable playing in.
    Just ideas..and wasted words and time to discuss these points, esp. since you and I know that the words are falling on deaf ears, and the Devs will leave things as they are, and do nothing of what is being discussed anyways.
    --Consensual PVP is not an option as it seems, and also NUKING all the gold is another bad otion people have offered as solution to the bloat. That would be like major brain surgery to cure a hangnail.
    --Any other suggestions to remedy the bloat and exclusivity of items and PS?
     
  32. Pinco

    Pinco UOEC Modder
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    IMHO a consensual PVP would INCREASE the PVP if done well:
    • consensual PVP would mean that if you have PVP flag active, you can PVP EVERYWHERE (any map and any time). It could even be improved by adding guilds tied to a city govern that would bring to city wars :O
    • consensual PVP would also mean that the flag will activate itself when you do certain activities, like champion spawns (any champion spawn in any map = revive tokuno without the treasure event) or trying to attack another player.
    • consensual PVP also requires a cooldown of 5+ minutes for the flag to get turned off when you choose to (so you can't just turn it on and off when things goes bad).
    Even more interesting would be to modify the champion spawns to become an end-game activity by changing the rewards based on if you are doing them PVP or not and how many player you have against.
    For example:
    - you do the champion spawn as PVM (no PVP at all), you get scrolls 105-110, no replicas.
    - you do the champion spawn as PVP (low pop hour, no challenge), you get normal loot
    - you do the champion spawn as PVP (high pop hour, several player against), you get 50% more scrolls and loot.
    - you do the champion spawn as PVP (completely outnumber), you get double loot and scrolls

    Same could be done with any dungeon activity like doom.

    The core problem of UO is the lack of need to play with others, 90% of the stuff can be done solo or by multiboxing, is more like a mass SINGLE player game right now :D
    I think other than PVP, the NPCs should have more abilities that requires the player to use the brain instead of just point and click until you it's dead, even more, it requires mechanics that needs more than 1 player to be overcome (even just simple stuff like an AOE damage that splits on all the party members). Also to makes things even more interesting, the hp of the monsters should be scaled on the number of the attackers and their total skillcap, so if you want to go with your friends to fight an ettin it will never be 1-shotted, and if you do it while you have 50 total skills or 720 it will still be fun to do and not just an activity that can be done by a bot :)

    OBV it's never going to happen, but that's just my 2 cents :p
     
  33. Tyrath

    Tyrath Grand Poobah
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    Once upon a time there was a evil general that really needed to be removed from an equation. Every night when the general would go to bed he would get in his bed and then lean over and look under the bed. One night the general did this, like every other night and found 8 inches of cold steel driven through his left eye socket. Yes the Bogeyman still lives under the bed when the need arises. Now closets yep you are right, no self respecting bogeyman would hide in a closet, that is the first place anyone seriously expects the bogeyman to hide. Under the bed is just a after thought.
     
    #33 Tyrath, Apr 28, 2018
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2018
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  34. Spartan

    Spartan Lore Keeper

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    I'm a trammie ... but I didn't say that. show me some who do, please. As far as I care ... you can hav Fel. I'll play my game and you do yours. Just don't try to tell me that I should play your way "just because ... ".

    BTW, I started back when T2A came out. I know what Fel is like.
     
  35. railshot

    railshot Lore Master
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    That kind of contradicts all the other arguments PvPers make. Why is Shadowguard is not controlled by bots? If PK's are o few and far between that there is no monopoly and spawns are easily accessible to all, why are there no bots there now? You can't really have it both ways.

    As an aside, the violent response to the OP is quite telling. PvPers keep insisting that it's not about griefing, that it's about content and fighting worthy opponents. OP makes a suggestion that would give PvPers all the content in the game, but without forcing unwilling victims to participate. And we have this unanimous rejection from the PvP camp. Pretty hypocritical, don't you think. Just as I and many others have been saying all along. This is not about PvP. This is about griefing and gold. This is about a minority profiting and getting their kicks of or ruining the game play of the majority. The responses to the OP prove this quite convincingly.
     
  36. OREOGL

    OREOGL Crazed Zealot
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    The original post is a ruse.

    PVPers already have use of available content and I'd expect most of them use it.

    The suggestion doesn't provide anything for PVP.

    Let's not confuse it for anything else but a ploy for non pvp players to farm power scrolls.
     
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  37. Tyrath

    Tyrath Grand Poobah
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    Quite the opposite it would give PvPrs the opportunity to PvP in every area and facet of the game, just not PK.
     
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  38. OREOGL

    OREOGL Crazed Zealot
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    The is a false conclusion as it didn't offer anything other than a toggle switch that allowed players to go into fel without being PKed.

    Let's call a spade a spade.
     
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  39. Tyrath

    Tyrath Grand Poobah
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    But but it is all about the PvP and the thrill of the fight! Or is really you just get off on PKing people that have no interest in the fight?
     
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  40. OREOGL

    OREOGL Crazed Zealot
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    I'm not sure what else to say here.

    It doesn't have anything to do with PVP or PKing.

    Im not certain why people are this worried about going to fel to knock out a 20 minute spawn.
     
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  41. Yadd of Legends

    Yadd of Legends Babbling Loonie
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    Doesn’t shadow guard have its own built-in system to avoid multi-boxing - the more people that show up the greater the spawn?
     
  42. railshot

    railshot Lore Master
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    Oh really? So all those screams that "Trammies already have everything and Fel only has Power scrolls" and "Fel needs more content" must be a ruse as well. It seems like PvPers can farm everything after all. But for some reason they want to be the only ones to be able to farm power scrolls. Thanks for confirming.
     
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  43. Tyrath

    Tyrath Grand Poobah
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    Thank you for posting this Rail and saving me the trouble........ It has absolutely nothing to do with PvP but maintaining status quos and the so called PvP communities sense of entitlement. Very few of todays PvP want actual PvP, they want easy kills and control over the key cash generating areas of the game. So yeah Oreo lets just call a spade a spade.
     
  44. celticus

    celticus Babbling Loonie

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    Very simply, accurately put..
     
  45. celticus

    celticus Babbling Loonie

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    What the real question is : How many people are PKers in the game and PK for scrolls, resources etc?
    And how many people have NO interest in PK or PvP. From the many posts of people here it seems as if the VAST majority of remaining people in the game have NO interest in PK or PvP, and only very few want to be play BOOGEYMAN PKer, just as one of the Moderators here, Pinco, and Many others have suggested.
    So why should content that affects 2-3,000 people be controlled by 15 - 20 people, as it has been for decades, should continue, especially since we are interested that UO is to survive and grow, and also especially due to the taming revamp, that we all hope will bring more people in the game? Its time for UO to evolve a few more steps, and start catering to the majority of the players.
    And YES ALL Tram content is, as it has been available to the PKers also, like the Roof, and ALL Tram spawns Bosses etc, so there is no real issue of no content for PKers etc.
    Anyway its all up to the Devs, maybe some day they can see the light, solve the PS fiasco one way or another, and the PK issues. But would not hold breath too long.
     
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  46. TB Cookie [W]

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    Create a full Feluccan shard, then you can have your Trammel way with UO.

    No-one would or could complain then.
     
  47. celticus

    celticus Babbling Loonie

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    Possibly could work. But still to make this work, you need somehow to disallow non-consensual PK in the non-all-Felucan shard. Otherwise nothing would really change for the regular shard.
     
  48. Scribbles

    Scribbles Long Live The Players
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    Champ spawns are the only actual pvp left. Please leave them alone. You have every spawn except for champs and harrowers. Get over it.
     
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  49. TB Cookie [W]

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    You can delete Felucca on all production shards, they are empty and unused.....

    The Feluccans can come to the Feluccan shard (More housing space would be available with all the Land Masses).

    You can move the Champs spawns into Trammel/Illsh.
     
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  50. Cymidei

    Cymidei UO Pacific News Reporter
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    Yes people will complain, that's what players do, we complain.

    Just a quick history lesson...what happened after Trammel was introduced? The UO subscriber base doubled. Most players don't like being victimized by thieves and pks all the time. Any of you guys remember the bad old days?

    When if you lagged at the Britain bank you got instantly got picked clean by thieves? Remember how it felt to constantly have to dodge PKs to do anything in UO other than sit in the thief infested towns? Maybe you forgot what it was like back then or maybe you are so noob you didn't play back in 1997-1998. Yet you think you want a full Felucca, it must have been something you've never experienced.

    To me consensual PVP is about getting to choose when, where, if, and how you will engage in PVP and have a choice to fight or not. That sounds good to me! Who wants to deal with Pks and thieves when you are trying to do other stuff? Or when a fight is just not fair and you are out numbered/gunned? What is fun about being victimized? As a species we have this nasty little problem called human nature, we're jerks by nature who are never satisfied and will try to get every advantage we can over others.

    We like to gank, trash talk, and make unfair fights. Strut like peacocks and think we're superior to everyone else. If someone else won, they cheated, if we won we're the superior player. If nobody wants to go to Felucca or PVP it's the developer's problem. Wrong my friends, you are the problem and always have been.

    The developer cannot rewrite human nature and make us all play fair, make pvp perfect and balanced, etc. The second PVP was perfect, you guys would unbalance it again...you'd find a way or you'd scream bloody murder because it was fair and balanced and now you can't win!
     
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