1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. Greetings Guest!!

    In order to combat SPAM on the forums, all users are required to have a minimum of 2 posts before they can submit links in any post or thread.

    Dismiss Notice
  3. Greetings Guest, Having Login Issues? Check this thread!
    Dismiss Notice
  4. Hail Guest!,
    Please take a moment to read this post reminding you all of the importance of Account Security.
    Dismiss Notice

Make ilshnear felucca ruleset

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Great DC, Apr 26, 2018.

  1. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Stratics Legend
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    May 12, 2008
    Messages:
    7,681
    Likes Received:
    3,653
    But the people you are raiding are PvMers not PvPers, so where is the thrill in that.
     
  2. Thoronnar

    Thoronnar Journeyman

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2015
    Messages:
    233
    Likes Received:
    124
    Usually they have people protecting them, and sometimes some are actually not bad at fighting back (and I am not that good). When they just run around and not fight back it isn't fun really, when that happens I leave them usually so they come back. I've also had them come back with their PvPers or friends and masacre me. So you'd be surprised how intense and fun it can get.
     
    callum_fitzhugh and Lord Frodo like this.
  3. Thoronnar

    Thoronnar Journeyman

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2015
    Messages:
    233
    Likes Received:
    124
    I don't think this will help at all. I think they just have to mostly focus on fel. It raises the same issue, why would you go to unsafe ilshenar if you have the same stuff in safe ilshenar?
     
  4. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Stratics Legend
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    May 12, 2008
    Messages:
    7,681
    Likes Received:
    3,653
    You should go to this post. DEVs make UO consensual PvP only
     
  5. kaio

    kaio Lore Master
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2008
    Messages:
    1,036
    Likes Received:
    350
    Does it matter what they are ? PVM'ers tailors smiths or tinkers ?
    They went to fel to get reward X, they took a risk and they paid the ultimate price and died, it's really that simple.
     
  6. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Stratics Legend
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    May 12, 2008
    Messages:
    7,681
    Likes Received:
    3,653
    So you really do not care who you kill just as long as you get to kill people, that must be very rewarding to you knowing that your LEET PvPer can kill a miner we use to call those PKers pre tram what would you call them, LEET PvPers.
     
    celticus and Pawain like this.
  7. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
    Governor Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend Campaign Supporter Royal Knight

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2000
    Messages:
    23,635
    Likes Received:
    9,674
    Ilsh would be the busiest facet of all if they just added Powerscrolls to the spawns there. People would be doing them all day long. The reason no one does them much is because there isn't any reason to... You don't get scrolls from them and the drops rate of pinks is abysmal.

    Making it another Fel Facet wouldn't bring more people there it would bring LESS people there than already go there. If People wanted more Fel carrots why is it then that Siege and Mugen are nearly vacant save for the 100's of houses people who don't play there have?

    If Fel PvP was that popular why is it everyone is in Tram? The 25 people who PvP anymore in UO don't need another bunch of spawns to patrol... besides which Ilsh is the ONLY place to tame CuSidhe and Blood Foxes... I could see that as a potential NEGATIVE on the community... especially since there is only ONE way to the Cu spawn... and it's in a cave where you'd have the potential for a massive gank squad... NO Just NO PvP does NOT need any more carrots.

    What it needs is better balance and less cheating. Every single video post I see regarding PvP is FULL of exploits. And people complain about EC users.
    I roll my eyes at this suggestion it's just not needed.
     
  8. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Stratics Legend
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    May 12, 2008
    Messages:
    7,681
    Likes Received:
    3,653
    Just make all UO consensual PvP and if they want to add PSs to all the bosses/spawns that way everybody gets it all. PvPers now have more content to fight over.
     
  9. Great DC

    Great DC Lore Keeper
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2010
    Messages:
    962
    Likes Received:
    949
    Most of the people who are arguing against this are saying nothing but false information of how felucca really is. Im getting really tired of these being allowed to post nothing but lies and no valid argument. If you don't like felucca for whatever reason you tin foul hat conspiracy theory you make up in your mind then move and don't post here. This is an idea to try and make the game better, and I know it will not only invigorate the pvp world it would also have a great influence on the UO economy. No pvper I have ever played with goes looking for weak players just to pick on and kill them, that's just false. Miner's back in the day were killed not cause they were weak but because they were scripting it. Now those people script in trammel facet and nothing happens to them, so technically its all your crying about making trammel back then that caused more scripting. I also think it would take more then just making a fel ruleset, they need to upgrade the content there with better drops and quests. For all those board warriors that don't like this idea and have no real argument, just stay out of it.
     
    Lieutenant Dan! likes this.
  10. Tectop

    Tectop Journeyman

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2016
    Messages:
    180
    Likes Received:
    58
    I agree, the only thing IIsh needs that Fel has is the powerscrolls drop at IIsh champ spawns


    Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
     
    Lord Frodo likes this.
  11. CovenantX

    CovenantX Crazed Zealot
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2009
    Messages:
    3,742
    Likes Received:
    2,096
    No one wants to farm the same content for the same rewards, while one has more risk than others.... I mean, seriously, Helen Keller could see that.

    Exclusive content for each facet is the only way to go. for every side to be happy.
     
  12. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Stratics Legend
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    May 12, 2008
    Messages:
    7,681
    Likes Received:
    3,653
    LOL Really talk about spreading falsehoods. Make the game better for who, all UO players or just a small select few. Back in the day they were called PKers and now today they are called PvPers. If PvP is so great then why is Fel so dead? Why do you need a LURE to fight over? PvP pre PSs was all about petting yourself against other PvPer and seeing who was the best now it is all about what you can get, there is no more honor in PvP.
     
    Fridgster and celticus like this.
  13. Pinkerton

    Pinkerton Visitor

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2018
    Messages:
    1
    Likes Received:
    4

    Shall I tell you why you are so stupid?

    Fel is not a playstyle that people want. Sorry it is not. If it is then point me to the game that is thriving based on a MMO Non-Consensual PVP Ruleset? You think Fel type players stopped playing UO? Ok what are they playing? because last I looked the multimillion subscriber games are not anything resembling pre-tram UO. So you are wrong, 100% completely wrong and you can point to no evidence to deny it.

    You already cannot recall in or mark runes.

    You are asking for nothing but more targets. Ilshenar is one of the better PvM zones in the game. What you want is a place that has a reason for non-pvpers to show up so you can gank them, grief them and feel good about being mean to people in a video game.

    If PvP is so important if PvP is the life support of this game, why does it need PvM content? You do nothing to explain why PvM content needs to be locked behind a PvP door - you are bad at game design and explaining your argument.

    I am not mad at you, bruh. but I would expect someone with such a bold stance would be able to better articulate it.

    And the bottom line is it will never, ever, ever happen. As long as you understand that you won't be too disappointed.
     
  14. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
    Governor Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend Campaign Supporter Royal Knight

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2000
    Messages:
    23,635
    Likes Received:
    9,674
    Better for who???? Seems to me that a vast majority DO NOT want it changed.

    And I'm calling Bulldung on no PvP goes after the weak.
     
    Lord Frodo likes this.
  15. Great DC

    Great DC Lore Keeper
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2010
    Messages:
    962
    Likes Received:
    949
    This entire post is complete lie. Noone wants people like you come there and get ganked. You are not that important to us pvper's. We the actual pvper's want more things to liven up our pvp with other pvper's. It has nothing to do with all you carebears that put on your tin foil hats and tell fake news about felucca. I think a lot of you people would be surprised if you actually went to felucca with friends of you own and did something and got it done. Your guys argument is like saying Chinese food is terrible but never tried before in your life.
     
    drcossack and Lieutenant Dan! like this.
  16. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Stratics Legend
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    May 12, 2008
    Messages:
    7,681
    Likes Received:
    3,653
    Then why do you raid spawns killing PvMers if all you want is more/better competition with other PvPers, ask UO to give you titles saying how good you really are fight other PvPers. That entire post is not a complete lie because if it was then Tram would have never happened and the Fel Facet would have everybody playing on it.
     
    MalagAste and Tectop like this.
  17. kaio

    kaio Lore Master
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2008
    Messages:
    1,036
    Likes Received:
    350
    I think you are missing the point. When someone venture into fel to get a reward, there is a risk involved.
    The risk involved is partly AI based EG you have to kill spawn at a champ spawns, the other risk is player based.
    Thats how fel works, it dosen't have anything todo with PVP skills nor leetness or being a PK.
    You argue that PVM'ers whom ventures into FEL is defenseless, they are only defenseless because they choose to be defenseless. no one is forcing the PVM'rs to not carry PVP weapons, apples, pots, bolas, etc etc when they wan't to do fx champ spawns in fel, its their choice, just as they can choose to go to doom or any other place to farm.

    Back in the good old FEL only days it Weren't uncommon that miners had weapon skill. The difference is that back then miner joe, didn't have an option, now he does :)
     
    Lieutenant Dan! and drcossack like this.
  18. Lieutenant Dan!

    Lieutenant Dan! Seasoned Veteran
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2014
    Messages:
    441
    Likes Received:
    309
    Some people just don't get it and you sir are the king of those people.
    Let me explain this in the shortest most understandable way i know how.

    Champ spawns and the power scrolls derived from those spawns are in Fel for players to fight over. The scrolls are your reward for winning that fight.

    Think of it as game of capture the flag. You'll have two or more opposing players going after that flag resulting in a big ole fun battle with the winner coming home with the flag. Now in the case of UO there are multiple flags spread out all over the lands and that flag is actually power scrolls and everyone playing is having a ball winning some, loosing some.

    Until one day a player (i'm refering to YOU) doesn't think it's fair that they cant win every single time. So he complains and moans and cries that he wants to play capture the flag all by himself and receive the same reward without contest. This player (again you) then suggests removing all the flags for the people to fight over and putting them somewhere else where anyone can come and take as many as they like without competition of any kind. And for those of you that liked the fighting game dont worry you can just pretend the flags are still there and continue on.

    You see now? Power scrolls are an integral part to a thriving PvP community. Without them then all you're going to have is Yew gate PvP which is just meh, nothing more than just practice for the real fight.
     
  19. Phantasmagorian

    Phantasmagorian Seasoned Veteran
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 1969
    Messages:
    436
    Likes Received:
    424
    UO needs more risk/reward of this sort, not less.
     
    CovenantX and Lieutenant Dan! like this.
  20. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
    Governor Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend Campaign Supporter Royal Knight

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2000
    Messages:
    23,635
    Likes Received:
    9,674
    No, it does not... it's been proven time and time again that putting carrots in Fel does NOTHING to add to the PvP experience ..... all that does is line a select few's pockets with gold selling the stuff they get from anti-social behavior... rewarding that behavior. Which IMO make ZERO sense.

    Most players now are casual players... they don't care to be PKed by some stealth archers hiding about like a bunch of greedy patsies waiting for the perfect moment to one shot kill you and then finish off the boss and take all the reward after doing NONE of the work.

    Honestly, I can not understand how this keeps getting perpetuated and why you all think it's a great idea to make antisocial behavior something to be rewarded.

    And if you all were right then the market would be flooded with PS... which it's NOT. PvPers in Fel aren't doing the champ spawns... they want sheeple to do it for them so they can just 1 shot whack them and take off with the reward without doing any risk or work.

    And you can flame me all you want but it is the truth and you know it. Once upon a time when there was a ton of money in powerscrolls and everyone wanted and needed them there were "good" fights over them.... but anymore the only ones wanting the PS's are TAMERS.... who can't PvP now if they wanted to since you all cried boo hoo about the new pets and had them nerfed into uselessness. So tamers are back to square one and have ONE dungeon basically where they can get anything at all worthwhile.... Otherwise it's Sampire this Sampire that or risk getting Pked if you want to try to get your own scrolls, by some punk who "claims" they are looking for PvP but it's all BS. Because if they really DID want PvP they would really want a more useful fair fun atmosphere to do it in.

    And deny all you like but we've all seen the video's posted here there and everywhere with tons of exploits being used... So don't give us all that BS... We're not buying it.

    IMO it's high time they did away with the carrots and did something more useful for PvP... Like do a REAL revamp of VvV or whatever... that actually is all about PvP and take the candies out of that and put in stuff that is more useful and promotes more PvP like give them control of the cities should they win and let the winner chose a buff and all that jazz... and leave deco stuff out of it as anyone knows that most PvPers don't want that they want stuff that will give them an edge and be useful for PvP... Maybe instead of a bounty system you could do something like the Taxidermy and the Pirates and get a deed by targetting the corpse of your opponent and keeping a scroll saying "abc was victorious over xyz on 00/00/00" or something...

    Why not give real suggestions for actual fun PvP rewards etc than just trying to get more carrots. If you really wanted more PvP that's what you ought to be doing.
     
  21. drcossack

    drcossack Crazed Zealot
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    Messages:
    3,422
    Likes Received:
    914
    What chokehold? It's not 2003-2005, where there were multiple guilds controlling the scroll market on each shard. The current pvp'ers can't be everywhere on all shards. You can get PLENTY of spawns off in that time.

    Big money? Really? Since you ignored my point about item prices (I wonder why...), I'll repeat it for you in a different way. Let's say I take 3 hours to do a few Shadowguard runs with 3 accounts. In each one, I have a chance at a Cameo, with the "best" ones selling for approximately 170m. In the same amount of time, I can run several champ spawns. I have a MUCH lower chance of hitting the jackpot and getting the scroll/primers I want to sell.

    When I was doing Shadowguard heavily on Atlantic, there were other pvp guilds doing it. I know I saw Hi-5 there a couple times. I don't know if they (or anyone else) still runs it there, but I would imagine they do.

    What is stopping those tamers from a) learning how to pvp? b) doing spawns on templates that are FAR more efficient for killing spawn? I'll answer both questions for you: Nothing. Spawns are done on sampires because they are far and away THE most efficient way to kill everything.

    I don't know why tamers want scrolls for their pets so much. They aren't needed. The only ones you really need are 120 Wrestling (for those annoying bosses that go way beyond 120 wrestle, anyway) and 120 Resist (for pvp tamers.) Everything else is pointless.
     
    Lieutenant Dan! likes this.
  22. Anon McDougle

    Anon McDougle Seasoned Veteran

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2015
    Messages:
    401
    Likes Received:
    310
    This is kinda off topic from OP but why isn't Siege More populated IF PERers real think tram bad you would think it would be full ???

    My guess would be the inability to transfer PS off ...
     
  23. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Stratics Legend
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    May 12, 2008
    Messages:
    7,681
    Likes Received:
    3,653
    Just what I expected, kill them all it is so enjoyable.
     
  24. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Stratics Legend
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    May 12, 2008
    Messages:
    7,681
    Likes Received:
    3,653
    It's all about the item and not the true PvP, gotch ya.
     
  25. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Stratics Legend
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    May 12, 2008
    Messages:
    7,681
    Likes Received:
    3,653
    There is no insurance and it is to hard for them, they only want the easy kills.
     
  26. Lieutenant Dan!

    Lieutenant Dan! Seasoned Veteran
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2014
    Messages:
    441
    Likes Received:
    309
    nope i was wrong
    You are a lost cause!

    It's actually about you getting stuff for free and/or very little effort. gotch ya
     
    #76 Lieutenant Dan!, Apr 27, 2018
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2018
    drcossack likes this.
  27. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Stratics Legend
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    May 12, 2008
    Messages:
    7,681
    Likes Received:
    3,653
    It would be like any other reward in UO, you would have to complete the content to receive the reward, but with you it is about letting some one else do the work and then you PK them a take everything.
     
  28. CovenantX

    CovenantX Crazed Zealot
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2009
    Messages:
    3,742
    Likes Received:
    2,096
    Did the devs ever make Ilshenar spawns drop Powerscrolls on Siege Perilous?

    Back when I played on siege (2000-2008-ish) you only got Powerscrolls from Fel spawns even though ilshenar was fel-rules on siege.... you didn't even have the effects of faction stat-loss if you killed people or got killed in ilshenar.... It's like some of the Fel-only rules didn't apply other than the Pvp-ability & stand-blocking.

    I'm just curious if the Devs ever wondered why ilsh spawns wern't never done there? That's why, same content with even less reward.... and on siege the same risks as well.

    @Kyronix @Bleak
     
  29. kaio

    kaio Lore Master
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2008
    Messages:
    1,036
    Likes Received:
    350
    Ask yourself this, why on earth wouldn't they the evil PVP'ers kill any PVM'ers who comes to their land to try and steal their resources ?
    Problem is players like you, who think you can grab anything in the game for free, but i have news for you, if you wan't a piece of the PS pie in fel, you need to ally with pvp'ers to protect you, else the other baddies will come and kill you, and take your'e champ. And then they will trash talk you for an hour in gen chat to scare you away from THEIR land..
    Raiding champs has all days being about controlling champ spawns, because he who controls the champ spawns get the most gold for his scrolls :p
     
    Lieutenant Dan! likes this.
  30. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Stratics Legend
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    May 12, 2008
    Messages:
    7,681
    Likes Received:
    3,653
    Where do you get the FREE BS from. Nothing in UO is free you have to do the content first before getting the reward, unlike you just setting there until a PvMer does all the work and you take the easy mode and kill them and take everything. Guess we will just agree to let you keep your easy mode
     
    Tabby Kapak likes this.
  31. drcossack

    drcossack Crazed Zealot
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    Messages:
    3,422
    Likes Received:
    914
    Isn't that exactly what the "We want PS's in Tram" group wants? You don't want to have to deal with the possibility of being killed (even though you can VERY EASILY avoid it, and I even said how earlier in this thread), so you want them in Tram where you can farm them as much as you want without the "big bad PK's" to stand in your way.

    Trammel already has PLENTY of content for non-pvp'ers to do. A very large portion of this game's content is just not worth doing, due to the power creep on gear or just having crap loot in general...but that's not a problem specific to UO. Almost every game available online has it. FF14 has plenty of old content that's rarely done, so Square-Enix added incentives for people to do it: Alliance raid roulette goes through old 24-man (3 party) content (or current, depending on your job level - there's one 24 man raid for level 70 characters), Wondrous Tails (a sticker book that gives random rewards for 9 seals [weekly max] and 1/2/3 lines of completion), glamour/transmogs for equipment, and other roulettes (trial, leveling, 50/60 dungeons, Main Scenario Quests) for leveling alternate jobs. That's in addition to the Omega Sigmascape Savage raids, which is the current item endgame.

    In comparison, what does UO have? Multiple empty landmasses that need MASSIVE overhauls, with only a small portion of available content worth doing. Outside of Shadowguard, Exodus (for the +5 stat scrolls), and Fel Champ Spawns, there's very little worthwhile pvm content in this game.

    If you want to talk about an easy mode in UO, it's not in Felucca. It's been in Trammel ever since it was introduced back with UO:R.
     
    Lieutenant Dan! likes this.
  32. Great DC

    Great DC Lore Keeper
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2010
    Messages:
    962
    Likes Received:
    949
    Where is this so called mythical proof of yours? Nothing has been added to felucca since powerscrolls that is felucca specific. So how can you possibly have proof of this incredibly false nonsense that you just posted. You people need to realize that this is just a video game and just go try to get your scrolls and stop worrying about dying for 10k insurance. Get a grip already.
     
    Lieutenant Dan! likes this.
  33. kaio

    kaio Lore Master
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2008
    Messages:
    1,036
    Likes Received:
    350
    the content in fel included the possibility to get killed and robbed for you to get the reward...hence the easy mode outside fel.
    If you don't like it, then don't go there, its that simple.
    Instead of being so angry all the time, how about you ally with some PVP'ers that can help you instead.
     
    Lieutenant Dan! likes this.
  34. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Stratics Legend
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    May 12, 2008
    Messages:
    7,681
    Likes Received:
    3,653
    Go play your "easy mode" killing poor little PvMers that do all your work for you. We at least do the content in the Tram rule set to get our rewards. Go back to your PKing now.
     
    Spartan likes this.
  35. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Stratics Legend
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    May 12, 2008
    Messages:
    7,681
    Likes Received:
    3,653
    Do you mean PKers, yea so they can kill me after it is all over, NP.
     
  36. Spartan

    Spartan Lore Keeper

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2016
    Messages:
    985
    Likes Received:
    716
    This is the exact attitude that caused Tram to be created in the first place. Seriously ... you have Fel ruleset to play in .... USE THE BLOODY THING! Quit trying to p**s in someone elses cereal.
     
    #86 Spartan, Apr 27, 2018
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2018
  37. Tabby Kapak

    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend Campaign Benefactor

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2008
    Messages:
    570
    Likes Received:
    191
    PvP needs new content you say, if you want to PvP, why not just post a thread about a date and time to meet up? All that really are interested in that can show up? What do you need extra content for? More flags to fight over? And no, Lt Dan,
    NO ONE suggested to remove all the flags from your territory, at least not seriously. It might have been stated in a knee-jerk reaction which happens too much on both sides. No, we don't believe all the PvP-ers are out there to get easy picks, but those ARE the ones you meet as PvM-er trying to get your scrolls! Talking from personal experience. And WE get really fed up with the other side claiming trammies merely to be scriptor bots that they valiantly dispatch off. Of course there are many players on both sides merely trying to enjoy themselves with content they enjoy. But even the suggestion to have Tram spawns drop merely 110s or even just 105s (as stated in previous threads about this topic) get met with great hostility from the PvP community. It cannot be stated that is like taking away the flags, there is still a good incentive or a bonus to taking the risks?
    Felucca players often say it is a choice. You take the risk, to get those PS, (which btw are NOT as useless as they are portrayed to be!! Dr. Cossack made an interesting exception for Wrestling 120, which seem to drop even less than Cameos nowadays!) so if you die it is just tough luck. Well, PvP-ers CAN do the PvM content on another char, that is also a choice. As is said several times by people from both sides of the argument, why do the same with risk if you can do it without? Some claim it is more fun if there is a risk of getting your hard work taken away. But... those can still do it in Fel? But nope, that wouldn't happen. So is it so weird to think it seems more about the items/gold than the PvP? We personally hate those adrenaline rushes! That is the one and only answer for us to your question Dr. Cossack:
    we HATE PvP and the adrenaline rushes that come with it. So no, "learning it" or liking it is not ever going to happen.
    And as for the following:
    Maybe they enjoy playing their tamers? And to get a reward for the hard work their pets do by allowing the pets to get better seems nice ey?
    We do feel you are right in stating it is possible to get champs done succesfully out of prime time for trammies like us. (Which is why we feel Wrestling is so extremely rare nowadays.) But there is still that constant fear of getting raided and wasted all that game time (and the durability of the suits) while that is in itself rather limited most of the time. So many pets to feed scrolls to, so little time.
     
    celticus likes this.
  38. drcossack

    drcossack Crazed Zealot
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    Messages:
    3,422
    Likes Received:
    914
    So you can't learn the bare minimum to defend yourself? I don't even notice the adrenaline rushes anymore. For one reason: Experience.

    so you can only do champ spawns to get scrolls for pets on a specific template now? Is that a new change I'm unaware of? It's not a question of what you enjoy playing, because I have multiple tamers and enjoy playing them. But, when it takes you forever to do a spawn on a tamer, and just as long to kill the champ (if you can at all), why would you do a spawn on a tamer? Even with the revamped pets they're still far less effective than a sampire or whammy.
     
  39. celticus

    celticus Babbling Loonie

    Joined:
    May 25, 2017
    Messages:
    2,849
    Likes Received:
    935
    OhOh...I can see a nerf cannon pointing towards my poor Sammie....
     
  40. Anon McDougle

    Anon McDougle Seasoned Veteran

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2015
    Messages:
    401
    Likes Received:
    310
    i went to Brit bank in Fel on a few shards and not one of the fierce PVPers was sitting there talking L33T Smack talk all in Luna Soooooo if you all love Fel that much why not always stay there ??? only Sell your PS in Fel only buy things in Fel... i think what everyone hates to admit is we need each other.....
     
    Tyrath likes this.
  41. drcossack

    drcossack Crazed Zealot
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    Messages:
    3,422
    Likes Received:
    914
    You must have missed the part where I said I do Tram content as well, although I haven't in a while. Here's one example of it:

    In another post (which I'm too lazy to find right now), I said how much I've made from Shadowguard drops: Over 500m from Cameos alone. I still have a Cameo on Atlantic that I can sell if I so chose, but it was an "Owned By" Demon Slayer that I put on one of my throwers. The last two Cameos I sold: 130m or so for an Arachnid, and a Demon for 170-175. When I was selling Hawkwind's Robes, I think they were 50-60m? There's other items I'm forgetting.

    That's just from Shadowguard. When Zipactriotl was new, I made close to 300m from selling the Moonstone Crystals I pulled (half a dozen) to people.

    But by all means, please keep going on and on about how PvM'ers have it SO HARD when they have all of the most profitable content in THE ENTIRE GAME. All because they can't go to Fel (the only pvp-allowed area in UO) and do their spawns without the risk of getting killed.

    You bring up the "monopoly" that the pvp'ers have on scrolls. Have you ever set foot in Fel? If so, when was the last time you did? Early AoS era? The pvp'ers haven't had a monopoly on the scroll market in years. If you want to buy them (which involves ZERO risk of dying to a pvp'er), there are plenty of other avenues you can take to get the gold to buy one.
     
  42. celticus

    celticus Babbling Loonie

    Joined:
    May 25, 2017
    Messages:
    2,849
    Likes Received:
    935
    Well Doc, would you admit though, that those we call Trammies got us outnumbered, and their subscriptions are keeping the game alive for the most part? They want to play a softer game. Don't you think that their wishes should be also heard and respected? I think they are asking for fair content change, considering what has happened to the game after the pet revamp, and the disaster that the tamers themselves caused as far as PS are concerned. We need content that will keep this majority playing and subing I reckon?
     
  43. Tyrath

    Tyrath Grand Poobah
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2003
    Messages:
    5,164
    Likes Received:
    5,296
    Could be Fel does not get new content because the 23 active PvPs don't use the content they already have available to them.........
     
    celticus likes this.
  44. Elaysia

    Elaysia Journeyman
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Sep 29, 2003
    Messages:
    272
    Likes Received:
    28
    I think you were doing good until this post. I started in Fel before Tram and I can tell you for a fact that my smith was absolutely tormented every single time I would get a good load in my packies they would come and kill me, my friends, the pack animals and take everything. OVER AND OVER, lmao, I'm laughing now, but back then I would get pissed. it came to a point where I started fighting back, but I dealt with quite a bit before I got to that point.

    I'll admit it was fun at times, but not when I was really trying to do something like mining. I'm not sure if one of you here is this person "Salty Dog" from LS but me and my friends had major run ins with him for almost a year. He literally stalked us and killed us mercilessly lol, however one day I finally got him to talk to us and we ended up liking him.

    Long story short, I like your idea but the reason they created Tram was because the griefing got out of control. So I wish it were true that most PKers are looking out for just scripters, but it's just not true. However, some did indeed keep them in check I did that with my guild for a time myself.
     
  45. drcossack

    drcossack Crazed Zealot
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    Messages:
    3,422
    Likes Received:
    914
    You're not wrong. I don't mind pvm only games (like the aforementioned FF14), but I went into it expecting that it's going to be that way - it's an FF game! (it does have pvp, but it's terrible and I only did it to level past 60.) Prior to the pet revamp, I pvp'd a lot more frequently than I do now. My major complaint with pvp in UO now is that it's the same people everywhere, no matter which shard you go to. It was the same years back too (Where the people encountered were concerned), but you weren't guaranteed to see the same group all the time either. You could even end up with 3-way or 4-way fights at spawns.

    If I had the choice to never pvm in UO, I would do so without hesitation - in the late AoS/early SE era, pvp was all I did unless I wanted to skill up my pets, or was at a spawn (which I always did on a Red unless it was Oaks.) In UO as it is today, you HAVE to pvm. I know it's the nature of gaming, since pvp requires a completely different mindset & most people aren't interested in it...and, depending on the complexity of the pvp, neither am I. I'm pretty sure Black Desert's pvp is one such system, although I don't play it because my current computer cannot handle the game; I downloaded it and used a guest pass when it was new, and it overtaxed my fan to the point that I thought it'd blow up if I kept playing. That was on the character creation screen - it was so loud that the guys that were in Vent with me could hear the fan plain as day.

    To me, the problem is that the "Trammies" want everything available to them (with zero risk, which already exists for them, given how much content they have), but don't want others to have content exclusive to their playstyle (Felucca.) Complaining about something you don't engage in just seems pointless, doesn't it? If I didn't pvm, I wouldn't go into threads discussing it and demanding ridiculous changes to something I CHOOSE not to participate in.

    When 99% of a game's content is pointless without a carrot dangling in front of it, changes need to be made - it's why FF14 gives various rewards for their old content, and you'll see new players on a regular basis in the game's 3 starting cities. In UO, the change can be something as "simple" as a loot bump (killing 99% of the monsters in this game is pointless, because they don't drop good loot.) UO doesn't have the playerbase it used to, although some of my guildmates have recently come back to the game. EJ's not necessarily a bad thing, but who's going to use it? Players looking to come back and see how different the game is (whether they stay or not is a different story) and players with existing accounts. How many EJ accounts running around are brand new players?

    What content do we have available? In particular content that's exclusive to Fel? VvV and Champ Spawns/the Harrower? The pvp'ers no longer need scrolls, unless they want to make alts...and we already have the scrolls ready to use. They may want them for pets, but when it's only needed for select skills, there should be another way to raise a pet's skill cap, or make raising skill caps worthwhile, because there's not enough of a benefit to it*. The only reasons spawns are still done is for the fight; if "Trammies" get caught in the crossfire or end up being the raid target, it doesn't really matter to us; we're interested in people coming to fight. I know Harrowers have been announced in Atl gen chat in the past. Simply to get people to come fight. Other spawns were likely announced over gen chat too, although it's been a while since I've been on Atl (other than a recent fight the other day.)

    *Granted, this is probably a dumb idea and would require testing, if not be scrapped entirely. But, if you invest the time in raising a pet's skill to 120, it should have more of an effect on how powerful the pet is, right?
     
    #95 drcossack, Apr 28, 2018
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2018
  46. Fridgster

    Fridgster Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2010
    Messages:
    2,650
    Likes Received:
    2,576
    Those good ol fel only days nearly killed uo before they added tram. So please stop spreading mis-information.
     
  47. ShriNayne

    ShriNayne Certifiable
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2013
    Messages:
    1,893
    Likes Received:
    2,025
    I like to go mining for saltpetre in Ilsh on my crafter, I wouldn't be going there any more if I was likely to get attacked. I know people who love pvp want to have fun too, but surely slaughtering helpless people isn't any challenge. The Devs need to find some way to get the PvP community fighting each other, with challenge and a reward. Not stuff they stole from people who can't defend themselves. A reward for having some skill.
     
    MalagAste, Tyrath, Tina Small and 2 others like this.
  48. jopromol

    jopromol Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2010
    Messages:
    2,045
    Likes Received:
    654
    PVP is part of the content UO offers to its players. It can be avoided by simply not going to felucca. If you choose to not go to felucca, you choose to not be able to access all the content. I fail to see the point of the powerscroll dilemma. As I try to wrap my head around it... it seems as though people want access to all the content with immunity from some of the content (i.e felucca) o_O Where else in the game is this possible? Please give me an example of one instance where in game I could get what I wanted without having to go to where I needed to go, in order to obtain it. The only thing that comes to mind is the in-game store... Would you buy the scrolls you wanted if they offered them in the in-game store?
     
  49. kaio

    kaio Lore Master
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2008
    Messages:
    1,036
    Likes Received:
    350
    UO had it's issues back then, grefing over population to name a few, but my information is still correct.
     
  50. Tyrath

    Tyrath Grand Poobah
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2003
    Messages:
    5,164
    Likes Received:
    5,296
    The entire game just like the Trammies whether you choose to use that content or not is up to you. Just because all of the content does not fit your play style does not mean it is not there for you to use. PvP has a entire facet devoted to it that is 99.9% empty. Everyone that wants to fight already comes to fight, no amount of lure content is going to change the fact that the vast majority of players are never going to step foot in Fel. The are many games where PvP is more the point of the game and does not generate so many hard feelings. Personally I loved Fel, as there is Zero risk for most activities and maybe 25% -30% risk for doing spawns because there is simply no one there. I actually enjoy PvP just not UOs warped version of PvP. LOL I was up until 3:30 this morning in a war that started over a control of a area between myself and 2 opponents, they called some friends, I called some friends and my midnight there were over 200 people on the field and much fun was had by all. Watching the lower levels slug it out in their class was more fun that watching us max combat guys pound on each other......... There was no reason for the fight other than a couple of lvl 90s wanted to farm the area my LvL 138 was farming and tried to take it. In UO I would have simply left and let them have the area because PvP in UO is a sick joke and NOT Fun. I doubt you will ever see a field of 200 people willingly PvPing in UO again unless it is a rich fel idoc. I guess through about half of the fight last night a couple of Mods came into play and plucked a few people running cheats out of the fight...... also something you will not see in UO where PvP more often than not means Programs Vs Programs and he/she with the best cheats wins...... Another reason most will never participate in Fel content. Truth is harsh but UOs PvP community PK'd itself and created the empty desolate fel of today and 18-20 years later there really is no repairing the damage and reputation of UO PvP........... No amount of Fel content is going to change that.