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[Imbuing] Training Imbuing - unravel mob drops individually, or en mass via container?

Discussion in 'UO Craftsman' started by Nematode, May 30, 2010.

  1. Nematode

    Nematode Guest

    Im beginning to start unraveling those thousands of drops, mostly from named mobs and peerlesses, and noticed that sometimes, Id be unraveling 80-odd items in a container without any gains, and at times, Ill gain off a single item.

    For you guys who have already 'made it', can you share your experience with this? Is the science/algorithm/mechanics behind unraveling items in containers solidly in place, or would I get better gains off unraveling individual items, one by one?

  2. I don't know the calculations behind this, but I do remember that there is a better chance to gain unravelling multiple items in a bag rather than one at a time. I gained twice while unravelling about 40 items at 118+ skill, and I did not gain a single time unravelling one at a time anything over 110 skill. I don't honestly know if this is just the RNG.

    Just a suggestion, break it down to 20 to 40 items per bag to increase the number of times you are unravelling multiple items.
  3. My rule is I never unravel more than I can carry.
  4. Lorax_Pacific

    Lorax_Pacific Lore Master
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Sep 1, 2006
    Likes Received:
    It doesn't matter according to the developers. I think the information is in a release note when they changed the unravel bags to unravel any container.

    Your case is likely dependant on the a random loot intensity difference between trials. To make the judgment alluded you would have to unravel the same items repeatedly. The next factor is the gains have a randomness and even if you made five bags of 100 items each with the same intensity you shouldn't get the exact same result from each trial.

    From my experience there is no gain difference, but the unravel container is easier.

  5. Basara

    Basara UO Forum Moderator
    Moderator Professional Governor Stratics Veteran Wiki Moderator Stratics Legend Campaign Supporter

    Jul 16, 2003
    Likes Received:
    There's also the fact that the RNG has a flaw that causes short-term streaks of similar numbers (but at any point in the rage, so the various streaks theoretically balance out).

    Any of the automated multi-skill gains (imbuing unravel with a container, cooking a huge stack of fish steaks, etc.) therefore can benefit greatly if they coincide with a streaking result range that qualifies for skill gain. And, given the likelihood of no gain even from a bagful of items, without the streaks being considered, lucking into a streak of 3, 4, 5 or more gains from a bag will be worth attempting.

    To use a probability & statistics example, heavily over-simplified,

    A short streak of negative results in an experiment with a very small chance of a positive result, would be indistinguishable from normal gaps between positive results, except in scales that would far exceed the population samples are drawn from - and then only if the positive results weren't subject to the same streaks.

    On the other hand, streaks of positive results in similar short bursts would be massive outliers on the probability curve if the generator was actually "fair", and having them occur consistantly provides evidence of streaking, as well as holding potential to dramatically shortening the time needed to reach "x" successes.

    So, going for 100 skill gains, with a theoretical (without streaks) gain rate of 1 every 50 items, it should take you about 5000 items. At such a low chance of success, even if you DID hit a streak of a really bad result, the streak lasts much shorter than normally, common, random gaps between gains, and there would be no appreciable difference (it might show up if you had to do a million attempts, but you're only doing about 5000). HOWEVER, a streak that is to your benefit is WELL outside the normal distribution range, and therefore have the potential to knock several hundred attempts off the length of your training regimen. The lower the chance of success, the less likely it is for a bad streak to even be apparent(!), and the more positive effect that a good streak will have.

    So, do unravel stuff by the bag - but make sure the bags all have quality stuff if doing it to train. You may not actually GET a streak hit in your favor - but even one so throws off the normal distribution curve that the chance is worth it.
  6. Nematode

    Nematode Guest

    Hehe thx for the analysis, Basara. Glad to know ure on LA, btw.

    Ive managed to reach 71 from unraveling, got about 12K residues... Ill be starting the imbuing process, hands are numb from looting!

    Thx again, guys!