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Mysticism concern................

Discussion in 'UO Stygian Abyss' started by TheGrayGhost, Jul 10, 2009.

  1. TheGrayGhost

    TheGrayGhost Guest

    Ok, so I've read all the info I can on the new stuff and things sounded pretty great to begin with. But now after a lot of thought, it seems to me that Mysticism may not be so great.

    To truly get the most out of Mysticism you will need

    Eval Int

    That pretty much takes all of your skills right there and doesn't leave you much of any skill points left for defense or even a secondary offensive to fall back on. You get defensive wrestling which is ok but I don't know. Chivalry, necromancy and Spellweaving aren't very good stand alone skills but with few requirements to make them effective there easy to add to most templates.

    Chivalry requires High Karma and the spell costs are low. A good skill to aid the Melee or Archers dmg output and survivability.

    Necromancy requires Spirit speak to hit max potential and Low Karma. Mages and melee's have found uses and room for it in there templates.

    Spell Weaving, This one is a bit hard for many to stick in there templates due to the huge mana cost on many of the spells but due to Spell Weaving only requiring an Arcane focus vs. a secondary skill such as Eval Int or SS it has found a home in many a players template. Not a good stand alone but can enhance many templates.

    Now Mysticism is comming, Like Spell Weaving it's supposed to have a high mana cost attached to many of it's spells. But unlike the rest of the support magics it has other high requirements making it hard to find room for it on many templates.

    It just worries me considering to max out other forms of magic and combat the requirements aren't near as high.

    With Skills alone to Max out the potential of

    Magery: you need Magery, Eval Int and Inscription. 3 Skills

    Necromancy: Necromancy, Spirit Speak, Low Karma but isn't a skill. 2 Skills

    Chivalry: Chivalry and High Karma but isn't a skill so. 1 Skill.

    Spell Weaving: Spell Weaving and a Focus, focus isn't a skill so. 1 Skill

    Most weapons: Tactics and Anatomy + the Weapon skill. 3 Skills. Lumberjack for Axe weapons so a max of 4.

    Then theres Mysticism: Mysticism, Imbuing, Evaluate Int., Anatomy and Tactics. So 5 which almost fills up a template. Just with the Primary Skill Mysticism and the secondary skills needed to max out it's potential. Add in the fact you NEED a way to regain and your at 6 skills.

    Then again Tactics and Anatomy seem to only be needed by Animated Weapon which means for the most part I see it as becoming an unused spell. 4 Control slots and needing Tactics and Anatomy to reach it's full potential makes it a strange one to me.

    Any thoughts so far how to cram this all in to a template and still be effective?

    The healing spells seem limited and the fact Cleansing winds is your heal, cure and remove curse as well as being a 6th circle spell I don't imagine it will be overly cheap mana wise.

    Only having 2 Direct Damage spells seems a bit bad as well. With the Diminishing returns and your target become temporarily immune after a bit makes Mysticism more reliant on it's pets for dmg.

    Has some nice AoE's/Crowd control that I will give it. Mass sleep, Sleep, Spell Purge, Nether Cyclone and Hail Storm.

    Pets seem ok, Eagle strike (Unless thats more of a spell than a pet) Rising Colossus, Animated Weapon (If you have tactics and Anatomy :( ). But as far as pets go, I'm not sure this would be more preferable to a tamer. GD and Rising Colossus both take 5 slots, but it sounds like the RC will act more like an Energy Vortex and attack whats closest to it rather than what you tell it to.

    It looks like stone form is meant to replace Resist spells, but with the wording on the description it leaves me thinking it will be less beneficial than 120 Resist.

    Enchant Weapon sounds nice, but seems a waste. If you get Mysticism simply for enchant weapon and you add it to your melee or Archer template something will have to be sacrificed, that something is likely to be something important to that template making it not viable. If your adding it on a mage style template then melee doesn't seem to fit in now days so it's likely to not be used.

    I don't know, I guess I was excited about the new skills and such until I sat down and started trying to think of templates I could use. Seems the one that may work would be, Mysticism, Mage, Eval Int, Med, Anatomy, Imbuing. Get a decent -Mage weapon Bow and enchant it lol. Pop stoneskin and hope it saves you from not having Resists. Depending on how long Stoneskin lasts and how effective it is, Mysticism might not be so bad.
  2. Cloak&Dagger

    Cloak&Dagger Guest

    Holy! I think you may be over analyzing it, or perhaps under analyzing it. :p

    Pick and choose effectiveness is the best way to go about it. :)

    I think it was meant more as a skill that could be placed on multiple template types, such as a warrior could summon that weapon thing, being as how they would have tactics and anatomy, maybe mystic and imbuing and you still have 2-3 more skill slots left (usually weapon and chiv+something else, could go with eval...or med...) or you could throw it on a mage and never use the anat/tactics one and then have mage/med/eval/mystic/imbue that leaves you with 1 skill left over.

    You also forgot Bushido and Ninja in your various calculators of what skill compliment each other

    For Bushido you need anat/tactics/weapon skill/parry

    For ninja you need anat/tactics/weapon skill/hiding/stealth/tracking (this one actually requires you to have 7 skill total. :p)

    Anyway...it is good to see people putting thought into it tho. :)
  3. TheGrayGhost

    TheGrayGhost Guest

    Ah I wasn't calculating templates, just support skills directly needed for the Main Skill.

    Bushido requires: Bushido, Parry and Weapon skill the tactics and anatomy add to the weapon skill. So Bushido would be 3. You've pretty much meshed 2 Skills here, Mesh a 3rd such as Healing and you have Bushido, Parry, Healing, Anatomy, Weapon, Tactics. 3 Skills and there supporting skills just made a template. Bushido alone though simply needs Parry, Weapon and Bushido.

    Ninjitsu Requires: Ninjitsu, Hiding, Stealth, Weapon and Tracking. Tactics is a support skill for a weapon, Anatomy a supporting skill for weapons and healing. So ninjitsu requires 5 supporting skills. To get Technical though :p Hiding isn't exactly required for Ninjitsu. Smoke bombs hide you. So the requirements are Ninjitsu, Stealth, Weapon and Tracking. This is of course if I am correct on my understanding of how smoke bombs work. I could be wrong and if I am then It's back to 5. If not however its down to 4 which makes mysticism alone in requiring 5. But seeing as only someone with 50 ninjitsu or higher may use smoke bombs it leads me to believe that it acts as there hiding skill, this is further suported by the description I read on the smoke bombs.

    Mysticism still actually requires: Mysticism, Imbuing, Eval Int., Anatomy and Tactics. Making it the main skill with the most supporting skills required for full effect.
  4. Cloak&Dagger

    Cloak&Dagger Guest

    to get the "full effect" of bushido you need tactics and anatomy :p I was not meshing :)

    Also for ninja you need hiding in order to stealth, and smoke bombs work directly related to your hiding skill :p as for anatomy and tactics...I will give you that one since I might be wrong about those two skills being needed for ninja :) but still a lot for ninja.
  5. TheGrayGhost

    TheGrayGhost Guest

    Yeah, I thought I might be wrong about the smoke bombs lol. Never went the ninja route, it was after my time and I returned not that long ago.

    But yeah, Mysticism seems like one you will have to pick and choose what you want to use and build your template around it.

    I was just hoping for something new to be brought to PvP template wise. Mysticism may or may not be PvP worthy, Stokeskin and the Spell stone type things they can make may work in PvP but I'll have to wait and see. Getting impatient lol.
  6. Cloak&Dagger

    Cloak&Dagger Guest

    Yea I understand, is going to be a lot of playing around, eventually people will find various uses for it.
  7. Stupid Miner

    Stupid Miner Guest

    tactics and anatomy are only used on the 4th level 4 slot summon. when there's a 8th level 5 slot summon, i doubt you're gonna want the 4th level one.
    It's like choosing blade spirits over EVs, it's never worth it.

    well i suppose you could use animate weapon if you want to only spend a few points in the skill
  8. TheGrayGhost

    TheGrayGhost Guest

    Well........... it might also be useful for the non Gargoyle considering Humans and Elves can use Mysticism and Imbuing but have the disadvantage of not having a flight mode meaning they need to be mounted oO.

    So yeah it would be like Choosing Blade spirits over EV's if you could be mounted while Blade Spirits were out but not EV's.
  9. Basara

    Basara UO Forum Moderator
    Moderator Professional Governor Stratics Veteran Wiki Moderator Stratics Legend Campaign Supporter

    Jul 16, 2003
    Likes Received:
    Going off on a tangent, Blade Spirits actually work better against Kappa at the Sleeping Dragon champ, as they are immune to the acid damage, and therefore typically live their full duration, instead of the EVs (And controllable summons) dying quickly from standing in the acid for way too long. And, if they can be boosted by spellweaving (not really played a weaver), even better.

    On the original subject, Magery is the obvious 7th skill, and is made even more deadly by the ability to use mage weapons, when you factor in that anatomy & tactics.

    Personally, my mage typically casts two summons, then charges into melee, already, as she has 80 chivalry and GM tactics. In fact, during the Melissa events, she would cast the EVs on the Balron & imps to keep them away from melissa, and routinely got looting rights using swords of prosperity and enemy of one, alone.
  10. Silent-Lynx

    Silent-Lynx Guest

    Mysticism sounds ideal to me...

    Almost all of the spells have a very low mana cost. Yes, imbuing might be required for some, but who's to say that without that skill your spells are still pretty good? For a five control slot creature, it has GOT to be worth casting.

    As for the tactics and anatomy concern, I think they're just trying to put in spells for a warrior template. I mean, it's really not that much mana and it could turn out to be really useful...

    Think of the positives though! A spell that heals, cures, and lifts curses in one swing!? This is perfect for those that don't have high resist and can now lift curses.

    Hail storm is the only way for a non-necro to do high cold damage and it has AoE. Plus, it didn't mention anything about damage being spread out. This could be better than the other chain spells that mages have.

    Purge magic removes beneficial buffs. This means pots can be negated. A HUGE boon to PvP.

    And lastly, bombard. Who wouldn't want a giant boulder to throw? :D (It's the only other spell besides earthquake I believe to deal physical dmg)

    I think that this new school of magic will be incredibly beneficial. Don't look a gift horse in the mouth, this will be AWESOME. I can't wait to put this on my necro spellweaver :)
  11. blueturtle

    blueturtle Lore Keeper
    Stratics Veteran

    Dec 8, 2007
    Likes Received:
    im gonna play with this tonight on the beta, but i want to try...

    120 mysticm
    120 magery
    120 eval
    100 necro
    100 ss
    60 med

    dunno where to dump the other 100 points tho
  12. Ailish

    Ailish Lore Master
    Stratics Veteran

    May 13, 2008
    Likes Received:
    Mysticism is DEFINITELY intended as a support skill, not a primary skill. The direct damage spells are not enough to really kill anything (the the rising collosus is a MAJOR meat shield). So if you already have a mage, you add mysticism and imbuing, say instead of necro and SS, and have a new template.

    If you have a Thrower, you add Mysticism and have a nice hybrid (mysticism gives modest damage bonuses to the throwing specials).
  13. Alezi

    Alezi Lore Keeper
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Sep 29, 2007
    Likes Received:
    Real Skill bonus With Skillbonus
    Mystic 120 0 120
    Evalint 120 0 120
    Resist 115 5 120
    Mage 105 15 120
    Scribe 100 0 100
    Anatomy 70 22 92
    Medi 90 10 100
    Total 720 772

    Was going to try a temp like that.. but have to see what spells are affected by imbuing.. If it's any major ones I say fook it!
  14. RichDC

    RichDC Guest

    I have one big concern about mysticism. Its not skill related as such, its spell related...that spell is spell trigger. Now i havent yet tested it(been too busy with imbing) but i see a mage necro mystic doing insane damage increadibly quickly.


    Now from what i undestand the mystic wont get full benefit damage wise but think of this combo.

    Painspike(and insta meteorswarm thing Mysticism spell from spell trigger)

    Thats pretty much anyone dead!
  15. Ailish

    Ailish Lore Master
    Stratics Veteran

    May 13, 2008
    Likes Received:
    You can only use Mysticism spells on Spell Trigger. Also, remember that the spell you are talking about (um, the insta-meteor swarm) is an area effect ... not the best choice in PvP most of the time.

    Let us know how that template goes, tho. There was only one PvP necro-mage testing the skill that I know of, so this particular template really needs looking over.
  16. RichDC

    RichDC Guest

    Maybe but lets be honest its massive damage and would make a great finisher! Flagging on another target with that kind of damage output wont matter much.

    If not that then why not finish it up with mass sleep trigger, or bombard trigger.

    Mass sleep would allow for a flamestrike to be cast, maybe even a exp fs i havent tested sleep yet.

    Bombard, deals high damage and could stun the opponent again allowing another finishing spell...if its needed after that dump!