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Shard populations

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Hawkke, Feb 9, 2017.

  1. The Craftsman

    The Craftsman Certifiable
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    You make it sound like low population shards are by design and that they are there to provide players with a choice. They are not. Low popluation shards are the by product of a declining playerbase and a slowly dying game. You can bet your bottom dollar that both EA and BS would love all of the shards packed to the gunwales with players as this means a sucessful MMO game. They wouldnt give two hoots about players wanting a deserted shard.
     
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  2. Thrakkar

    Thrakkar Certifiable
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    Pings to each AWS datacenter can be checked here for anyone, whoever might be interested:
    CloudPing.info
     
  3. petemage

    petemage Certifiable
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    Ouch. You just show how little you know about it :D That's not how it works.

    "Try tracing".. ok:
    Code:
    C:\Users\**>ping atlantic.owo.com
    
    Ping wird ausgeführt für atlantic.owo.com [107.23.95.234] mit 32 Bytes Daten:
    Antwort von 107.23.95.234: Bytes=32 Zeit=126ms TTL=46
    Antwort von 107.23.95.234: Bytes=32 Zeit=125ms TTL=46
    
    Ping-Statistik für 107.23.95.234:
    	Pakete: Gesendet = 2, Empfangen = 2, Verloren = 0
    	(0% Verlust),
    Ca. Zeitangaben in Millisek.:
    	Minimum = 125ms, Maximum = 126ms, Mittelwert = 125ms
    C:\Users\**>nslookup 107.23.95.234
    Server:  ****
    Address:  fe80::1
    
    Name:	ec2-107-23-95-234.compute-1.amazonaws.com
    Address:  107.23.95.234
    Here is a pretty good up-to-date list of the servers running the shards: Shard IP Addresses

    Always glad to help you out Frodo. But maybe you should learn to invest at least 5 minutes into truth checking the stuff that floats out of whatever you speak with ;)
     
  4. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Stratics Legend
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    Then why did UO personal have to go to Aust to set up their server, why did Amazon do it?
     
  5. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Stratics Legend
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    Lets use your own words
    :facepalm: The Cloud is everywhere, we should all be the same. Maybe you should learn to write better.
     
  6. petemage

    petemage Certifiable
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    @Lord Frodo Can't see any contradiction at all. Your definition of cloud is very vague.

    "The cloud" is not everywhere. It's just virtual server instances you rent. And they run on real hardware at some real place.

    For some people it seems so hard to admit they learned something new. But I'm still happy to help you man ;)
     
  7. Thrakkar

    Thrakkar Certifiable
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    Stop! Wait!
    You're trying to tell us the cloud isn't that magical, mystical entity which spans over time and space connecting all and everything?
    It is just a computer network, comprised of actual physical nodes?

    Wow, what a letdown...

    :shots:
     
  8. petemage

    petemage Certifiable
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    Was that .. .. sarcasm? o.0

    ;)
     
  9. Thrakkar

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    Ummmmm.... noooooooooooooooooooooooooo!
    I'm dead serious when it's about the cloud! (The cloud can hear us! So be careful!)
    I swear by the life of my dead grandmother!
    :gee:
     
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  10. Archnight

    Archnight Legendary Crusader
    Moderator Professional Wiki Editor Wiki Moderator Supporter Kingdom Reborn [2.0]

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  11. Riply

    Riply Lore Master
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    My comment was not meant as an open debate concerning the decline of the number players on the majority of the shards. That's very evident by just visiting the various shards, but bear in mind the sheer size of the game now as compared to 1997. By forcing players to be moved to another more active shard will reduce the player base even further. I'm all in favour of finding ways to create a larger player base, which with an older game such as UO is an uphill battle.
     
    #161 Riply, Feb 17, 2017
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2017
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  12. Prawn

    Prawn Seasoned Veteran
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    Man you guys are all nuts, of course its in the clouds! Cloud storage and serving is a combination of human ingenuity and the divine mysterious powers of our creator.

    Proof.

    [​IMG]
     
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  13. petemage

    petemage Certifiable
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    I'm sorry! I just wanted to point that fact out but then got dragged into some alternative facts :D
     
  14. Fridgster

    Fridgster Babbling Loonie
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    I invented the cloud years ago. We called it ftp back then :)
     
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  15. Spiritless

    Spiritless Sage
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    Relevant:

    [​IMG]
     
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  16. cazador

    cazador Grand Inquisitor
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    Man UO has some serious Professional Economists, Cloud Gurus, and Game Designers playing. Phew..and for a moment there I thought everyone was a fat nerd in moms basement chomping on some Orange Gold, and washing it down with the Dew.


    ....
     
  17. Herp!

    Herp! Journeyman

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    lel... you made me giggle irl and that's kinda hard nowadays. I only spent 3 or 4 years in software engineering(with a physics/comp sci degree of all things) while I finished my journeyman licensing for Electrician. I have never looked back to that job where I lived in a box for 8 hours a day, and never will. I spend my little amount of spare time doing 3D artwork/rendering and writing games to keep my knowledge of C# up or playing UO to keep my fun levels topped up, I'm no professional economist but I know how to make my money work for me because I have an accountant and lawyer in the family, and I hate the cloud and wish it never came about because it stores all my info to sell to everyone that wants it. I've also never met a single fat nerd living in their mum's basement that plays UO... Though I may just associate myself with better people than you.

    P.S. Chee-tos and Mountain Dew are disgusting.
     
  18. Fridgster

    Fridgster Babbling Loonie
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    Hey no need to get nasty about the cheetos and mt dew sir.
     
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  19. cazador

    cazador Grand Inquisitor
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    I wasn't actually calling anyone out, I'm more of the local troll that tries to induce laughter in a crowd of seriousness and stupidity. I'm not really the judge or the jury. I've admittedly been very disheartened with UO as of late due to what seems an incompetence on the part of the developers. Not only with content but with their MASSIVE fail in whatever the **** PvP balance was supposed to be...but I digress. UO as it was in past is in fact DEAD. They can never revive it, the community has moved on for varying reasons. Some for poor communication or disgraceful content. Some just due to other circumstances..i.e. Boredom, real life, better game whatever have you. It's just pathetic that I still pay for a game that is so utterly mismanaged it's pathetic...so now I live a life in the shadows trolling my past game-fellows and fellas. Sad sad times. Long live UO Pre-STUPID.

    "Raises my glass in hopes of Mesanna getting the boot and the game landing in a caring community members hands or someone with a sense who gives a fk about the game and not just about their in game M Animation and /kill command

    PS...Screw Cheetos! Orange Gold are those triangle cheesy babies of deliciousness! Or ranchy for the stuck up white girls with lattes and Uggs

    ....
     
  20. Herp!

    Herp! Journeyman

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    I know, I've seen it all, I sit around trollin when I can too :). You may recognize my name from the pvp balance threads lol. I miss the old days just as much as the next guy that remembers pvp back then, I made the bulk of the friends I play games with back then, I have watched a lot of them pass on irl... I agree that there is a problem lately with the coding and the bugs that slip through, but I cannot say I don't believe in them. I know they are trying as hard as they can because I talk to them. It's a very hard thing to do when you come in to an old program and have to add new things at the request of your bosses because the game needs to move forward. This game was written in C... not C++, not C#, but just C-Basic... barely anyone around knows Basic anymore, I am not sure that it is still in C but if it is, they have their hands full as hell. I only know a tiny bit of C-Basic and I went to school for this crap for 4 years from 12-8 years ago, I was ONLY taught C#. Not a single one of the devs I have spoken to has the mind to try and ruin this game, they are REALLY trying to make it better, it's just hard when people have been here for 20 years and we want what we used to have with the old massive dev team and original story writers. The reality is, Ultima as a franchise died well over a decade ago. The fact that this game is still running 20 years later shows me, personally, that there are just a lot of us who wanted to stay around because we made life long friends in this game, enjoy it no matter who is running it, or simply want to play because it's UO and we have a nostalgic feeling for the game and that the devs see us all here, recognize our love for the game, and want to give us new content to keep us happy.

    Again, I genuinely believe that the devs are here to serve us, the players that have been around and loved this game for ages. They screw up, but in the past 8 years that I've been back, I haven't seen em leave a bug unnoticed aside from the discordance on most bosses only doing 1.8%(seriously... fix it plz @Kyronix). Yes, there are balance issues in PvP and in PvM, but they are trying their best with what they have and know. The dev team is less than 1/4 of what it used to be, the artists and devs are all relatively new to the game, and I have actually seen some in game even, for those folks who seem to think they never play... I have seen devs at spawns, shadowguard, recent doom, and a few other places... they aren't just blindly giving us content like some people think.

    My hat does go off to you though, Cazador. I have seen you troll, but I have also seen you be an upstanding person and help people out. I've also had many a laugh at your posts, Stratics is my 2nd home now, I love the community here, I love the community in UO... Here's to 20 more years complaining that the devs are incompetent even though they are trying their best. I just filled the last beer out of my Sunday keg, Cheers to everyone in UO!
     
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  21. hungry4knowhow

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    I for one dream of the day that I can walk into my accountants office and explain to him that I will be making an offer on a decades old game, that probobly wont make much money but require a ton of work. And trying to justify it to my wife and other business partners.

    I don't know that I will get the sign off (though I usually do. My brand of ******** is very special lol) But I am DEFINITELY going to give it the old college try.
     
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  22. RockoNV

    RockoNV Seasoned Veteran
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    I have been away for a while so I don't know where you got the Messana info but an in game store is a very good indicator of FTP on-the-way. If you look at LOTRO and SWTOR the in game stores were the first steps.

    IMPORTANT NOTE: there has never, nor will there ever be PvP balance.
     
  23. Herp!

    Herp! Journeyman

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    It was totally balanced when I was 1 shotting people with my vanq axes on my old Lumberjack. And when I would disarm people and steal their weapon, or mandrake, or black pearl... the game was actually balanced pre aos because all of us were capable of killing anyone VERY fast if we wanted to & had the know how. Then they gave us nerf bats instead of swords and axes and from there it just got more and more unbalanced. Insurance broke pvp for good.

    Edit: because I realized people may read this as sarcasm, I am 100% serious.
     
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  24. Capt. Lucky

    Capt. Lucky Grand Inquisitor
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    There might not have been a direct plan to depopulate the shards but inactivity to address the problem is real. If everyone had access to shard shields or not have to pay 25 bucks or more to go to another shard and get back there would be no reason for a mass exodus of the shards. EA/BS greed, unreasonable vendor costs, not having auctions safes in vendor search, etc is why shards are dying and this is directly Broadsword's fault by not addressing it. I've gone through how this whole process works before in detail but if BS doesn't care why bother to go through it again.
     
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  25. hungry4knowhow

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    I think if you started giving shard transfers for free to everyone you would have ALOT of pissed off vets. Right here included.
     
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  26. cazador

    cazador Grand Inquisitor
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    Why?


    ....
     
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  27. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    Wouldn't piss me off at all... I've had a shield for every shard for well over a year now... Any idea how many and how often I use them??? Almost never. Know why??? First off there isn't anywhere I'd rather be than on my current shard... and no It ISN'T Atl... I don't go to Atl to sell crap and I don't much go there to buy anything either... far as I'm concerned they could lock that bloody shard and let it rot. I did go and send some stuff to a few shards to start tamers over there for awhile... but I oft times ask myself why... I have tons of characters on other shards... used to X-Shard trade when that was a thing...

    But now I've reached the point where even if I go to other shards to bring my gifts from them home... I've no place to put the junk... and just doesn't matter... there isn't anything or any better people or even more people really on other shards that could draw me from my home shard.

    I don't care what other players do... if they want to sell their crap for bloated prices to some idiot on Atl willing to pay some insane amount of gold for it.... good for them... some people have more gold than sense... I'd give up every bit of gold on all my accounts to have the game back to being fun.. I'd give up all the silly "rare" crap just to have the game back the way it was... and I don't mean Pre-Tram... I mean pre-greed... the last 5 or 10 years have just been a massive downhill slide IMO...

    That said there have been a few good things... Really like the Elves... don't like much of the art for them..... think it sucks. Especially most the walls and such that are "cut" they look like crap... Did like the Peerless they were fun... Really like the High Seas... wish turning Pirates in could be done in Jhelom instead of on that silly dock 900 miles from anywhere... If anything that Dock should have been off Jhelom anyway... Really enjoyed the Kingdom Reborn... Love the Gargoyles and the Abyss was fun until they put those stupid hard gargoyles in it and ruined that... Don't like the fact that you can't alter things back from Gargoyle... I like the Governor stuff... however it really doesn't do much for community... had good promise at first... but that died quickly... Like the EM Events but the advent of "drops" has ruined them... they were better when we supposedly weren't getting any and it was more about the story and the adventure... Don't like ANY of the changes to the dungeons, Wrong, Shame, Covetous or Despise... wish they were put back the way they were... Eodon is ok... but grindy... I'd rather have less bugs and more fixes and perhaps some sort of global events that last not events that are only done once a week if you happen to be there... I hate that it's become about roving from shard to shard doing the events on every shard just to get the shinny and sell it... and F everyone else... just really hate what the game has become... and the art of late is awful... for every decent looking piece there are 10 hideous ones that look like something out of a cartoon... some of it is lovely I'll admit... really love some of the wedding stuff..... but the way it's forced into one choice stinks and leaves a bad taste in my mouth...
     
  28. Uvtha

    Uvtha Stratics Legend
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    But I don't want one. :p
     
  29. Uvtha

    Uvtha Stratics Legend
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    I have to back him up on this one, ollllld school bard was casual as ****. Back before a fairly major bard overhaul there were no difficulty levels on creatures, and your provo was just your chance to succeed at 100 music. So people were making new characters, 50/50 music provo, music you could GM by setting a stack of quarters on a button for a day (or less because it shot up) then head to destard and have a 50% chance to provoke dragons which at the time were pretty high end, on each other, then run off to safty because there was no LOS. Destart was pretty much constantly filled with dragon fights.

    Took little to no player skill, little to no time or effort invested in creating the character, and was easily the most profitable build at the time, second to what... casting blade spirits at hythloth balrons that were stuck behind a wall because they couldn't path find? Of course this is why it got "nerfed" to give provo a difficulty. I recall players being up in arms about the "nerf" as well, heh.
     
  30. Uvtha

    Uvtha Stratics Legend
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    Well, I mean they are a new player. They don't even know what the game is about let alone what would constitute the kind of shard they want to play. Most people play an online game expecting to interact with others. I could see it being a big instant turn off if you logged on and saw no one for hours.

    I'm not for a shard merger or anything, but I can see how low pops hurt the game in both perception and function.
     
  31. Uvtha

    Uvtha Stratics Legend
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    What's orange gold? I'm intrigued. NM cheetos, I get it. For some reason it made me think of those chocolate oranges you can get on the holidays. :p
     
  32. hungry4knowhow

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    I get you have your playstyle, you don't like ATL, you don't want to go anywhere but where you are.... That's great. That's one playstyle. And in that respect shard transfers whether free or not do not affect you.

    I did not say it would piss EVERY vet off. I said it would piss a lot of vets off.

    I don't have a problem with your playstyle. I enjoy playing multiple shards, Atlantic included.
     
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  33. Capt. Lucky

    Capt. Lucky Grand Inquisitor
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    Well they can be pissed. I put up with, and keep my mouth shut, about a lot of things I think are highly unfair. Because I know while it's not the best thing for me, it's the best thing to keep the game alive. Shard shields for all would probably hurt me quite a bit. I make a decent amount of gold wandering the shards and picking up bargains to sell on Legends. But it's not really that important what I got going on if the game continues to bleed players and there's no game here to play. We as players really need to stop being self centered about everything and make what concessions we can if it's for the betterment of the game as a whole.
     
    #183 Capt. Lucky, Feb 21, 2017
    Last edited: Feb 21, 2017
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  34. hungry4knowhow

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    I get where you are coming from Capt. Lucky, but do you *honestly* think giving free shard transfers is going to stop the bleeding? I mean honestly, if someone wants one they can buy one($15? in store right?) or just hop on another shard and start training....it doesn't take that long compared to days gone by to train a character...

    I don't see how what amounts to removing a week worth of training from the game is suddenly going to stop the bleeding.

    If the stuff is so important that they need to bring it with them, again there is the $15 token OR there are PLENTY of vets who are more than willing to move a persons stuff for free.

    I just don't see how taking away something they specifically gave to longstanding vet accounts is going to do anything but cause more bleeding.
     
  35. Capt. Lucky

    Capt. Lucky Grand Inquisitor
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    I know you don't get it. That's fine. I think most do.
     
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  36. hungry4knowhow

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    I'm just trying to have a civilized discussion. People get so heated over a video game.

    Why do you think offering free shard transfers to all is going to help the game stay open? Honest question, not looking to get into a flame war or a pissing match. I truly enjoy talking about the economies (meta and otherwise) of mmos.
     
  37. Capt. Lucky

    Capt. Lucky Grand Inquisitor
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    I'm not in any way "heated" lol. I just I'd rather not start posting "books" again to explain the obvious as I have in the past. The point of the posting is not about just the game staying open but shard populations being the topic. Naturally it's all connected. It's about having happy populations, many of whom wouldn't move to Atlantic for any amount of gold, and seeing them successful and happy. When a shard is no longer viable for several factors and Atlantic is not an option then we lose another player. Can't get the things you need, no one to hunt with, etc etc. I don't think you qualify as the average UO player so I don't think you get it or are likely too. Or if you do get it your just gonna argue a self serving perspective. I really just don' t want to have this conversation with you personally, but I'm sure you can find my feelings on this topic in my older posts.
     
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  38. Uriah Heep

    Uriah Heep Grand Poobah
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    I think they should remove the age limits off all rewards. Seriously, I can see how it would be so discouraging to medium aged and newer players to look down the road and think "It's gonna be 6 more years fore I can have that". Not gonna get the "we won't be here 6 yrs from now debate going", but being fully involved and feeling just as valuable as everyone else might, just might, make a newer player appreciate the game more and stay longer, even if not forever.
     
  39. BeaIank

    BeaIank Crazed Zealot
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    YES! Make ore carts and tree stump 2nd or 3rd year vet rewards. :p
    I don't even know if I will be still walking around this earth in 5 years when my oldest account will be old enough to claim new ore carts. :D
     
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  40. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    Really every time I hear that term I think of Mac and cheese.... probably because of those ridiculous commercials.
     
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  41. hungry4knowhow

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    Ok, i can get behind this thinking. Im not filly behind it because while i think you are right on the new account/middle aged, on the flip side you have many vets who will suddenly feel betrayed for their loyalty.

    Dont get me wrong, it does no one any good for this game to close, we all want to play. So no, im not here to be self serving and greedy vet.

    But im also not here to say, yes lets cater to all of this side, while ostracising most of another side.

    Im in the middle?
    Anyway, great point @uriah
     
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  42. Uriah Heep

    Uriah Heep Grand Poobah
    Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend

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    You should run for public office... :p

    But yeah, if tomorrow the whole world got a shard shield, it wouldn't impact my gameplay any. And it shouldn't impact the vast majority of the players gameplay. And it would certainly make multi-sshardd player run events a much easier to do thing. The main negative, I think, is that there are a very powerful few that oppose it, and they tend to have the developers ear most of the time.

    Just imagine tho, if a 1 year player had a shield or two, and could go to another shard for the rares fest, or some huge event. I actually think it would benefit the smaller shards
     
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  43. Herp!

    Herp! Journeyman

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    I'd kill to not have to wait 3 more years to see a shard shield, not because I want to leave... I just know that I can buy more rares on other shards & I could actually go to some of the auctions & silent auctions like we used to have on Legends in the house/casino in E Britain(been a while... it burned down, yeah?). I could also sell the horde of pvp weapons I just have laying about to all those lovely people on Atl :).. I don't want to pay $15 to leave for a week and then spend 70m in game or $15 more to come home, no matter how much cool stuff I get.

    Here's an idea, give us open availability on ALL vet rewards once they are 2 years old or something, i.e. the new 20 yr vet rewards this year would require waiting til 22 yr were released to acquire for newer accounts. Keeps the super vets that never closed their accounts happy & makes us lesser people who had to close their accounts at a point or simply started late, a lot happier. Then add a donate button to the account management page, wiki, uostore, and anywhere else Broadsword wants/sees fit. I support things I love via donation. Donations are considered charity & as a result I can write them off after a certain point... I do not care that I already pay 10 bucks a month per account I have, I'll happily donate more to a cause I support known as keeping UO alive & the devs sitting on a quality paycheck with bonuses(bonuses make people work harder). I'm sure the donate button would rarely be used by a large amount of the population, but I know of at least 2 people, including myself, that would not mind putting a few 1000 in Broadsword's pocket a year and getting near 80% of it back at the end of the year in my tax return.

    Edit:
    In order to get the full 80% they would have to make UO a NPO & pay every dime they made to the devs and in to making the game better. This is avoidable by simply making an account for the game and liquidating it yearly to pay people bonuses, pay the CEO WAY more, etc. NPO just means that none of the profits surpass 1 year in the account.
     
  44. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Stratics Legend
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

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    If anybody could get shard shields then why would anybody buy a Xfer Token, ever. What would you propose giving the Vets that supported this game all those years in compensation. If it were not for those long running Vets I doubt very much we would be having this conversation as UO would have shut down a long time ago and while we are at it if you are proposing this for Shard Shields then every reward should be a 1 year reward and UO would need to implement a Vet Reward Turn-in system on a one to one reward for the first 6 months then make it a 2-1 or even a 4-1. I understand that there are people that are pissed because they have to wait for Shard Shields but we tghe players did not introduce them, the DEVs did so pleaqse stop being mad at the players that have them, it is not our fault but then I guess you would ask us not to pick them too.
     
  45. Herp!

    Herp! Journeyman

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    I just stated a very decent way for them to completely 86 the need for xfer tokens at all... I would propose that the vets have access to things for 2 years before anyone else & older accounts already get more vet rewards per year aside from the first year.

    As for the game shutting down long ago if the almost 20 yr vets didn't exist... I doubt it highly. I know plenty of people that started between 1 and 18 years ago & pay for multiple accounts that haven't closed in ages and some that have left and come back countless times. Yes, your 20 year account is helpful, you paid a tiny amount of money for 20 years, congratulations. The game very likely costs more in upkeep than all the 19-20 yr accounts combined pay monthly(including paychecks, rent, power, etc) Unless you seem to think that there are still 1000+ vets at that age. I respect every single person who has had the money, time, and care to keep their UO account open that long, but to think you guys alone have saved this game is just asinine.
     
  46. n00bPvper

    n00bPvper Journeyman

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    Just put everyone on Siege Perilous and make UO great again...
     
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  47. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
    Governor Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend Campaign Supporter Royal Knight

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    Well they did open it up so anyone can place a house there as well as have one on a regular shard.
     
  48. cazador

    cazador Grand Inquisitor
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    Well shard shields should be available to all years. However!! I think that there should be a first year reward for Shard travel Orbs. They are usable once every 3 months and don't give out physical tokens. They work the same..don't create physical tokens and yeah.


    ....
     
  49. Old Vet Back Again

    Old Vet Back Again Certifiable

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    I can absolutely get behind no age limit on vet rewards. With all the revamps coming into play, the devs need to start taking a hard look at merging dungeons or even potentially new content. I strongly believe people have forgotten what it's like to encounter people out hunting. For every dbag out there that trolls/griefs there has to be at least 5 people that don't. Some people might get revitalized being able to run around hunting and seeing another player or two doing the same thing. That's how guilds are formed and bonds are made. Best part about it is you can always go back home to your server you are so fond of.
     
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  50. Ancient Sosarian

    Ancient Sosarian Journeyman
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    [Reply] I may agree to Shard Merges IF the fuller shards had to relocate to the lower population shards. However I doubt most on higher active populated shards would agree to that.
     
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